nl heads up games

[theredpill99 0]

I think I'm a decent heads up NL player. I've seen people who just sit in these heads up games waiting for opponents. How well do you think the better ones are doing ? Maybe I should do this for a month as a change of pace and see how it is ? I'm tired of full handed ring games a little. Do any of you do this ?

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

The last time I gave heads up a real shot at an experiment, it didn't go too well. I won 27 out of 50 $10 HU sit n go's. Obviously, small sample size... but I'd routinely go up or down 3 or 4 in a row, and swiiiiiiing back the other way.I think the variance is definitely higher than it would be compared to a ring game of equivalent stakes. Annie Duke also thinks you need a bigger-than-normal bankroll to play heads up... there's an article somewhere on her website.Causes: Most people playing HU know that you have to be psychotically aggressive to be successful... and people over-meta-game-analyze their opponent from the relatively few hands they've seen.I also know for a fact that EVERYONE, including myself, overvalues their own heads up playing ability against an unknown.

[Randy Reed 0]

I actually don't come to this part of the forum very much, but was looking for this topic. I've played a ton of sng's and mtt's over the last few years, but mostly play limit now. During the Neg Opens I started getting into some more mtt's and sng's again and found my HU game is blowing chunks. I had 2 2nd's in the Neg open after having a lead, and 2 mtt's as well after having a lead. I've just finished a couple other games in 2nd and left my confidence shaken and broken. It's like I play great and then, uh oh, now it's head's up and I just donk it off.So the question is, where to get help? Books? Anyone good at HU NL strat here? HELP a brother out!!!!!!!! Thanks, Randy

[iggymcfly 0]

The last time I gave heads up a real shot at an experiment, it didn't go too well. I won 27 out of 50 $10 HU sit n go's. Obviously, small sample size... but I'd routinely go up or down 3 or 4 in a row, and swiiiiiiing back the other way.I think the variance is definitely higher than it would be compared to a ring game of equivalent stakes. Annie Duke also thinks you need a bigger-than-normal bankroll to play heads up... there's an article somewhere on her website.Causes: Most people playing HU know that you have to be psychotically aggressive to be successful... and people over-meta-game-analyze their opponent from the relatively few hands they've seen.I also know for a fact that EVERYONE, including myself, overvalues their own heads up playing ability against an unknown.

I agree with this sentiment wholeheartedly. I know that when I used to play NL Sit & Gos all the time, I'd give myself credit or a huge edge headsup, thinking that I'd win at least 2 times out of 3 heads up. Well, after playing some HU NL Sit & Gos on Bodog, I can say that this just isn't that case. If you're lucky, you can get your money in as a 60/40 favorite, and in the long run, you're edge is probably less than that. It's definitely made me reconsider playing cash games once it gets down to three-handed and heads up, seeing how easily it can turn into a crapshoot. I think if you're playing NL cash games heads up, you're just asking to get eaten up by the rake.

[SFkid 0]

Playing heads up is a whole different animal.First off there are many different ways to play heads up. Phil Hellmuth won the national heads up tourney by playing a defensive type of style.He did a lot of checking and calling trying to trap his oppenent.But that only works when the blinds are not huge compared to your stack.Then there is playing fast heads up which also works because there are a lot of pots where both of you will miss the flop and comes dowm to being the aggreser(sp.) scooping up the pot.This style works well in most situtations and gives you thee best shot of winning when the blinds start getting up there.You want to also mix it up durring the match to throw off your oppenent.If you mix it up enough your oppenent is dead.There are many varraibles heads up but this is the jist of what you want to do.

[Shimmering Wang 1]

My NL playing buddy plays 10-15 hours of week of 500maxNL heads up cash games, and does quite well. It's a different animal, especially when you can reload whenever you want.

[Scott3705 0]

I played around with HU SNG's for about two weeks and decided to stop playing them because 1. I didn't feel I could chip away enough at people when the blinds were small 2. it becomes a "who guesses right" type of crapshoot when the blinds get very big. If they had been played at consistent limit, I probably would like them.

 It's definitely made me reconsider playing cash games once it gets down to three-handed and heads up, seeing how easily it can turn into a crapshoot. I think if you're playing NL cash games heads up, you're just asking to get eaten up by the rake.

I don't know. I think maybe I haven't gotten enough hands in, but I amke a lot of money when i can find HU NL cash games. I know variance is high and it's really hard to find and the maintain a HU cash game. BUT, i think the aspect of HU cash games that makes it profitable is what you and TJ bring up. Everyone overvalues their abilities HU. This becomes profitable after you wina buy in from a player and then he rebuys because he feels like he has an edge on you. However, he is almost as always tilting to some degree when the second round comes. I've found if i stay composed, they can be profitable. But like i said, I might not have seen enough hands.

[Gene zzz 0]

In HU the cards are to important thosemuch of the play of NL is gone you have to play tight no chasing . I try to set up an agg. player who steals to much but you just have to have the cards, hidden 2 pairs are killers for an allin. I get bad results but I am no limit card player I play NL cause to can do with out the need of hitting your hand. Also use short stacks to topple bigger, come in least at the money then cut out the lcuky man. I have watch some HU stng at PSt and they are bad you maybe good to go there the swing is all in cards if you study situations then you clean up in long term,(in Kidpoker Dreamclown match KP's tight play when low on deck power saved: remember online is all loose) ex. pair on board , flush etc. no pair no call etc.

[CobaltBlue 662]

Maybe I'm one of those that overvalues my HU play, but I find that I rarely get 2nd in NLHE tournaments. I feel like if I can get them down to HU, even if I'm at a somewhat sizeable chip deficit, my opponents are often pretty terrible. That could be part of it...not necessarily being great, but facing opponents that are worse. Too many of them don't mix up their game enough. They'll play push or fold even with relatively big stacks.That said, I rarely play cash games HU or straight HU tournaments, because the profit margin doesn't seem as great, but I've been considering giving them a shot.There used to be a good HU NLHE thread in General Strategy. I'd recommend searching for it.

[Binbs 0]

Seems to me at first glance that heads up play really only can become profitable at the 3/6 or above level. I would recommend that you start consistently playing HU at 5/10 so the rake doesnt take that much.

[Eastwood Jr. 0]

I think I'm a decent heads up NL player.   I've seen people who just sit in these heads up games waiting for opponents.    How well do you think the better ones are doing ?     Maybe I should do this for a month as a change of pace and see how it is ?    I'm tired of full handed ring games a little.    Do any of you do this ?

Heads up is awesome but it is more of a grind than people realize. The key is you have to chop pots. If you're winning the hands where neither of you have much then you'll have freerolling chips when it comes time to gamble with marginal holdings. Secondly, follow your instincts. If you sense weakness then attack, strength then refrain. You only have one opponent to watch so you if you catch them falling into too familiar patterns then take advantage. Thirdly, you have to play some hands backwards. Mix up your play a little more than you would. Show hands more often. Raise the pot and show them 29o one hand then make the same bet and show them the AKs next time. Get inside their head a little. Make them feel like you are outplaying them. Set traps with weaker hands than usually and have the courage to follow through on your convictions. Finally you need some luck. If someone is holding on you for hours straight then its tough not to go broke. You're in the blind every hand so you have to defend something. But if you get inside their head then it can be lights out for your man almost regardless of the cards.

[Eastwood Jr. 0]

Maybe I'm one of those that overvalues my HU play, but I find that I rarely get 2nd in NLHE tournaments. I feel like if I can get them down to HU, even if I'm at a somewhat sizeable chip deficit, my opponents are often pretty terrible. That could be part of it...not necessarily being great, but facing opponents that are worse. Too many of them don't mix up their game enough. They'll play push or fold even with relatively big stacks.That said, I rarely play cash games HU or straight HU tournaments, because the profit margin doesn't seem as great, but I've been considering giving them a shot.There used to be a good HU NLHE thread in General Strategy. I'd recommend searching for it.

I agree with Cobalt. MAke your opponent make the big mistake and then have the courage to follow through on your conviction.

[wisky_VI 0]

interesting topic.I've been playing NLHE two man freezouts as a change of pace. Sure are many subtle things to remember, get too predictable and your dead. Also even playing a 'perfect' game it's near impossible to overcome a hyper aggresive player on a card rush.Playing with some feel and mixing up the game at proper times is key. Betting repeatedly until the opponent stands up is a must, set the tone but be willing to back off and be patient when the opponent stands up or gets a card rush.Very fun to play with the fast action.I'm curious to hear more from others, especially those playing HU matches especially freezeouts. My prefered site doesn't have cash money HU NLHE or I'd play that some too, problem is on other sites I've gotten hit n run more than once........