poker and god?!

[Mattnxtc 0]

Well this is some easy money and ill be using NASB...why? b/c its the best word for word translation available: #1 500$ directly to the account of your choosing if you can find the phrase " Accept Jesus Christ in your heart as your personal saviour " in the KJV of the bible, New Testament or Old. John3:16 - For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believe in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. Now im sure ull say o well its not the same words but u know its the exact same thing. #2 500$ if you can find a scripture that says that you don't need to be baptized, any scripture where Jesus says, " Oh, and by the way, don't get baptized.," or anything along those lines. 1st things first. I have never once said the bible said not to get baptised. You can go look through every post and u wont find it. That being said I can say without a doubt that it isnt necessary for salvation:1. Ephesians 2:8-9 "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that noe one may boast2. Titus 3:5-6 - "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 3. Luke 23:39-43 - Not gonna quote it all b/c of length but the jist is that a criminal also being crucified says: Aand he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when you come in Your kingdom!" and Jesus's response was "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise" 3 verses right there...2 specifically make it clear that nothing u ever will do will make u worthy of God, That includes baptism. Yes baptism was a sign of "washing ur sin away" but it is not and will never be a necessity to accept Christ into your life. The bible is very clear on that. The last verse i will add in is from RomansRomans 4:2-5 - "For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham beleived God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.: Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness"Now lets rehash this last section. We know that the only way to enter heaven is to be pure and sinless. That men of the OT had to sacrifice animals in order to make good on a sin. Why would they do this? SO THAT THEY COULD BE RIGHTEOUS!!! We have Paul right here saying that those who believe in Him (JESUS) will have thier FAITH credited as righteousness....Nowhere does it say faith and baptism but that faith alone will be credited as righteousness!!!!questions 3, 4 and 5 make no sense as they pertain to nothing that i have ever made any sort of claim to. I take the money to mattnxtc on pokerstars...thanksAnd yes the bible does talk about eternal security and i can provide many verses to back that claim too if necessary

[clowneyas 0]

2. Titus 3:5-6 - "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. I take the money to mattnxtc on pokerstars...thanks

Praise Jesus!!!

[brvheart 1,752]

How about we sum all 9 pages of argument up with this...If you believe in God, good for you.If you don't believe in God, good for you too.None of us can say with absolute certainty that they are correct, but we'll all find out someday, won't we?

Nope.Cause when you die, you'll just go black, and be gone. Unfortunately, you probably won't have a few seconds to gloat about being right. You'll be dead Unless I can be a ghost, which I've stated would be awesome. I hope that's the case. Ghosts rule and I'm totally haunting someone.

wow, you're saying that with a lot of confidence.... do you know something know one else on Earth knows?Or are you just being an arrogant ahole, like everyone else.

[Mattnxtc 0]

2. Titus 3:5-6 - "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. I take the money to mattnxtc on pokerstars...thanks

Praise Jesus!!!

he is the one that wanted to bet. He knew darn well i had verses to back my assertions and yet he still bet. If you watch he will hinge his bet on John 3 and when he does i can easily show how what is talked about there cannot logically have anything to do with christian baptism

[Suited_Up 2]

How about we sum all 9 pages of argument up with this...If you believe in God, good for you.If you don't believe in God, good for you too.None of us can say with absolute certainty that they are correct, but we'll all find out someday, won't we?

Nope.Cause when you die, you'll just go black, and be gone. Unfortunately, you probably won't have a few seconds to gloat about being right. You'll be dead Unless I can be a ghost, which I've stated would be awesome. I hope that's the case. Ghosts rule and I'm totally haunting someone.

wow, you're saying that with a lot of confidence.... do you know something know one else on Earth knows?Or are you just being an arrogant ahole, like everyone else.

No, I am not sure. I'm just being an arrogant *******. Clearly. But I think it's more true than the other option. I hope i'm wrong and maybe we fall somewhere in between, when there is some sort of consciousness after death, but I'm sure not holding my breath, and I really don't believe that to be the case.And matt... you're doing it again. None of that proved anything. Seriously, just find another thread.

[Mattnxtc 0]

And matt... you're doing it again. None of that proved anything. Seriously, just find another thread.

kurt...wasnt tryin to prove anything to u...was merely answerin the questions for lois so that i could win $500 bucks. If you dont liek this religious talk theres a few other threads in general you could look at

[Suited_Up 2]

And matt... you're doing it again. None of that proved anything. Seriously, just find another thread.

kurt...wasnt tryin to prove anything to u...was merely answerin the questions for lois so that i could win $500 bucks. If you dont liek this religious talk theres a few other threads in general you could look at

Did you read the first part of what I said?It makes no difference if it was me you were trying to prove it to, becasue all the drivel you just posted didn't prove anything. I would love to see you find someone who thinks that it does.

[Loismustdie 0]

Well this is some easy money and ill be using NASB...why? b/c its the best word for word translation available: #1 500$ directly to the account of your choosing if you can find the phrase " Accept Jesus Christ in your heart as your personal saviour " in the KJV of the bible' date=' New Testament or Old. [/b']John3:16 - For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believe in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. Now im sure ull say o well its not the same words but u know its the exact same thing. #2 500$ if you can find a scripture that says that you don't need to be baptized, any scripture where Jesus says, " Oh, and by the way, don't get baptized.," or anything along those lines. 1st things first. I have never once said the bible said not to get baptised. You can go look through every post and u wont find it. That being said I can say without a doubt that it isnt necessary for salvation:1. Ephesians 2:8-9 "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that noe one may boast2. Titus 3:5-6 - "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 3. Luke 23:39-43 - Not gonna quote it all b/c of length but the jist is that a criminal also being crucified says: Aand he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when you come in Your kingdom!" and Jesus's response was "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise" 3 verses right there...2 specifically make it clear that nothing u ever will do will make u worthy of God, That includes baptism. Yes baptism was a sign of "washing ur sin away" but it is not and will never be a necessity to accept Christ into your life. The bible is very clear on that. The last verse i will add in is from RomansRomans 4:2-5 - "For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham beleived God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.: Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness"Now lets rehash this last section. We know that the only way to enter heaven is to be pure and sinless. That men of the OT had to sacrifice animals in order to make good on a sin. Why would they do this? SO THAT THEY COULD BE RIGHTEOUS!!! We have Paul right here saying that those who believe in Him (JESUS) will have thier FAITH credited as righteousness....Nowhere does it say faith and baptism but that faith alone will be credited as righteousness!!!!questions 3, 4 and 5 make no sense as they pertain to nothing that i have ever made any sort of claim to. I take the money to mattnxtc on pokerstars...thanks You are wrong Matt, plain and simple, and anybody who actually reads the scriptures you produced will see that you have proven nothing. Baptism is not a work, it's a neccesary step!!!!! Seriously, not one scripture you brought up says any of the things that I will pay out for, in no shape or form. Don't worry, there is a point to this little game and I will be getting to it. You are very correct to say that whoever believes in Jesus will be saved. Period. Now, the question is what Jesus taught, and what he taught was very clear. He taught very clear- " He that beleiveth, and is baptized, shall be saved. He that believeth not is damned." That's just one. He alwasy mad baptisdm a necceesary step, that is why you see it happening so much in the scriptures- your religion( and I already ahve yopu pegged) teaches that baptism is an outward sign of an inward dedication. Where is the scripture that says that? Doen't exist. The funny thing is Matt is that you have to go to school for this- all I had to do was read and search the scriptures. Funny how much a fool really can ere. Ask yourself this Matt- what is it that cleanses you from your sin? The blood of jesus. Where is the blood, how do you get to it? When you answer that, you will prove my point for me and if you can't find the scriptures I will do it for you but I want you to see this for yourself, and then get back to me.

[Loismustdie 0]

And matt... you're doing it again. None of that proved anything. Seriously, just find another thread.

kurt...wasnt tryin to prove anything to u...was merely answerin the questions for lois so that i could win $500 bucks. If you dont liek this religious talk theres a few other threads in general you could look at

Did you read the first part of what I said?It makes no difference if it was me you were trying to prove it to, becasue all the drivel you just posted didn't prove anything. I would love to see you find someone who thinks that it does.

Thank you Suited Up, he has proven nothing although I don't really think that you are quite arguing on my side. That is fine, and the offer to answer any biblical questions you have still stands. I guess I will say this and this is not towards you because I do not know you- oftentimes what we hear is what we think, so if someone says the bibles wrong, or it's full of contradictions we just accept that, especially if it is from a trusted source. I am looking for specifics, from anyone, and I promise I will give answers and not excuses.

[Loismustdie 0]

2. Titus 3:5-6 - "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. I take the money to mattnxtc on pokerstars...thanks

Praise Jesus!!!

he is the one that wanted to bet. He knew darn well i had verses to back my assertions and yet he still bet. If you watch he will hinge his bet on John 3 and when he does i can easily show how what is talked about there cannot logically have anything to do with christian baptism

Funny how he uses the word washing in Titus. Just sayin.

[Suited_Up 2]

And matt... you're doing it again. None of that proved anything. Seriously, just find another thread.

kurt...wasnt tryin to prove anything to u...was merely answerin the questions for lois so that i could win $500 bucks. If you dont liek this religious talk theres a few other threads in general you could look at

Did you read the first part of what I said?It makes no difference if it was me you were trying to prove it to, becasue all the drivel you just posted didn't prove anything. I would love to see you find someone who thinks that it does.

Thank you Suited Up, he has proven nothing although I don't really think that you are quite arguing on my side. That is fine, and the offer to answer any biblical questions you have still stands. I guess I will say this and this is not towards you because I do not know you- oftentimes what we hear is what we think, so if someone says the bibles wrong, or it's full of contradictions we just accept that, especially if it is from a trusted source. I am looking for specifics, from anyone, and I promise I will give answers and not excuses.

I'm not arguing on that side, but I am on your side on this one at least. I have yet to see matt post anything relevant in response to anything. Like he's reading it in another language or something.I don't have any specifics for you, and haven't studied it extensively. Although I am not from the camp that believes what they're told. My family is not in the same boat as me at all, lol. Not that they're overly religious, but depends which part of the family we're disuscussing. These are views i've come to on my own, because i'm just a proof driven person. I've done plenty of thinking about the subject, and really tried to convince myself otherwise, but it's just not something I can believe in. I have no answer to how the universe came about, boy would it help if someone figured that out, but outside of that, I can't put much faith in anything that religion says.Just the way it is for me, no need to try and change it, lol.Someone do me a favor though... what's the difference between Athiest and Agnostic?

[Pupsta 0]

And matt... you're doing it again. None of that proved anything. Seriously, just find another thread.

kurt...wasnt tryin to prove anything to u...was merely answerin the questions for lois so that i could win $500 bucks. If you dont liek this religious talk theres a few other threads in general you could look at

Did you read the first part of what I said?It makes no difference if it was me you were trying to prove it to, becasue all the drivel you just posted didn't prove anything. I would love to see you find someone who thinks that it does.

Thank you Suited Up, he has proven nothing although I don't really think that you are quite arguing on my side. That is fine, and the offer to answer any biblical questions you have still stands. I guess I will say this and this is not towards you because I do not know you- oftentimes what we hear is what we think, so if someone says the bibles wrong, or it's full of contradictions we just accept that, especially if it is from a trusted source. I am looking for specifics, from anyone, and I promise I will give answers and not excuses.

I'm not arguing on that side, but I am on your side on this one at least. I have yet to see matt post anything relevant in response to anything. Like he's reading it in another language or something.I don't have any specifics for you, and haven't studied it extensively. Although I am not from the camp that believes what they're told. My family is not in the same boat as me at all, lol. Not that they're overly religious, but depends which part of the family we're disuscussing. These are views i've come to on my own, because i'm just a proof driven person. I've done plenty of thinking about the subject, and really tried to convince myself otherwise, but it's just not something I can believe in. I have no answer to how the universe came about, boy would it help if someone figured that out, but outside of that, I can't put much faith in anything that religion says.Just the way it is for me, no need to try and change it, lol.Someone do me a favor though... what's the difference between Athiest and Agnostic?

from what i understand, atheism = belief that there is no god, agnosticism = admitting that you don't know what's out there, there may be a god and there may not be.

[Loismustdie 0]

Kurt, I look at creation from this angle, and it is the complete opposite of what someone said earlier. All of this order could not have come from chaos. I don't know of one thing that has been built that just appeared as a result of an explosion, or of things colliding- it doesn't work like that. Intelligent design, in my mind, is the only option. Take something as simple as a plant seed- we cannot make them. So simple, and we know what's in it, but we cannot duplicate that seed, it is so intricate in the way that it was designed to work, the way it interacts with the soil and the water and the way that the sun gives it's sprouts life when it breaks ground, cannot be duplicated. We can plant a seed- we just cant make it. There was a system put in place by somebody for even this, the tiniest form of life. Now let's take something we created- a car. Took a man with a vision and an idea and through trial and error made that idea come to life- the point being that there was a intellect behind it and it came to fruition because of that intellect. Which, you will find, is how anything that has worked for us was invented. For all of our knowledge, as powerful as the human mind can be we still cannot make a plant seed- therefore, I have to believe that somewhere out there is a being more powerful, exceedingly more powerful, with the ability to think and create and yes the POWER to create much more than I or any other human. That, in a small, condensed form, is why I beleive in God, or you can call him a higher power if you like, in my mind it doesn't really matter what we call him as long as we give him his just due.

[Spademan 94]

This thread makes baby Jesus tea-bag little girls.

[NortonFan 0]

This thread makes baby Jesus tea-bag little girls.

Believe me, he was doing it before this thread existed.

[Spademan 94]

This thread makes baby Jesus tea-bag little girls.

Believe me, he was doing it before this thread existed.

Duh.I'm talking about the increase in frequency.

[Loismustdie 0]

This thread makes baby Jesus tea-bag little girls.

That's about as wrong as it gets. You're in a class all of your own my friend.

[Spademan 94]

This thread makes baby Jesus tea-bag little girls.

That's about as wrong as it gets. You're in a class all of your own my friend.

I won't deny it.

[Smasharoo 0]

All of this order could not have come from chaos.Actually you have no fucking idea at all. You don't have the mental wherewithall to deal with the fact that you just don't know how the universe was created, or if it was created, or whatever so you've instead decided to accept some pathetic explination, any explination at all, so that you don't have to deal with your utter impotence and insigifigance in teh grand scheme of the universe. Realizing that your life and, in fact, life in general itelf is a miniscule trivial grain of sand in the vast desert of space/time can be hard, particularly when you're mush brained to start with and have lived alife of blindly accepting other people's explinations without question and following the other sheep right up to and over the edge of the cliff. Congratulations on deriving your philosophy of life from what someone else made up to better exploit you for their own benefit.You are of course, entitled to your oppinion, naturally. Let's all try and get along now.good luck.

[Project 69 0]

So, how about those implied odds guys?

[davezz5 0]

Just because linguistically speaking words seem random, does not mean their meaning is random.  If there were some intelligent species on the other end of the universe(not that I believe that), I am pretty sure they would believe that 2 + 2 = 4, not in those exact words, but they would have a proof similar to ours.  I do not think they would also have a book that was similar to the bible, and claimed a man died for the sins of all.I just happen to think that math can be described as universal.  The Christian bible, I am not so sure.  :roll:

This is an old philsophical axiom..Leibniz gives an example of the sum of angles in a triangle being 180 deg's.this is obviously not depended on any labelling that we as humans give to the propotion of distance between said angles, but is a logical truth that must exist in abstract form, human intepretation not withstanding.Therefore, regardless of definitions that we as finite beings place upon objects, or any other labelling process; even infinite beings have to observe the logical structure of the universe.The example of the triangle would clearly hold true in any universe.Thus laws of logic are universal

Not true. The sum of the angles of a triangle only equal 180 degrees in a Euclidean ("flat") space, as we perceive flat. On a curved surface (as we perceive curved) the sum of the angles of a triangle is greater than 180 degrees.If another universe is intrinsically non-Euclidean (or even ours if it is only approximately Euclidean) then the precise sum of the angles will not be 180 degrees.

Even in a non-euclidean universe( a previous poster has pointed this out already) the logical framework inherent in this dimension must still be observed by an infinte being.The salient point petains to logical truths and there abstract existed. But hey,thanks for your pedantic observation.Maybe next time you will consider the context in which the remarks are made..ty

[Project 69 0]

In lieu of verbose ramifactions and excessive polysyllabic intricacy, man deciphers ecolateral patterns inherent to the form of which fragmentation of ideals and posterity, dissolving iconoclastically in a submersion into the abyss of thought clearly muddled in linguistic perversion.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

In lieu of verbose ramifactions and excessive polysyllabic intricacy, man deciphers ecolateral patterns inherent to the form of which fragmentation of ideals and posterity, dissolving iconoclastically in a submersion into the abyss of thought clearly muddled in linguistic perversion.

In your subject line for this post, I believe you meant 'apocalyptic' and not 'apologetic.'Just sayin'.

[Project 69 0]

In lieu of verbose ramifactions and excessive polysyllabic intricacy, man deciphers ecolateral patterns inherent to the form of which fragmentation of ideals and posterity, dissolving iconoclastically in a submersion into the abyss of thought clearly muddled in linguistic perversion.

In your subject line for this post, I believe you meant 'apocalyptic' and not 'apologetic.'Just sayin'.

I'm just making fun of the word people! If that makes sense at all it's a sheer accident... so take that random jumble of words and call it life, and argue about this... am I god or an explosion? I have to admit it looks pretty smart though

[Mattnxtc 0]

You are wrong Matt, plain and simple, and anybody who actually reads the scriptures you produced will see that you have proven nothing. Baptism is not a work, it's a neccesary step!!!!! Seriously, not one scripture you brought up says any of the things that I will pay out for, in no shape or form. Don't worry, there is a point to this little game and I will be getting to it.You are very correct to say that whoever believes in Jesus will be saved. Period. Now, the question is what Jesus taught, and what he taught was very clear. He taught very clear- " He that beleiveth, and is baptized, shall be saved. He that believeth not is damned." That's just one. He alwasy mad baptisdm a necceesary step, that is why you see it happening so much in the scriptures- your religion( and I already ahve yopu pegged) teaches that baptism is an outward sign of an inward dedication. Where is the scripture that says that? Doen't exist.The funny thing is Matt is that you have to go to school for this- all I had to do was read and search the scriptures. Funny how much a fool really can ere.Ask yourself this Matt- what is it that cleanses you from your sin? The blood of jesus. Where is the blood, how do you get to it? When you answer that, you will prove my point for me and if you can't find the scriptures I will do it for you but I want you to see this for yourself, and then get back to me.

A few things. I did figure u would back out of the bet so i wasnt countin on the money. Next I will give you this simple thing. Provide one verse that says we need baptism as a necessity for salvation. BUT lets remember something, all verses where Jesus was alive do not count. Why? B/c if Jesus is alive how can His blood save us if He has not died yet? Do you see where u go wrong so many times. Also John 3 is not referring to Christian Baptism!!! Why? B/c He is talkin to a pharisee and He gets mad at the pharisee for not knowing!!!! How could a pharisee know of a christian baptism!!! You see. Take a minute and put ur pride aside and honestly look at the verse. You will that it is not likely that Jesus could be talkin of a christian baptism to a jewish leader and then get mad at the jews leader for not know!!!!!So again provide a verse. (Acts 2 is a good start though you may want to check Acts 10 also as those would seem to bring about contradiction.) So again bring me a single verse. And Lois I do not go to Seminary or anything of that nature. I in fact spend my time reading the Bible also. But I do not make assumptions until I have seen all that the Bible offers. The bible has made it very clear on baptism. As for your quote on Titus. If you really think that he is referring to water then you will lose even more credibility. Check the OT for verses in which the exact same thing is used. If you know the Bible like you say you do u should realize that the OT could not be referring to baptism as salvation since Jesus hadnt come yet. Get to work on those and get back to me..I still expect to recieve my money as you will find that scripturally speaking I am solid in my beliefs.