RonBurgundy 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 i am about to turn 18 so ill have SOME gambling options, i feel like a have a decent grasp on the game. Advice/list/order of books i should take a look at? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites
Absolute 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 Theory of Poker by Skalnsky. Also you should check out the Poker Books forum here, there's plenty of good leads. Link to post Share on other sites
RonBurgundy 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Author Share Posted February 19, 2005 thanks, ive heard good things of that one although some peers are critical because they tend to play extremely loose, and well, extremely stupid. I'll be sure to check it out. Link to post Share on other sites
wrto4556 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 Small stakes hold'em before theory of poker.ditto on the book section of the forum Link to post Share on other sites
Absolute 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 i havent read small stakes yet, but i hear good things.should it have priority over SS2? Link to post Share on other sites
wrto4556 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 i havent read small stakes yet, but i hear good things.should it have priority over SS2?Personally, yes. I play small stakes and it is the bible. I read it every night before I go to bed and then pray to sklansky malmuth and miller. Link to post Share on other sites
MrConceit 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 i havent read small stakes yet, but i hear good things.should it have priority over SS2?It depends what you want to do. SS2 gives great advice for each section of the book, but it isn't like an exhaustive tome on each subject. It just gives you solid great advice for each game. SSHE gives very solid complete info for beating one game, low limit hold'em. It is very much a how-to book. SS2 isn't that kind of book imo. Though I've only read about half of it so far. I LOVE the Harman limit section, but it isn't exactly a total howto book for limit hold'em.So if you want to play particularly low limit hold'em, I'd recommend SSHE or Gary Carson's The Complete Book of Hold'em, or lastly the Lee Jones book.In that order.And as WRTO said, when you finish your first book on limit hold'em, then read ToP. Basically whatever you do, read ToP pretty early in your career, but a HOWTO book first is best, unless you already know what you're doing. Link to post Share on other sites
Awful 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 i havent read small stakes yet, but i hear good things.should it have priority over SS2?I'd put SSHE ahead of SS2 if you're gonna be playing loose, low-limit holdem primarily.As good as SS2 is in places, it commits fewer than 100 pages to each game and covers each game's play at levels higher that you'll see online. For example, SS2 advocates raising in the SB or BB with middle pair on the flop; in large fields of loose players, that's not a great idea. Quite simply without even having read SSHE, I'm gonna say that it's better to have well over 200 pages on the game you're playing at the level you'll be playing than a shorter section detailing play not tailored to the level you'll be at in conjunction with sections detailing high level play in games you won't see as often.IF you play a wide variety of games, and they're decently tough games, then go for SS2 by all means. Link to post Share on other sites
Awful 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 It depends what you want to do. SS2 gives great advice for each section of the book, but it isn't like an exhaustive tome on each subject. It just gives you solid great advice for each game. SSHE gives very solid complete info for beating one game, low limit hold'em. It is very much a how-to book. SS2 isn't that kind of book imo. Though I've only read about half of it so far. I LOVE the Harman limit section, but it isn't exactly a total howto book for limit hold'em.So if you want to play particularly low limit hold'em, I'd recommend SSHE or Gary Carson's The Complete Book of Hold'em, or lastly the Lee Jones book.In that order.And as WRTO said, when you finish your first book on limit hold'em, then read ToP. Basically whatever you do, read ToP pretty early in your career, but a HOWTO book first is best, unless you already know what you're doing.I've been digging through Ed Miller's 2+2 posts to learn more about his book and methods (haven't read SSHE, I'm pretty sure I should, seeing what I'd be getting into), and he mentions in there that it's meant to complement Lee Jones and is an advanced book; while SSHE is mentioned as a how-to book, make sure that you have a good base of fundamentals because Miller's book isn't about beating low limits, it's about applying everything to beat low limits for the maximum; not a beginner text despite the level it covers.Theory of Poker is key. You will "get" so much more out of every other book, and every discussion, and figure out so many concepts on your own naturally once you've digested TOP. At the same time, understanding TOP sometimes requires direct context from your best game, so I'd recommend: WLLH, TOP, SSHE, and then TOP again. Good luck.Also, the loose players who say Sklansky is bad, well, if they read it and understood it, they'd know he's NOT all hand groupings and odds counting and being tight. He does teach a complete and aggressive style if you actually read it and not judge on hearsay or one thumbing through at Barnes and Noble muttering to yourself "numbers? I hate numbers. Talk about poker, dammit." Link to post Share on other sites
RonBurgundy 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Author Share Posted February 19, 2005 haha yea i'm constantly ridden about how i'm so tight, and im not playing poker just because they call freflop raises with 85 suited and chase to the river. Well, i dont currently have a job and im laughing all the way to my wallet (would be the bank if we played a little higher stakes). Plus, once i realize im getting no action with this tight image its pretty darn handy for switching gears and bluffing. Link to post Share on other sites
MrConceit 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 I've been digging through Ed Miller's 2+2 posts to learn more about his book and methods (haven't read SSHE, I'm pretty sure I should, seeing what I'd be getting into), and he mentions in there that it's meant to complement Lee Jones and is an advanced book; while SSHE is mentioned as a how-to book, make sure that you have a good base of fundamentals because Miller's book isn't about beating low limits, it's about applying everything to beat low limits for the maximum; not a beginner text despite the level it covers.Theory of Poker is key. You will "get" so much more out of every other book, and every discussion, and figure out so many concepts on your own naturally once you've digested TOP. At the same time, understanding TOP sometimes requires direct context from your best game, so I'd recommend: WLLH, TOP, SSHE, and then TOP again. Good luck.Also, the loose players who say Sklansky is bad, well, if they read it and understood it, they'd know he's NOT all hand groupings and odds counting and being tight. He does teach a complete and aggressive style if you actually read it and not judge on hearsay or one thumbing through at Barnes and Noble muttering to yourself "numbers? I hate numbers. Talk about poker, dammit."I really quite agree with most of the points you give here. I'm just not a HUGE fan of WLLH, but it was my first book also as I started like a year ago and SSHE wasn't out yet.I agree that SSHE is a difficult book if you're utterly new to poker (or new to limit poker), but I think it is possible as a first book if you put a lot of time into reading and understanding it, or have some background playing first.I totally agree with what you say on ToP.WLLH just advocates too weak a style for me to wholeheartedly advise it as my first choice for a beginner book. His 2nd edition isn't as bad as the first, but I still don't like it TOTALLY. I'd still recommend Gary Carson's book over WLLH as a first. Link to post Share on other sites
firstyearclay 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 Read: Author, TitlePoker for Dummies Gary Carson, Hold Em' poker. Lou Krieger, Hold Em' ExcellenceLou Krieger, More' Hold Em' ExcellenceLee Jones, Winning Low Limit Hold Em'Phil Hellmuth, Play Poker like the Pro'sThen go into the bigger books by Sklansky, Miller, MalmuthHold Em' PokerSmall Stakes Hold Em' PokerTheory of PokerThen:Alan Schoonmaker, Psycholgy of PokerI have personally read tons of others but, found the information in these to be priceless. Adapt some theories that work for you and then never do the same thing twice. Read, Re-read and then read them again. When you finish those, read them one more time through randomly. Do not forget to: dog ear pages, and bring a highlighter and pencil. Leave some books in the bathroom, get a clear plastic bag and bring them into the shower, and then bring them with you on your Poker walks everyday. May sound crazy but, do whatever it takes to get these books in your brain. Good Luck! Link to post Share on other sites
NormanHaupt 0 Posted February 19, 2005 Share Posted February 19, 2005 uh.. don't read "Play Poker Like The Pros" Unless you don't like money. Instead, just send me your $20- it'll be a lot cheaper than buying the book and trying to play like that at low limit. Trust me on this one.I bought SSHE (Small Stakes Hold'em) by Sklasky, Miller, and Malmuth, and it is a bible. And sometimes just as hard to understand. It won't cover very beginning concepts well, but I don't think any book does. For those concepts, these forums seemed to work the best. I'm still digging through it to learn the math. I understand all the theories, its just applying it that gets sticky.If you don't want to learn math, but still want to play poker... well, good luck- you'll have more leaks in your game than a four month old maxipad. This doesn't mean you can't be a winning player- I don't apply much math at all and I'm a slightly winning player- but if you do apply the concepts, profit skyrockets. You stop playing drawing hands as much.--The biggest single piece of advice I can give.. has been told to me by both wrto and akishore, and I didn't heed it when they said it.. but- I read it in SSHE and it was explained.. "Pump ir or Dump it". If you're not confident about raising a hand you have, drop it immediately, as you're probably beaten already.I guess the best thing for you is to hop on pokerstars and blow money. I lost $60 playing out of my limits my first weekend- came here, got some solid advice, managed my next bankroll, and now I'm up in money (well, actually down because I did a couple SitNGo's that I shouldn't have.. and the open here last weekend (and probably this weekend coming).. and I gave $10 to my mother's accountn so she can do the .02/.04 tables. She was moping up last night, too. yeesh)Good luck. Link to post Share on other sites
RonBurgundy 0 Posted February 20, 2005 Author Share Posted February 20, 2005 thanx to all for the advice, im pretty advanced in math and a nice mix of ss, sklansky, and some of the beggining books should help alot, as well as all you guys giving solid advice on here. Thanks again. Link to post Share on other sites
wrto4556 0 Posted February 20, 2005 Share Posted February 20, 2005 thanx to all for the advice, im pretty advanced in math and a nice mix of ss, sklansky, and some of the beggining books should help alot, as well as all you guys giving solid advice on here. Thanks again.hey. where do you find solid advice? I'de like to get in on that. Link to post Share on other sites
RonBurgundy 0 Posted February 20, 2005 Author Share Posted February 20, 2005 haha fishing for compliments? ur a main contributor, as well as smash's post on his pstars experiment but i honestly enjoy this site because most people my age arent as interested in the game as i am. Link to post Share on other sites
wrto4556 0 Posted February 20, 2005 Share Posted February 20, 2005 haha fishing for compliments? ur a main contributor, as well as smash's post on his pstars experiment but i honestly enjoy this site because most people my age arent as interested in the game as i am.hell no im not fishing! I really want to know where you're getting good advice!j/k of coarse. Lots of strong minded players post here. Link to post Share on other sites
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