first hand of rounders: did he have to go broke?

[Pupsta 0]

stop being a twat and shut the fuc up

OHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHH...DONE!

[KowboyKoop 0]

Fold this hand....only getting 2:1 on your money...not enough to chase that two outer..you are definitely behind....just check and fold...

[NortonFan 0]

stop being a twat and shut the fuc up

OHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHH...DONE!

[tyfgine 0]

Matt Damon

PS: i wonder what DNA4ever would do?somebody ought to PM him and find out.

[kennyg1966 0]

if you've ever seen rounders, you know the first hand of the movie. Matt Damon gets nines full of aces, Teddy KGB flps over pocket aces for aces full, and matt loses all his money. If you haven't seen the movie, Ii recomend it. Anyway while watching the movie, my friend asks me "is there any way he could have not gone broke that hand"? I wasn't sure, but after analyzing it, I think he could have saved his last 15K. Here is my analysis of the hand.Matt picks up ace nine suited, and raises. KGB, who I assume is a blind, remarks to the table "it's a position raise" and calls. Flop comes down A 9 3, with two spades. Matt thinks to himself " I want to overbet, make it look like im tryin to steal it, so i get paid off". It's a good move, and he overbets. KGB calls. Turn comes another 9, and now matts got nines full. he thinks "im puttin KGB on a flush draw, so i want a spade to fall so he can pay me off w/ my nines full". KGB checks, matt checks. neway river comes a low spade. Matt assunmes KGB just hit his flush, as KGB bets a HUGE amount (I'm not sure what it was, but i know it was a gigantic amount, about half of matt's stack"). Matt acts like hes thinking, then RERAISES ALL IN, and KGB calls. Now watching this movie, it looks like at first glance there was no way matt could have saved his money, but i think he could have. First of all, there was a small chance KGB was on the come with a flush draw. the first reason is that he called a huge bet on the flop. Matt knows KGB is an extremely good player, and its unlikely a great player is going to call on the come heads up when the pot odds are extrmeely in favor of folding. One could make the arguement for the implied odds, but i dont see how a flush draw could call this bet, especially in a cash game.Even if he did factor in implied odds, KGB stil lcouldnt have the flush draw. the reason being is that he played the hand EXACTLY LIKE A FLUSH DRAW! Someone as tricky as KGB wouldn't make his hand that obvious. Of course it looked like to Matt KGB was onthe come, with check, call, check. However, Matt should have realized that there was no way KGB would play a flush draw likethat. Finally, KGB probably didn't have the flush draw because of the way matt played the hand. Matt's play is typical of a flush draw. A semi-bluff on the flop, and a free card on the turn. Matt should have realized how much his play looked like a flush draw to KGB. He should have thought "Theres a good chance KGB thinks i have a flush draw. Therefore, when a spade came on the river, completing a hypothetical flush draw, and yet hes betting, that means that either he a.has the nut flush or b.has the nut flush beat. Realizing this and the above matt should have thought "ok if hes not on the flush draw and doenst have the flush, then hes gotta have somthing to callthe huge flop bet, and to bet the river when a spade hits" So then matt should weigh which hand KGB could have that in this situation. Basicially, the hands would be a smaller two pair off the flop, the nut flush made on theriver, or a set off the flop. Based on KGB's play, theres a reasonable chance that he has a boat, just like matt, since it isnt likely hes on the flush draw and he bet when the flush was made. There are two other boats, one of them being lower and one of them beng higher. the boat that was higher though, would be pocket aces.AT this point matt should have thought "Based on the way he played the hand, could he have aces." And the answer is absolutley yes! KGB's play is one of setting an extrmeely deep trap. Does this mean matt should have folded? NO. No way you can make that lay down. Too many hands KGB could have. He could have the nut flush, the smaller boat, or some weird bluff. However, when KGB bets a huge amount on the river, just calling would have been the better move, considering there was one posible hand that had A9 beat that KGB could have. Overall, Matt put too much weight on his read of KGB being on the come. He should have just called on the end. He was outplayed. Matt even admits to Knish later in the movie that he was "outplayed". Unfortunatley, it cost him his whole bankroll.What do you think? Am i off in some places, and if so, where? It's a really interesting hand.Dave

new rue of dumb..ops meant thumb....always fold A9 suited when you are in a movie!!

[Royal_Tour 0]

WTF

[Pupsta 0]

WTF

don't ask, just join in baby

[flash420 0]

I think that the thing to remember here is that it is just a movie. If Matt Damon over bet the pot, then the only real reason for him to do that is to protect his hand from the flush draw. I think that the fact the Teddy smooth called that big of a bet should have sounded off alarm bells. If anything, should not have risked his whole stack. But then again, if he was that good of a player, he should have realized that, expecially if he could come back after being cold that long and figure Teddy out in one night.

[teneight 1]

WTF

don't ask, just join in baby

[JSHamm 9]

I think that the thing to remember here is that it is just a movie. If Matt Damon over bet the pot, then the only real reason for him to do that is to protect his hand from the flush draw. I think that the fact the Teddy smooth called that big of a bet should have sounded off alarm bells. If anything, should not have risked his whole stack. But then again, if he was that good of a player, he should have realized that, expecially if he could come back after being cold that long and figure Teddy out in one night.

True, but everyone fails to realize the most obvious explanations for the whole showdown.... Teddy had double stuffed oreos at the beginning of the movie; that was obviously a reverse tell.

[eandreas 0]

Johnny Chan talked about this once, before the movie came out and before Moneymaker and before the internet. Somebody asked him what's the difference between the top players and all the rest, between bracelet winners and pros and Johnny Chan, Doyle Brunson, and so on. He said: "I try not to go broke with a pair of queens."He had the second nuts and was convinced it was best. Never fall in love with your hand, love is like trying to raft down a rushing river of piss in a garbage can with weights on your back.You gotta pay it off or you ain't a gambler. Once you pay it off you replay the movie in your head and try to figure out how, in Johnny Moss' words, "the way the veins in his neck move, the way he sweats."And after you go broke, you go back to the game and just like Johnny Moss with the nines that came up loser against the jack in the hole, you bust his ass cause you got heart.Any dumbass can catch cards. It takes a guy with heart to play em.

[goose 0]

stop being a twat and shut the fuc up

OHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHH...DONE!

this is getting excessive.

[teneight 1]

welcome to FCP

[AlTrade 0]

I can't believe that i read this entire post. Very, Very, Very, Very, Very, Very, painful!!!!!!!!!!!!

[quixotic 0]

Matt Damon

[nopunk 0]

The horse has been beaten to a bloody, bloody pulp.

[darkrider88 0]

What a thread.

[AcesOnFire 0]

Matt Damon

[showstopper24 0]

who is Matt Damon? JK