zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 You are still able to receive sensory experience during NDE. How? I don't know what the mechanism is, but I can tell you that sensory input does get through to you in an NDE state. In clinical death, the person is not breathing and has no heartbeat. Still, I know that some sensory information is getting through to their consciousness despite the fact that other body systems are shut downHow do I know it wasn't life after death? The state of NDE is entirely closed off within your consciousness. Because of how mine happened (not going through physiological trauma) I was able to experience the transition of my internal consciousness into and out of the NDE state. Because of this connection, this continuity of my state into and out of NDE, I know that everything in that state exists only within the conscious mind of the experiencerInteresting story, but Pam Reynolds had NO BRAIN FUNCTION. How does someone with no brain function see and hear? Link to post Share on other sites
chrisuk_sw 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Interesting story, but Pam Reynolds had NO BRAIN FUNCTION. How does someone with no brain function see and hear?Her life signs were lowered to a point where a person measuring them would get no reading, but internally, her mind was still functioning, albeit in a very altered state. She was still receiving sensory input. I have seen my body below me while I floated above myself. I actually saw it, and from within my own mind.I doubt you'll get a decent description of the mechanics of this - I've not read a satisfactory theory on how consciousness works. It may sound unbelievable but I know that it's possible because I know exactly what it feels like. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 How does someone with no brain function see and hear?i dunno, you tell us. you're an expert at that. Link to post Share on other sites
uahphysics 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 okay.wow.I'm a Christian and even I think this thread is ridiculous. zzz: No matter how hard you try, you will never be able to prove your case. There is no evidence of life after death. Think about it, if there was some hard evidence for life after death, why would there still be so many atheists? Do I believe in life after death? Sure I do, but to claim that there is evidence for it is just stupid. I used to wonder why so many people disliked Christians, and tried to prove them wrong every waking moment. Personally, I very much keep to myself with my beliefs, I just try to live my life the best way I can and follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. I don't claim to know everything about the Bible, or God, or the Universe, but I have my own beliefs and I'm okay with that. I can certainly see now why some people would be so adamant about disproving if you keep encountering people like zzz. Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Her life signs were lowered to a point where a person measuring them would get no reading, but internally, her mind was still functioning, albeit in a very altered state.So you are saying you don't need eyes to see and ears to hear? Lol, you really believe that? The part of the brain responsible for seeing and hearing WASN"T WORKING. Science has been unable to show consciousness and the mind is contained within the brain, in fact, it is beginning to prove the opposite to be true. Have a nice day!i dunno, you tell us. you're an expert at that.Answer: You can'tokay.wow.I'm a Christian and even I think this thread is ridiculous. zzz: No matter how hard you try, you will never be able to prove your case . There is no evidence of life after death . Think about it, if there was some hard evidence for life after death, why would there still be so many atheists? Do I believe in life after death? Sure I do, but to claim that there is evidence for it is just stupid. I certaintly proved it beyond a reasonable doubt.Lol, That is the most ignorant statement you could possible make.Not sure but I think some atheists believe in life after death even if they don't believe in "God". To answer your question, it is ignorance and a closed mind that are holding them back.How ironic! Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
WrongWay 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Not sure but I think some atheists believe in life after death even if they don't believe in "God".There are a TON of religions that don't have a God but believe in an afterlife. Buddhism, Daoism, paganism, hinduism.... Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 There are a TON of religions that don't have a God but believe in an afterlife. Buddhism, Daoism, paganism, hinduism....I take it you have seen the light. Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
WrongWay 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 I take it you have seen the light. Have a nice day!Yes. I have seen that light that all religion is people projecting their own desires onto reality. Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Yes. I have seen that light that all religion is people projecting their own desires onto reality.Haven't heard from you in awhile. You used to say NDEs were a result of hallucinations. Still believe that? Has your ignorance lessened?Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
solderz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 So zzz, you believe in life after death, but do not believe in ethics? You have attacked almost everyone on this thread and tried (poorly) to belittle people and make them feel small. So, if I can summarize, you definetly believe in life after death, but think there is no judgment? Because if there is judgment, you will be sent below. Enjoying others misery usually isn't a behavior that any religion proselitizes, but maybe you are a satanist and want to go to hell. Not sure. Just trying to figure out what you could possibly be trying to achieve other than being an *******. Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 So zzz, you believe in life after death, but do not believe in ethics? You have attacked almost everyone on this thread and tried (poorly) to belittle people and make them feel small. So, if I can summarize, you definetly believe in life after death, but think there is no judgment? Because if there is judgment, you will be sent below. Enjoying others misery usually isn't a behavior that any religion proselitizes, but maybe you are a satanist and want to go to hell. Not sure. Just trying to figure out what you could possibly be trying to achieve other than being an *******.Lol, the truth hurts sometimes. Only extremely ignorant people get upset so easily. If you find yourself upset, it is an opportunity to overcome your negative thoughts and thus acheive spiritual growth. Therefore, getting upset is indeed a good thing because at the end of the day it strengthens you. Someday, open-mindedness will prevail. Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Lol, the truth hurts sometimes. Only extremely ignorant people get upset so easily. If you find yourself upset, it is an opportunity to overcome your negative thoughts and thus acheive spiritual growth. Therefore, getting upset is indeed a good thing because at the end of the day it strengthens you. Someday, open-mindedness will prevail. Have a nice day!sounds like bush trying to justify iraq Link to post Share on other sites
solderz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Still an *** hole. And I am in no way upset. I play cards. I have thick skin. Still doesn't mean I like seeing a bully being a *****. How do you say open-mindedness will prevail when, at least on this subject, you have a mind that is closed like a bear trap? Oh well. you can't polish a turd, so I'll stop with you. Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 Still an *** hole. And I am in no way upset. I play cards. I have thick skin. Still doesn't mean I like seeing a bully being a *****. How do you say open-mindedness will prevail when, at least on this subject, you have a mind that is closed like a bear trap? Oh well. you can't polish a turd, so I'll stop with you.Lol, I think you could use a nap. Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
brvheart 1,755 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Did you even read my post? I never said I don't believe you. I said why does it matter? What are you gaining by knowing that someone in rare cases can be 'clinically dead', but not really dead. It proves nothing, except that you are trying to prove something that is COMPLETELY meaningless. That statement shows how ignorant and close minded you really are. Have a nice day!You still haven't answered my question! Is this because there is no point to your argument? Link to post Share on other sites
chrisuk_sw 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 So you are saying you don't need eyes to see and ears to hear? Lol, you really believe that? The part of the brain responsible for seeing and hearing WASN"T WORKING. Science has been unable to show consciousness and the mind is contained within the brain, in fact, it is beginning to prove the opposite to be true. Have a nice day!During my NDE, I experienced synaesthesia. Pam Reynolds was still receiving sensory input in some form, that is obvious from what she said afterwards, and evident from my own experiences. This is less to do with her brain function, it is everything to do with (the less well-defined) mind function. I agree with you that science has an inadequate model of the mind's function. But I can say with complete certainty that the NDE experience is wholely contained within the mind. The out of body experience, the tunnel of light, the brain dump, its all the wholely contained product of a single mind's work. I've seen them, I've felt them and I know what they are. They are not life after death. Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 You still haven't answered my question! Is this because there is no point to your argument?Lol, You believe it is completely meaningless. That is merely a negative opinion which shows ignorance (sorry if my bluntness offends you). I think scientific evidence showing life after death is not meaningless. Also, why does it matter? It might not matter to you. For me and many others, listening to NDEers helps answer questions like: Why are we here? Are we eternal? What happens when we die? Are we judged? Most all NDEers have gained knowledge, and reading their accounts gives you the opportunity for deeper understanding about life and thus gives you the tools on how to become a happier person. Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
brvheart 1,755 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Lol, You believe it is completely meaningless. That is merely a negative opinion which shows ignorance (sorry if my bluntness offends you). I think scientific evidence showing life after death is not meaningless. Also, why does it matter? It might not matter to you. For me and many others, listening to NDEers helps answer questions like: Why are we here? Are we eternal? What happens when we die? Are we judged? Most all NDEers have gained knowledge, and reading their accounts gives you the opportunity for deeper understanding about life and thus gives you the tools on how to become a happier person. Have a nice day!Thanks for finally answering my question. Third times a charm. This was my mistake, I was under the assumption that you were a Christian. I completely understand why this would be important info to a non-Christian, so carry on. Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 During my NDE, I experienced synaesthesia. Pam Reynolds was still receiving sensory input in some form , that is obvious from what she said afterwards, and evident from my own experiences. This is less to do with her brain function, it is everything to do with (the less well-defined) mind function. I agree with you that science has an inadequate model of the mind's function. But I can say with complete certainty that the NDE experience is wholely contained within the mind. The out of body experience, the tunnel of light, the brain dump, its all the wholely contained product of a single mind's work. I've seen them, I've felt them and I know what they are. They are not life after death.Pam was physically incapable of hearing and seeing. Even when people hallucinate it registers on the EEG, yet she saw and heard things that were later verified.However, you can't say with complete certainty that the mind dies with the brain. How do you know the mind dies when the brain dies? There is strong evidence, like in this case, showing otherwise. Have a nice day!Thanks for finally answering my question. Third times a charm. This was my mistake, I was under the assumption that you were a Christian. I completely understand why this would be important info to a non-Christian, so carry on.It would be good for a Christian to know the information brought back by NDEers as well. Such as the contradiction of God is love and God condemns. Most all NDEers agree that there is no judging, condemning God. Link to post Share on other sites
mrdannyg 274 Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 i'm now about 75% sure zzz is a joke account.have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 7, 2006 Author Share Posted November 7, 2006 i'm now about 75% sure zzz is a joke account.have a nice day!I am 100% sure you are wrong again! Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
chrisuk_sw 0 Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 It would be good for a Christian to know the information brought back those NDEers who agree with me and whose experience I can cherry pick from interviews because I cannot talk to them. For other NDEers who don't agree with me and happen to be posting here, well, I'm just going to put my fingers in my ears and go la-la-la.FYP Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 8, 2006 Author Share Posted November 8, 2006 FYPLOLAgain, How do you know the mind dies when the brain dies? There is strong evidence, like in the Reynolds case, showing otherwise. Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
chrisuk_sw 0 Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 I don't know whether the mind dies when the brain dies or whatever. Whatever was being measured in Pam Reynolds' case was not her conscious self. What I do know, for sure, is that an NDE is a conscious, sensing experience and not evidence of life after death Link to post Share on other sites
zzz 0 Posted November 8, 2006 Author Share Posted November 8, 2006 I don't know whether the mind dies when the brain dies or whatever. Whatever was being measured in Pam Reynolds' case was not her conscious self. What I do know, for sure, is that an NDE is a conscious, sensing experience and not evidence of life after deathIt is evidence when all physical signs point to physical death. Have a nice day! Link to post Share on other sites
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