108 Sooted From The Sb

[rusmac31 0]

$50 NL on Party 6 handedVillian has $25, Hero has $453 tabling...no readsHero dealt 10c8c in the SBfold, call, fold, call, Hero completes, Villian checksPot: $2Flop: 9c7s4dHero bets $1, Villian raises to $4, fold, fold, Hero callsPot: $10Turn: AcHero checks, Villian bets $5.40, Hero bets $30 (putting Villian all-in)My logic:Preflop: .25 to see cheap flop with 4 people, I complete this 100% of the time with sooted 1 gap connectors but would fold it too a raise.Flop: cheap bet thinking the flop probably didn't help anyone and I have a decent draw. When he re-raised, I figured I was getting 2.3 - 1, not enough to just see the turn, but if I hit my straight it would be concealed and I could get the rest of his stack if the turn bricks I'd check/foldTurn: I figured I had a big draw and I could check raise, getting him to fold or if he called I had major outs.questions: Do you lead the flop or check call (assuming you can draw cheaply)? or do you check/raise the flop? After I bet, do you fold to the re-raise? On the turn, is it better to just push? more fold equity? Is their enough fold equity to come over the top on turn?I'd appreciate any feedback...Regards

[MasterLJ 0]

I don't like it.He's giving you a fantastic price to hit your OESFD on the turn, take it. He's shown that he likes his hand so our fold equity is fairly low. Pushing gives you %Fold_Equity + %Hit_Draw. Since our fold equity is at or near 0%, we only have the chance of hitting our draw but then we get a chance at working on those implied odds by getting a nice bet from our opponent on the river.

[tapeworm 0]

Since our fold equity is at or near 0%

Dude....have you found the all-calling station site? I am confused how you repeatedly look at hands and say there is 0% folding equity. Being 6max, our weak flop lead, his weak turn bet, a possible scare card coming on the turn, etc. there is definitely folding equity. Ok...now...maybe calling is better, given our odds, but I don't get all your 0% folding equity responses.

questions: Do you lead the flop or check call (assuming you can draw cheaply)? or do you check/raise the flop? After I bet, do you fold to the re-raise? On the turn, is it better to just push? more fold equity? Is their enough fold equity to come over the top on turn?

Flop: - If you lead, I would lead bigger hoping everyone missed trying to take it down. I think I check-call more often though because I can either a) get a free draw, or b) get a cheap draw giving myself larger implied odds. Also, its not a scary flop, so random overcards might call you. I do sometiems lead this, but only when I think my table is tight enough that people will fold. An advantage of leading though is that you have identified tahtthe villain likes his hand, increasing your chances of being paid off.- I wouldn't check-raise here, but I see people do that sometimes with draws to throw people off and represent more strength hoping to take it down on the turn. Your str8 draw is concealed so no reason to throw people off, and the pot is small, so no reason to get fancy. Also, you don't have a very strong draw(yet)- I call the raise. I enjoy sucking out on people and like you said you have a concealed draw.Turn- Your push is good, but I like check-call better. I think with the Ace coming out(as opposed to a small club) you have some folding equity. He could a raised you with TP and is now scared. But I would sometimes push this and sometimes call, depending on my read of how weak my opponent is. He will fold one pair enough teims, but will not fold 2pair or better. Pushing has a benefit of putting overall fear in your opponent that when you check, you could be check-raising all-in so he is going to bluff less, etc. Playing passive makes him think he is in charge...and psychology should not be ignored.- Is there enough fold equity?. MasterLJ seems to think there is 0, but I think there is more than that. Being lowlimit though I think your fold equity is less than you think, so I agree with MasterLJ that a check-call pays off better here. Your flush/str8 is concealed so nones folding two pair or better, if you hit. He is giving you REALLY good odds, etc. The only problem is that if he is actaully scared of the Ace, he might not pay off your river bet when you hit, but with the odds he is giving you, you do not need to get payed off. Personally, I do think there is "enough" folding equity to make pushing a viable play.Summary...I would probably cehck-call flop. check call turn, bet/fold river.....not too exciting I know...its much more fun shoving your chips in there...isn't it? I'll tell you what though...hitting runner runner clubs is a lot of fun too...cause the guy will ***** for 10 minutes.

[goose 0]

i like to ote ote ote, opples and bononos.

[DrZebra 0]

$50 NL on Party 6 handed3 tabling...no readsI'd appreciate any feedback...Regards

This cracks me up...If you can't 3-table and read, move down to two tables.

[Blink20 0]

PUSH PUSH PUSH PUSHScrew check/ calling ,that system will get you no where six max.I completely revamped my game the last couple months and I can say with complete confidence that people play far to weak postflop. Once you start playing your hands aggressively and pushing with your big draws, your opponents get to scared to make plays at pots with you in them so you pick up more money, and you also get the benefit of getting paid off on your sets and overpairs because they believe you to be pushing a flush or straight draw.Leading this flop is good play.I usually play this hand like you did on the flop, lead/ call. Then the turn you pick up monster draw on a scare card. I would most likely make a PSB right into the villian, if he pushes all in, depending on stack sizes, all you need to do is look at the size of the pot and the size of his push to determine whether you can call, thats the easy math.If he just calls the turn and you miss the river, then it all comes down to what you think he has. Sometimes you can lead the river again with nothing if you feel he was on a draw. IE, I just had a hand today, 9 2 spades sb, six max, flop flush draw, lead, two calls, lead the turn, one call the next guy types in how big your kicker and folds, river bricks out, by now built up a decent pot, draw heavy flop everything miss, easy cheap bluff b/c he can't call if he missed, so i lead he folds instantly. Obviously its not always a fairy tail ending and sometimes you get the call, but you dont need to risk too much on river bet when u have them on a draw and if they call its always good for image.The key to this game is aggression, not mindless but controlled ofcourse.

[David_Nicoson 1]

$50 NL on Party 6 handedVillian has $25, Hero has $453 tabling...no readsHero dealt 10c8c in the SBfold, call, fold, call, Hero completes, Villian checksPot: $2Flop: 9c7s4dHero bets $1, Villian raises to $4, fold, fold, Hero callsPot: $10Turn: AcHero checks, Villian bets $5.40, Hero bets $30 (putting Villian all-in)My logic:Preflop: .25 to see cheap flop with 4 people, I complete this 100% of the time with sooted 1 gap connectors but would fold it too a raise.Flop: cheap bet thinking the flop probably didn't help anyone and I have a decent draw. When he re-raised, I figured I was getting 2.3 - 1, not enough to just see the turn, but if I hit my straight it would be concealed and I could get the rest of his stack if the turn bricks I'd check/foldTurn: I figured I had a big draw and I could check raise, getting him to fold or if he called I had major outs.questions: Do you lead the flop or check call (assuming you can draw cheaply)? or do you check/raise the flop? After I bet, do you fold to the re-raise? On the turn, is it better to just push? more fold equity? Is their enough fold equity to come over the top on turn?I'd appreciate any feedback...Regards

I like this whole line. If I have position I probably just draw for cheap on the turn. Out of position, I play it just as you did.

[tapeworm 0]

you also get the benefit of getting paid off on your sets and overpairs because they believe you to be pushing a flush or straight draw.

This is one of the keys for the "Push" argument and I just wanted to highlight it as I forgot to mention it in my lengthy post. When we assume poor/unsophistacated opponents, check calling often works better, but in general it is a good idea to open up your game and push with a wide variety of hands in order to induce good players to make bad calls. I think thinking about differnt ways to accomplish this is key as you move higher and higher in limits.