Why Do Atheists Even Care?

[herokid7 0]

This is a question that completely confounds me. I just can't fathom why atheists argue with Christians so hard that there is no God. What's the big deal to them if we believe in a God? If we're wrong, FINE, I die, I'll rot, peacefully and quietly, HECK, I'll enjoy it. But, if they're wrong.....oooh, buddy, somebody's got some explaining to do, but that's not my point. You see, I understand why Christians argue like we do, we care about people. We want to see people happy. We want people to go to Heaven. Plus, Jesus commanded us to argue on behalf of Him. (By argue on behalf of Him, I mean witness and evangelize.) So I know why I do it, but why do atheists? Just because they want to be right? Just to try and convince us that we are stupid? Just for meanness sake, to try and hurt ourfeelings?(If it's that one that's pretty pointless, since Christians believe that we're gonna win anyway.) I think the most common answer I'll get is "You Christians are so self-centered you think your way is the only way! How dare you tell me what to do!" Well, we're not self-centered because if we were we wouldn't be telling anybody about our beliefs, we'd wanna keep it all to ourselves. So there goes that argument. I think that atheists argue so hard because, they know that if we are right, then that means they do have to live a certain way, they can't do a lot of the things they like, and deep down they know they are doing wrong and they don't want to feel bad about doing it. They don't want to believe in God because they know there'll be judgement and they don't want judgement because they know there'll be punishment. So it's easier to just not believe. That is why they argue.

[AlphaOmega 0]

Atheists generally don't care, and I love it when Christians use this argument. You would be surprised how inert the atheists are when they are not involved in these discussions. Many will never bring up their personal beliefs, while Christians will wear it on their sleeve.Most of us don't like to be judged, something that Christians are well known for. Call me crazy, but I do get kind of defensive and argumentative when someone says that I'm going to hell for not believing in Christ.Other than that most are fine with a constructive discussion on the issue, no different than a discussion on sports or politics. Religion is just an interesting topic to discuss.You also lump all atheists into one group, assuming all have the same motivation for arguing. Do you see why that makes you look silly?I could assume that Christians vigorously argue the subject because they are scared that there actually isn't a God, but I wouldn't be any more logically sound than you are if I presented that opinion.Think, then post. I'm not kidding.

[timwakefield 68]

I'm mostly interested in the evolution debate in this forum, but nobody here is trying to disprove God. I think the most any of the atheists here are doing in that respect is trying to explain why they are atheists. They're not trying to convert anybody.

[Jerry_Lundegaard 0]

Im not an atheist per say, although I certainly dont believe in the Christian version of God... But the point is I DONT care, believe what you want... whatever makes you happy and causes you to live your life in the best way possible.What I resent is when the Christian point of view is shoved down my throat, or even worse, written into legislation. I read this forum because I am generally interested in how Christians view certain things .. like how their "loving" God sent a man like Ghandi to hell for not believing in Jesus. If a Christian could answer this question in a way that I considered satisfying I might consider the religion. As it is, the "only Jesus believers in heaven" is something I just cant get past.

[avsfan 0]

Cause, both ideas ask the same question. Does God exist? They answer the question diffrently. Fun usually insues.... P.S. I usually judge arguments between the two groups by who is more respectful of the other group's beliefs while they argue..Oh Man, can they argue.....

[brvheart 1,757]

They care a LOT... They want to make Christians look like idiots, because it's fun.

[keith crime 8]

Because religious people are constantly causing strife by meddling in other peoples lives by trying to convert them or judge their lifestyles

[CobaltBlue 662]

Because religious people are constantly causing strife by meddling in other peoples lives by trying to convert them or judge their lifestyles

If you had what you consider to be really good news (salvation), would you not want to share it with others? When it's appropriately practiced, Christianity is necessarily lovingly evangelical.

[crowTrobot 2]

They care a LOT... They want to make Christians look like idiots, because it's fun.

i care a lot, but it's not at all about making anyone look like an idiot.this debate is important to me because, first - on a global level i see religion as having always just created dogma and social boundaries that are currently holding the human race back from advancing - and endangering our future chances for long-term survival.second - on a local scale the religious right wing is currently making a strong push to strenghten their hold on the american government and (further) infiltrate our schools, with the purpose of forwarding their anti-intellectual causes (creationism, metaphysics over science/logic etc) - which again can only weaking society and hold back the advancement of the human race.i'm just throwing whatever i can out there to get people to think a little more logically about their beliefs and these issues, while countering some of the anti-science anti-logic nonsense posted here.also it's good mental exercise

If you had what you consider to be really good news (salvation), would you not want to share it with others? When it's appropriately practiced, Christianity is necessarily lovingly evangelical.

you could say the same thing for almost any other form of religion (or cult). not sure why christians like to think they are the only religion in the world.

[keith crime 8]

If you had what you consider to be really good news (salvation), would you not want to share it with others? When it's appropriately practiced, Christianity is necessarily lovingly evangelical.

Well yeah except you people start wars like they are going out of styleAtheists pretty much leave you alone if you leave them aloneOn the other hand you sentence them to eternal damnation - i'd be pissed too

[CobaltBlue 662]

this debate is important to me because, first - on a global level i see religion as having always just created dogma and social boundaries that are currently holding the human race back from advancing - and endangering our future chances for long-term survival.second - on a local scale the religious right wing is currently making a strong push to strenghten their hold on the american government and (further) infiltrate our schools, with the purpose of forwarding their anti-intellectual causes (creationism, metaphysics over science/logic etc) - which again can only weaking society and hold back the advancement of the human race.you could say the same thing for almost any other form of religion (or cult). not sure why christians like to think they are the only religion in the world.

'Holding the human race back from advancing'? Why so much value on 'advancing'? Why is survival important? Additionally, I think the government and schools have become much more secular over the past century. I don't see that trend reversing.And, when did I say that Christianity was the only religion? I believe it's the only true religion, but it definitely doesn't hold a monopoly on belief. I was merely answering the question about why Christians share their beliefs. It shouldn't be all that unbelievable that someone wants to tell you about something of this magnitude.

Well yeah except you people start wars like they are going out of styleAtheists pretty much leave you alone if you leave them aloneOn the other hand you sentence them to eternal damnation - i'd be pissed too

I was under the impression that a number of the military dictatorships of the 20th century were atheistic. Hitler was working for 'advancement'. Stalin and Mao were pretty anti-religion. When talking about religious wars involving Christians, you've got to go back to the Crusades.Also, I don't believe I've ever told anyone, "You're going to hell." I'm not sure I've even thought that...or desired to think that. I'm sorry that you've run into confrontational and judgmental people that have turned you off to Christ, but he espoused a message of love.

[crowTrobot 2]

'Holding the human race back from advancing'? Why so much value on 'advancing'? Why is survival important?

not sure what you are questioning - if there is any philosophical meaning to life, or just if life is worth living at all?

Additionally, I think the government and schools have become much more secular over the past century. I don't see that trend reversing.

it would be tough to reverse it in schools as a whole at this point (although there are still several local battles going on), but government and gov. policies are constantly yo-yoing.

[mrdannyg 274]

personally, i do not believe in god, but i care what people who do believe think, since i'm curious how they come about such deep belief in what i consider to be largely ignorant and absurd belief systems.even more so because these belief systems, which i consider to be absurd, are responsible for a large part of our society. for instance, over half the population in the most powerful country in the world believe a fictitious book of fables is an accurate historical portrayal, and their elected leader is the most powerful man in the world, with the power to significantly effect my life.this post is a little harsh, but it amazes me how much (directly and indirectly) how much belief in God and/or Christianity affects my life, and how absurd (in my opinion) it is.

[SunDrop 0]

Because we're sick of being treated like second class citizens. It is selfish for Christians to think they deserve more and are ultimately better than athiests. Because they all think that. If you were, say, Jewish, you would mind your own business and believe your own thing.Honestly, I give props to Judaism. They know they are right, and yet they would never judge. And of course...they have never been judged ever *cough* holocost *cough* "i'll jew you down for the lawnmower *cough* *cough*

[CobaltBlue 662]

Because we're sick of being treated like second class citizens. It is selfish for Christians to think they deserve more and are ultimately better than athiests. Because they all think that.

Thank you for not stereotyping.

for instance, over half the population in the most powerful country in the world believe a fictitious book of fables is an accurate historical portrayal

...and you wonder why some Christians get huffy?

not sure what you are questioning - if there is any philosophical meaning to life, or just if life is worth living at all?

In an atheistic world, what's the answer to both? You value 'advancement' and 'survival'. Why?

[crowTrobot 2]

In an atheistic world, what's the answer to both? You value 'advancement' and 'survival'. Why?

because i find value and fulfillment in life itself, as do most non-theists (i'm agnostic).

[CobaltBlue 662]

because i find value and fulfillment in life itself, as do most non-theists (i'm agnostic).

I can respect agnosticism.But what value? In a world without higher purpose, we're merely atoms getting pushed around.

[DerekTah 0]

I was under the impression that a number of the military dictatorships of the 20th century were atheistic. Hitler was working for 'advancement'. Stalin and Mao were pretty anti-religion. When talking about religious wars involving Christians, you've got to go back to the Crusades.

Apparently you never heard of Rwanda. Screw crusades, I went back all the way to the 90's.

[Mattnxtc 0]

Apparently you never heard of Rwanda. Screw crusades, I went back all the way to the 90's.

Unfortunately people like to do things "in Gods name." The will use this line of reasoning to justify their actions. Popes did it during the crusade, people use it today to justify bombing abortion clinics. There is one question I have always asked and so far nobody who did these things 'in God's name" have been able to justify..."Would Jesus be participating in these sort of actions if he was alive"You see thats the million dollar question. As a christian we are called "be like Christ" Well what would he do? Why are we doing things in his name that Christ Himself wouldnt do? That is something I ask myself before i go out and do something that may be questionable. Would Jesus do it if he was here? If i cant honestly answer "yes He would do it" then i know I also shouldnt do it. If people would ask themselves this very simple little question, so much pain and torture could have been avoided if people had just asked this simple question.

[DerekTah 0]

Unfortunately people like to do things "in Gods name." The will use this line of reasoning to justify their actions. Popes did it during the crusade, people use it today to justify bombing abortion clinics. There is one question I have always asked and so far nobody who did these things 'in God's name" have been able to justify..."Would Jesus be participating in these sort of actions if he was alive"You see thats the million dollar question. As a christian we are called "be like Christ" Well what would he do? Why are we doing things in his name that Christ Himself wouldnt do? That is something I ask myself before i go out and do something that may be questionable. Would Jesus do it if he was here? If i cant honestly answer "yes He would do it" then i know I also shouldnt do it. If people would ask themselves this very simple little question, so much pain and torture could have been avoided if people had just asked this simple question.

Well, actually that not quite true because the truth of the matter is that the crusades and Rwanda and for that matter most religious war ever are not done truly in the name of god. The truth is that it is done to solify power and get rid of any rival groups that may either now or in the future try to claim power. Sure the leaders may tell the people "do this in the name of God", but any deep look at these leaders shows that they were motivated by their own means, not in the name of God.

[BluesBassist 0]

This is a question that completely confounds me. I just can't fathom why atheists argue with Christians so hard that there is no God. What's the big deal to them if we believe in a God? If we're wrong, FINE, I die, I'll rot, peacefully and quietly, HECK, I'll enjoy it. But, if they're wrong.....oooh, buddy, somebody's got some explaining to do, but that's not my point. You see, I understand why Christians argue like we do, we care about people. We want to see people happy. We want people to go to Heaven. Plus, Jesus commanded us to argue on behalf of Him. (By argue on behalf of Him, I mean witness and evangelize.) So I know why I do it, but why do atheists?

You just effectively answered your own question. You admit many Christians like to evangelize. Obviously, you have every right to your beliefs and to express them publicly. However, if you do that, be advised some people will find your beliefs irrational and nonsensical, and it's expected that you will be refuted. Do you really expect everyone to remain silent while you express nonsense?For me personally, I will debate believers because I highly value reason, and therefore I feel that publicly expressed irrational ideas should be publicly contradicted by rational ones. Also, in some cases, I know the person doing the evangelizing, and I may think they are not beyond hope to awaken from their dogmatic slumber. And finally, as an engineer/scientist, I'm very interested in the historical friction between science (reason) and religion (faith), and how that manifests today in the form of the evolution vs "creationism" debate.

[Mattnxtc 0]

You just effectively answered your own question. You admit many Christians like to evangelize. Obviously, you have every right to your beliefs and to express them publicly. However, if you do that, be advised some people will find your beliefs irrational and nonsensical, and it's expected that you will be refuted. Do you really expect everyone to remain silent while you express nonsense?For me personally, I will debate believers because I highly value reason, and therefore I feel that publicly expressed irrational ideas should be publicly contradicted by rational ones. Also, in some cases, I know the person doing the evangelizing, and I may think they are not beyond hope to awaken from their dogmatic slumber. And finally, as an engineer/scientist, I'm very interested in the historical friction between science (reason) and religion (faith), and how that manifests today in the form of the evolution vs "creationism" debate.

It is clear what side your on and thats fine. But your assertion of what is irrational and rational are not really correct. rational coudl be defined as a belief is rational for some person S at some time t is to say that the belief has justification or warrant for S at t.therefore to say that it a christian is irrational is in fact not correct

[mrdannyg 274]

It is clear what side your on and thats fine. But your assertion of what is irrational and rational are not really correct. rational coudl be defined as a belief is rational for some person S at some time t is to say that the belief has justification or warrant for S at t.therefore to say that it a christian is irrational is in fact not correct

i think he was saying that some people might consider a Christian's beliefs to be irrational, not that those beliefs were necessarily irrational.i have trouble understanding the rationality of the strict belief in the Bible and God that some Christians have, but I still cannot argue that those beliefs are inherently irrational - I just cannot understand their rationality.I thought that was a friggin great post BluesBassist. i tried, but could not say it better.Daniel

[Petoria 0]

i think he was saying that some people might consider a Christian's beliefs to be irrational, not that those beliefs were necessarily irrational.i have trouble understanding the rationality of the strict belief in the Bible and God that some Christians have, but I still cannot argue that those beliefs are inherently irrational - I just cannot understand their rationality.I thought that was a friggin great post BluesBassist. i tried, but could not say it better.Daniel

agreed.

[mrdannyg 274]

...and you wonder why some Christians get huffy?

woohoo!it is simply my opinion that the Bible is not an accurate historical portrayal. my post purposely made that assumption without qualification. my goal was to to do so in the same way Christians usually assume their beliefs to be the truth, without qualifying them. What you read in my post is the same thing we hear from Christians every day, and you are correct to be annoyed by it.The above does not go for the discussion on this forum, which has been inclusive and uncondescending.Daniel