$50 nl

[Jordan 1]

$50 NL - 10 handedI have good notes on the table, and am playing very aggressive purposefully in this session (without showing one hand down yet, or getting to a river).ME $65UTG $60 ( seems to be playing a very ABC game )UTG2 $80 ( i have in my notes 'easy to push off hands' )My hand :: 5 6 UTG bets $2, UTG2 calls, folds to me and I call in LP, folds around.3 way potFLOP ($6.75):: J 4 T UTG bets $3, UTG2 calls $3, I raise to $13 ...I'm obviously trying to pick this pot up now and if called will def. take a free card if I don't improve. I raised because of the small 'feeler' bet from UTG. Although it could have been a purposeful small lead bet, I can't help myself sometimes.So do you all prefer to:A) foldB) callC) raise I'm just curious here guys. I normally only would do this if I had two overcards to go with my draw, or a straight draw as well. But is being over aggressive in position after this weak bet seem just silly?- Jordan

[Blink20 0]

This is a perfect case of creating your own odds. With the lead bet and the call, there is 13 in the pot, so when you make it 13 to go, if just one of them calls, you are getting 2-1 on your money, which is great for a flush draw with two cards to come.This is also much better than the weak mini raise because people can sniff that out as being a flush draw raise so then they will just call flop and lead again on a brick turn and put the pressure on you making your flop raise worthless. However, making it 13 to go in position, you are getting the right price when they check the turn, you are forcing them to play out of position, and you are forcing them to make a decision for their money.Its the perfect execution of a flush draw in position, overcards or not. Also by making plays like these, if you are playing a TAG game, you will get more action than a weak tight type player because people will see you are sometimes raising with "nothing".I like it.

[Patricnz 0]

dude what are you doing?this is 50 nlfull ring no lessdon't go crazy, play like this at 10/20nl or something but these guys will call you regardless.. ( you know this ?) just doesn't seem like it would work given the nature of the games then again maybe you are just trying this out ?56s three way against a 4bb raise in a typically agressive nl game is not a desired situation and im pretty sure you are aware of this ? implied odds? err not really **** all flops you like and they may not pay off if you do hit large i just dislike the call a lotmaybe if it were 4 handed or 5 handed to the flop then you are sweetcould be wrong though..

[Scott3705 0]

dude what are you doing?this is 50 nlfull ring no lessdon't go crazy, play like this at 10/20nl or something but these guys will call you regardless.. ( you know this ?) just doesn't seem like it would work given the nature of the games then again maybe you are just trying this out ?56s three way against a 4bb raise in a typically agressive nl game is not a desired situation and im pretty sure you are aware of this ? implied odds? err not really censored all flops you like and they may not pay off if you do hit large i just dislike the call a lotmaybe if it were 4 handed or 5 handed to the flop then you are sweetcould be wrong though..

Wondering if you could clear up some points in this post because I'm a little confused as to whether you were talking about PF or the flop....1. Are you advocating not calling this raise PF?2. Why doesn't he have implied odds here? Your opinion on 50NL is that people call with anything? no?

[Patricnz 0]

fold preflopone or two more limpers i call

[Scott3705 0]

fold preflopone or two more limpers i call

thanks for clearing that up. Completely disagree with you, but that's ok.Edit: Post still doesn't make sense to me though.... Opponents aren't going to fold anything yet, he doesn't have implied odds (ie he won't get paid off if he hits the flop hard?)

[petersun 0]

Don't you want to keep both people in the hand to get money out of both of them when you hit? I would prefer the call here cause we're building pot odds that may bring both people along. However, given that you've decided on the agressive style, your raise is more to character. Did you want to take it down right here?Folding post flop is definitely not an option.

[Jordan 1]

Don't you want to keep both people in the hand to get money out of both of them when you hit?  I would prefer the call here cause we're building pot odds that may bring both people along.    However, given that you've decided on the agressive style, your raise is more to character.  Did you want to take it down right here?Folding post flop is definitely not an option.

Yes I wanted to take it down here, which is why I raised.My table was also playing pretty passive. I don't think I would have been paid off had I hit. I put the hand range for UTG from 10s to KQ, AQ type hands -- which is why I raised. I would hate to see any paint on the turn if I smooth call this flopThe raise was to push these guys out now. And, if called, hopefully hit a hand to get paid off with cause if these guys stuck around I would have to give one of them credit for a real hand.If I smooth call this flop and say a total brick comes out, like a 2, depending on the "new bet" I'll see what to do. I may at times smooth call his flop and pull a delayed bluff on the turn.If I smooth call this flop and say the 7 or 3 comes I will be raising here again a fair amount of the time...also depending on what I'm lead at if any.If I smooth call this flop an A/K/Q falls then I'm usually outta the hand if he bets me out.- Jordan

[petersun 0]

Yes I wanted to take it down here, which is why I raised.My table was also playing pretty passive. I don't think I would have been paid off had I hit.  - Jordan

Then I like your play =) If they're not going to pay you off when you hit the flush, let's take this now.Your logic for alternate situations seems reasonable as well.

[theredpill99 0]

I don't like it. 1) you are up against 2 players in the hand and it's hard to bluff 2 players especially at .25/.50 NL. You don't need to bluff at .25/.50 NL to win. 2) you have 4 to 1 odds on the flop to call already so you don't need to do anything here really but just call and hope to hitI don't like calling a raise preflop with 56s but if you think you can take one of these guys stack if you hit, then it's ok.

[Blink20 0]

The preflop call is GOOD. Its not just fine, its not horrible, its good.We're playing deep stack nl here, compare the blinds to the stack sizes.Also, look at the implied odds involved. Its the same concept of calling a preflop raise with a hand like 22, you are hoping to flop BIG, run into a stubborn opponent and stack him. IT works if your table is overplaying hands or IF playing too passive because then you will flop something and be able to CREATE your own price, play position, and put them to a test.Playing hands like this and making the right moves post flop is ESSENTIAL to playing no limit. There are plenty of players at this level playing ABC poker, and they do NOT get paid off as much, but still profit. Too profit more, you gotta show the fish you will "GAMBLE" with them, that you don't always just have monsters. This is a great situation to do it WHILE still having the right price.Jordan, as usual, sometimes you gotta filter out the weak/tight advice, no offense but there is plenty of it all over the forum and everywhere. You played this hand perfectly, good work and gl at the tables.