Bubba83 0 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 I was playing at $2/$4 FCP 5-max recently when this hand came up.I'm CO with 4:club: 4:heart: Preflop:UTG folds, I raise, I call.Flop (6.5 SB): 3:club: 3:heart: 7:diamond: BB checks, I bet, BB calls.Turn (4.25 BB): 3:club: 3:heart: 7:diamond: 9:diamond: BB bets, I call.River (6.25 BB): 3:club: 3:heart: 7:diamond: 9:diamond: J:heart: BB bets, I call.Final pot: 8.25 BBThis guy is new to the table and I don't have any reads.This will be a multi-part post, firstly, I want to get an idea of how you guys thought I played it. Then I'll go on to the other analyses. Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmaster05 0 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 his most likely hand holding seems like A-high with diamonds. I play it the same Link to post Share on other sites
hotbacon 0 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Yeah, you'll see lots of weird donkey shit doing this. I'd call down too. Link to post Share on other sites
Garn 0 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 i put him on either a high Ace of maybe a mid-PP. i think that 7 scared him. I probably call him down though. Link to post Share on other sites
pokerplayer24 0 Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 I'm torn between calling and raising the turn. I think raising this turn has a lot of merit. You're charging and a lot of hands that will check/fold the river.Also this allows you to fold to a 3-bet and I think on a low card river you can bet it as well. Link to post Share on other sites
allinbluff35 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 i raise the turn, fold to a 3 bet and take a free showdown 9/10 times. Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 i raise the turn, fold to a 3 bet and take a free showdown 9/10 times.I like just calling down here. I actually had a whole paragraph typed up as to why I like a raise, but then I decided against it. A guy who donks the turn like this, isn't going to fold to a raise. He will also bet the river with overs UI close to 100% of the time. The benefit of letting him bet your hand is he doesn't quite have the pot odds ot make this bet. Also, if an ace comes on the river, you can safely fold, saving yourself a bet. Another benefit is that you gauruntee you see the river card, so you have a bit of set spiking equity too. 4% isn't much, but it's worth somehting. Link to post Share on other sites
Bubba83 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 Alright, I knew some "raise the turn" comments would come up, and I'm satisfied with playing it either way really. Now, onto part 2. The villain had QQ. At first I thought he was retarded for using this line, but he actually makes the most money off of me using this exact line. I wanted to know what you guys thought about his line, and why it is good or bad. Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Alright, I knew some "raise the turn" comments would come up, and I'm satisfied with playing it either way really. Now, onto part 2. The villain had QQ. At first I thought he was retarded for using this line, but he actually makes the most money off of me using this exact line. I wanted to know what you guys thought about his line, and why it is good or bad.He's a retard.When he checks the flop, he allows you to check behind with Kx or Ax. When you have a mid pp, he makes the same (or more if you raise), by betting. Link to post Share on other sites
Bubba83 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 Let's say I have a PP, like I did, and he bets the flop, I'd raise/fold. If he 3-bet, he'd only be making 1BB after the flop. With this line, he made 2.5 BB. Let's say he just calls my flop raise, and checks the turn, i'm bet/folding again, and then taking a free river showdown, earning him .5 BB less. Also, I definitely only have 1 overcard, since I would have capped with AK, so I don't see how giving me one free card to potentially win a lot more from PPs as a flaw in his line. Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Let's say I have a PP, like I did, and he bets the flop, I'd raise/fold. If he 3-bet, he'd only be making 1BB after the flop. With this line, he made 2.5 BB. Let's say he just calls my flop raise, and checks the turn, i'm bet/folding again, and then taking a free river showdown, earning him .5 BB less. Also, I definitely only have 1 overcard, since I would have capped with AK, so I don't see how giving me one free card to potentially win a lot more from PPs as a flaw in his line.What about the times you have top pair and go berserk? What about the times he just calls your flop raise when you have exactly what you have? Link to post Share on other sites
Bubba83 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 What about the times you have top pair and go berserk? What about the times he just calls your flop raise when you have exactly what you have?I don't go any more beserk with A7 than I would play my 44. And if he just calls my flop raise and I have 44, then he checks on the turn, I'm bet/folding, and taking a free showdown on the river. Thus, yielding him .5 less BB than the line he took earned him. Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 What about the times you have top pair and go berserk? What about the times he just calls your flop raise when you have exactly what you have?I don't go any more beserk with A7 than I would play my 44. And if he just calls my flop raise and I have 44, then he checks on the turn, I'm bet/folding, and taking a free showdown on the river. Thus, yielding him .5 less BB than the line he took earned him.What if he donks the turn or river.Also, your range is wider than 44. Link to post Share on other sites
Bubba83 0 Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 Would it ever be right to fold if he called our raise on the flop and he donked the turn? Link to post Share on other sites
screech 0 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 Would it ever be right to fold if he called our raise on the flop and he donked the turn?Yeah. It probably is correct to do that since people almost never take that line with A high. Then again, you probably need a read to do so. Link to post Share on other sites
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