lets talk about tells

[alf13 0]

Can I come?.

I don't know...can you? I have no problem in that department.

[alf13 0]

Okay....now that we had a little fun...let's cease this hijack...this is a great thread on a very important subject for us LIVE players....Personally....I would like to read some of the OP's experiences in spotting tells on GOOD players....

[Tritz 0]

Can I come?.

I don't know...can you? I have no problem in that department.

Sometimes. When the moon is lined up with the Earth.

[Gallo 1]

Okay....now that we had a little fun...let's cease this hijack...this is a great thread on a very important subject for us LIVE players....Personally....I would like to read some of the OP's experiences in spotting tells on GOOD players....

I think one of the best tells that I've seen is the betting. It's almost the same as online, when a guy usually has a strong hand they bet it strong, when they are afraid of a card or tentative their next bet is not as strong. Of course, this tell is only common against not really good players, but ok players.I think I remember Lederer mention how that online poker tell bodes well in live games as well. Or something like that.

[Kangaroo 0]

great post steve, what are the tells like in what you usually play live?Royal tour where are more pics of that girl in your sig .

[Big Trips 0]

I don't get to play much live, but i just spent couple of weeks playing poker full time in Vegas. Before leaving, i decide to read Caros book of tells. The one tell from the book that i found most reliable is the shaking hand. Not one single time did a player bet with a shaking hand and not have a very good hand.At one of the casinos, there was this older gentleman playing. After he looked at his hole cards and had a good pair, his hands would start wobbling so bad he was almost unable to handle his chips properly. I pointed this out to my buddy and we had a hard time keeping a straight face playing with this guy after that.(I'll pass on any wrestling invitations related to this post)

[JTPHS 0]

this is very important... i'm teaching my roommate right now, he's a very studious person, and i was quickly able to teach him the importance of fundamentals, thinking about what your opponent has and being able to lay down a hand.That was the first step but, as a result, he gave off soo many tells... mainly just weakness.. and he never looked for any. needless to say i jumped on it... beat him every time -- but i told him about it. If i reraised him because of a tell or something i would tell him.. told him to always do things with confidence. If i ever caught something on myself... and naturally i do. I would say.. what did you notice about my actions there? " did you notice how weak i just was... pretty genuine right?" "why not bet?"... "if i raise.. still think i'm bluffing.. reraise, but do it confidently"He picked this up quickly... now he's one hell of a tough opponent.. no more pushing him around for me when i smell fear... because i DON'T anymore... although i can still pull out a little magic here and there. if anyone actually read this and want me to tell them what i feel the best way to look for tells is just ask

[JTPHS 0]

this is very important... i'm teaching my roommate right now, he's a very studious person, and i was quickly able to teach him the importance of fundamentals, thinking about what your opponent has and being able to lay down a hand.That was the first step but, as a result, he gave off soo many tells... mainly just weakness.. and he never looked for any. needless to say i jumped on it... beat him every time -- but i told him about it. If i reraised him because of a tell or something i would tell him.. told him to always do things with confidence. If i ever caught something on myself... and naturally i do. I would say.. what did you notice about my actions there? " did you notice how weak i just was... pretty genuine right?" "why not bet?"... "if i raise.. still think i'm bluffing.. reraise, but do it confidently"He picked this up quickly... now he's one hell of a tough opponent.. no more pushing him around for me when i smell fear... because i DON'T anymore... although i can still pull out a little magic here and there. if anyone actually read this and want me to tell them what i feel the best way to look for tells is just ask

[JTPHS 0]

this is very important... i'm teaching my roommate right now, he's a very studious person, and i was quickly able to teach him the importance of fundamentals, thinking about what your opponent has and being able to lay down a hand.That was the first step but, as a result, he gave off soo many tells... mainly just weakness.. and he never looked for any. needless to say i jumped on it... beat him every time -- but i told him about it. If i reraised him because of a tell or something i would tell him.. told him to always do things with confidence. If i ever caught something on myself... and naturally i do. I would say.. what did you notice about my actions there? " did you notice how weak i just was... pretty genuine right?" "why not bet?"... "if i raise.. still think i'm bluffing.. reraise, but do it confidently"He picked this up quickly... now he's one hell of a tough opponent.. no more pushing him around for me when i smell fear... because i DON'T anymore... although i can still pull out a little magic here and there. if anyone actually read this and want me to tell them what i feel the best way to look for tells is just ask

[Royal_Tour 0]

I don't get to play much live, but i just spent couple of weeks playing poker full time in Vegas. Before leaving, i decide to read Caros book of tells. The one tell from the book that i found most reliable is the shaking hand. Not one single time did a player bet with a shaking hand and not have a very good hand.At one of the casinos, there was this older gentleman playing. After he looked at his hole cards and  had a good pair, his hands would start wobbling so bad he was almost unable to handle his chips properly. I pointed this out to my buddy and we had a hard time keeping a straight face playing with this guy after that.(I'll pass on any wrestling invitations related to this post)

ya no, thats crapa lot of peoples hands shake regularily. and using that to tel if its a bluff or a good hand is gonna get you in trouble more often than not.dont rely on that tell

[Guest]

I don't get to play much live, but i just spent couple of weeks playing poker full time in Vegas. Before leaving, i decide to read Caros book of tells. The one tell from the book that i found most reliable is the shaking hand. Not one single time did a player bet with a shaking hand and not have a very good hand.At one of the casinos, there was this older gentleman playing. After he looked at his hole cards and  had a good pair, his hands would start wobbling so bad he was almost unable to handle his chips properly. I pointed this out to my buddy and we had a hard time keeping a straight face playing with this guy after that.(I'll pass on any wrestling invitations related to this post)

In Playing poker over the last 18 months I would say that this is easily the most reliable tell I have come across. ............... ........but watch out because some people are bound to be trying to "fake the shake".

[JTPHS 0]

sorry about the reposting.. comp was acting up

[Royal_Tour 0]

I don't get to play much live, but i just spent couple of weeks playing poker full time in Vegas. Before leaving, i decide to read Caros book of tells. The one tell from the book that i found most reliable is the shaking hand. Not one single time did a player bet with a shaking hand and not have a very good hand.At one of the casinos, there was this older gentleman playing. After he looked at his hole cards and  had a good pair, his hands would start wobbling so bad he was almost unable to handle his chips properly. I pointed this out to my buddy and we had a hard time keeping a straight face playing with this guy after that.(I'll pass on any wrestling invitations related to this post)

In Playing poker over the last 18 months I would say that this is easily the most reliable tell I have come across. ............... ........but watch out because some people are bound to be trying to "fake the shake".

see above.Big tells that are almost always correct are "chip stacking"weak strong/strong weakandchip glancing - i find this one to be much more reliable then trembling hands.granted the guy said the old man kept shaking when he had a big PP, so if thats the case, good work on pickin up on it.but all too often that tell is flawed

[nell789 0]

I'm actually gona comment on this now. hehGood post, but i've noticed the replies are telling you to be casual, cool, not give off any info.well as easy as that sounds, some times its not. Instead of trying to hold back any emotion, sometimes the best way to throw people off is to exaggerate a tell.Have u ever noticed when people wil calculate outloud?, or talk to themself about what you may have?have you ever done this to someone else?.  Honestly, these type of over the top manerisms do work.(think phil laak, unibomber) obviously his are waaay over the top, but if taking your tells, and extending them to a level which illustrates disguise is easier then trying to surpress them then go for it.you dont always have to be a Phil Ivey, or a Lederer.and thats my two cents

An extension of this is definately Gus Hanson. He's always contorting his face and making noises and such....he's nowhere near the stereotypical poker face of Ivey style. However it is still reletively impossible to read him because he does all these expressions/sounds no matter what his hand.

[steve7stud 0]

I really like the feedback so far. I would like to talk about tells a bit more. I'm actually going to crash out. But it is certainly a subject that I feel is often passed over. Especially with the popularity of internet poker these days.

[indianachris 0]

Thanks for the thread Steve. I remembered when I first started playing hold 'em I was good at reading people and then when I took the game seriously it seems that I could not get a tell on someone for the life of me.

[Juandastyle 0]

Phil Gordon on celebrity poker actually helped me out w/ a tell once:He mentioned in an episode that after the player made a big bet, they were hunched forward, showing strength, usually meaning they were weak. Well i ended up in a pot on the river w/ an opponent all in for about $60 (1/2 nl 100max). Gathering the few pieces of information in the hand i had, as well as his body posture, i called his all in on the river w/ the J high flush when the K and Q were better flushes than mine (4 diamonds on the board). I had the best hand and took it down, thanks to a lil advice from phil gordon.

[StarfishAnts 0]

I don't get to play much live, but i just spent couple of weeks playing poker full time in Vegas. Before leaving, i decide to read Caros book of tells. The one tell from the book that i found most reliable is the shaking hand. Not one single time did a player bet with a shaking hand and not have a very good hand.At one of the casinos, there was this older gentleman playing. After he looked at his hole cards and  had a good pair, his hands would start wobbling so bad he was almost unable to handle his chips properly. I pointed this out to my buddy and we had a hard time keeping a straight face playing with this guy after that.(I'll pass on any wrestling invitations related to this post)

In Playing poker over the last 18 months I would say that this is easily the most reliable tell I have come across. ............... ........but watch out because some people are bound to be trying to "fake the shake".

Heh, that was one of my friends problems when he first started playing, his hand shook when he bet/raised when he had a monster. When he realized this, he made his hands shake when he was bluffing and now his hands don't shake at all he says

[pistola pedro 0]

My grandmothers' hands used to shake and that's why I always asked her to hold it for me while i peeeed...

[Cue 0]

I only play live at either Fallsview Casino ($5/$5 nl) or Casino Niagara ($1/$2 nl). My first ever online game was this week in Daniel's AM640 promotional game.With regards to tells, yes there are many. But you must be careful because each casino has a pretty sizeable contigent of regulars who know every newbie face who shows up and they will play games on you such as faking tells to induce you into false confidence. I do it all the time when I am in a pot against a newbie to the casino who seems to know the game.SOme very telling tells are:- sitting forward and trying to look mean = bluff- making the big bet and laying back in your chair (arms behind your head) in a relaxed but a "I can't look...did he call?" type of way = Monster- hesitancy and long pause to call after flop, turn, river = chasing- hand shake (but you have to already have a read on the players ability to fake) = monster- staring you down or challenging you to call = bluffNote that obviously all of these things can be faked and no tell should be taken for granted until you have observed the player for a while and feel you have read on his/her ability to fake tells.

[Pokerdad2222 0]

I think the hand shake is a pretty good tell for the most part but you have to be careful with this one. IT is probably one of the more common faked tells and some donkeys will do it when thye think they have a monster and they really dont. I was playing 1-2 live last week. Table had some strong players but mostly donkeys like usual. Pretty good size pot , about 100$ was heads up with two players one strong and one weak. The weak player went all in for about another 120 and the stronger player looked at him and could see how bad he was shaking. I noticed it pretty heavily too and figured the guy had a monster. The board was paired with strong straight and fush possibilitiess. The strong player laid the winning hand down because the shaking was so easy to pick off and the donkey, thinking he was showing a monster, showed only top pair. I know some people may say he made a play at the pot but you could tell this wasnt the case at all and he went on the donk off all of his money with plays like this.

[SnakeEyes 0]

Big tells that are almost always correct are  "chip stacking"weak strong/strong weakandchip glancing - i find this one to be much more reliable then trembling hands.granted the guy said the old man kept shaking when he had a big PP, so if thats the case, good work on pickin up on it.but all too often that tell is flawed

I'm almost exclusively a live player, and I find the hand shaking tell very prominent in OK players. It is very consistent and cannot be easily faked, like you say. It is very easy to spot a fake shaker--the most telltale sign being a convulsive, jerky movement instead of a pure release of tension... I think that you're wrong about discarding the importance of this tell. It can become easy to control, but not easily faked. I know Caro's book isn't complete in all the possible tells, but it is a good starting point, and in the fineprint you'll notice how he too addresses the difficulty of faking a hand shake.

[Blink 0]

Best.Tell.EverI was playing at a casino in Windover, NV last summer, where a guy was giving me early Chistmas presents.At the river, if he was heads up with you, and he was holding a mediocre hand, he would show you his cards after he bet and before you acted.I guess he figured you would lay down if you couldn't beat his TP/TK or whatever. It didn't matter what I had. I would raise, he would fold. He would then complain about how lucky I am to always hit on the river.I kept my composure at the table, but when I left, I laughed so hard I peed a little.--Blink

[Pokerdad2222 0]

Best.Tell.Ever  I was playing at a casino in Windover, NV last summer, where a guy was giving me early Chistmas presents.  At the river, if he was heads up with you, and he was holding a mediocre hand, he would show you his cards after he bet and before you acted.  I guess he figured you would lay down if you couldn't beat his TP/TK or whatever. It didn't matter what I had. I would raise, he would fold. He would then complain about how lucky I am to always hit on the river.  I kept my composer at the table, but when I left, I laughed so hard I peed a little.  --Blink

That is a pretty easy one. Something similar i had. usually when someone is going for chips early it means they are trying to deter you from betting but this guy was the opposite. He was two seats to my right and was the easiest read ever. 1-2 NL. Flop would come out and he would have lots of people to act before him but it didnt matter. If he didnt hit the flop he wouldnt grab any chips. If he hit a pair he would grab 10$ no matter what the size of the pot was. If he hit two pair or better he would grab 30$ even if the pot was only 8$. For the first hour I thought he might be a decent player showing his hands so he could still later but he showed every winning hand for 4 hours straight. Just about everytime I was in a pot with im I would call the 10$ flop bet and then if he only bet 10$ again on the turn I would raise with nothing and take the pot. If I raised pre-flop and we came heads up or close to it and I had something like AK and hit an A or K on the flop and he would bet 30 I would fold face up and people would laugh and then he would show 2 pair or trips. It was great because no one else picked up on the easiest betting pattern ever and they thought I was a great player with great reads and so I ran over the table for about 4 hours cause everyone was scared. Biggest donks I ahve ever played with and my cash game skills, while improving, arent all that great.

[bdams19 0]

My friend and I were discussing this the other day. His tell is that he gets quiet when he has a big hand, and mine was that when I get caught bluffing (called on the flop), my breathing would get a little shallower (ie hold breath for a second, and breathe out heavy). Ever since one of my friends has picked up on this and told me I think I have eliminated it. Play with your friends, ask them to try and spot tells on you. My friends watch and try to spot tells, but they will refuse to tell you. They think it'll only make you better if you figure them out yourself. Right.