online poker? is there alot of cheating? @@@@@@@@@@@

[jackoffsuit 0]

I havent played alot of online poker because I have heard there is alot of cheating going on. Like software playing hands for you by using the odds. Or playing a table with 4 or 5 buddies communicating together and winning easily. Whats your take on this? Is there alot of cheating? Have you made alot of money online?thanks!

[Tritz 0]

Everyone, for the love of god, please leave me out of this.

[jackoffsuit 0]

um, ok, thanks for the help@@@@@@@@@@@

[darbour21 0]

haha poor tritz..........make one bad post and scared for lifeyes there is alot of cash games where poeple get together and cheat....more than everyone thinks i believe

[Geezy 0]

The sky is falling.....

[Tritz 0]

Everyone who plays poker cheats, haven't you seen the made for tv series..TILT!

[ForRealDD 0]

I've heard , there is a program that somebody in this forum has....you can see the cards before the flop....ask around...I'm sure you'll find the guy ...sw

[Royal_Tour 0]

Yes, there is a lot of collusion. not enough where its present every time u play.But myself, who knows people who do it, and witnessed people doing it, yes, you need to be carefull of it. if you sense it, just switch tables.Software playing ur hands, is out there, Bots. supposedly they suck, but i've also read articles of people claiming their bot is winning them money.who knows.if you are losing money, its not because of either of these issues. its becauase you suck at online poker.

[Logun 0]

All assinine comments asideYes - there is RAMPANT cheating in poker. As with all things in life.I've heard multiple stories of 'Bots that can play limit (no bot can play NL yet) But have yet to substantiate these rumours. Of course most of the poker world knows that University of Alberta created Poki and Loki - two limit hold'em playing bots that could play and could win.So we know its possible.As for collusion - yah that's rampant too. Probably more so as you get into higher limts where it is more profitable but that is only my own opinion.Poker sites try to combat these issues and they do catch people from time to time, but much like hackers and computer security the cheaters will always work harder to stay one step ahead of the site.There was an article in MAxim Mag this summer in which they quoted one dude as saying he multiplay 4 people at a time through 10 different accounts and rakes in thousands a day.Don't know the validity of that.Bottom line. Cheating is rampant.

[Wandigo 1]

I'm sure there's quite a bit of cheating out there, especially in cash games. You just have to be on the lookout for anything suspicious, and if so, get away from that table and find something else. I just started playing online last Friday starting with a $20 deposit at BetonUSA.. Since then, 7 days ago, I'm up $480 from just playing some cash games and the $20 & $30 SnGs. I haven't seen anything suspicious since then and it has seemed to be pretty fair.

[ForRealDD 0]

The only form of collusion I've really ever seen is the "Sandwich" play. In which on player raises from early position, induces a call ( small raise ) and the partner in late position reraises a large amount to take down the pot and push you out.

[DDiabolical 0]

Profitable bots exist, I've made one, but they're so rare that they're not worth worrying about, if you're a profitable player, you can beat a profitable bot.Oh, and my bot played exclusively NL

[Royal_Tour 0]

The only form of collusion I've really ever seen is the "Sandwich" play. In which on player raises from early position, induces a call ( small raise ) and the partner in late position reraises a large amount to take down the pot and push you out.

thats a classic collusion play for sure.but the knowledge of 2 or 4 extra cards is always a huge advantage over the other players.the ability to fold A,K in middle position when UTG raises, and then the button. (your partner says,"i've got aces") is also an added bonus.

[jackoffsuit 0]

thanks for the info everyone! I will be careful when playing online.

[Jeepster80125 0]

Everyone, for the love of god, please leave me out of this.

I have not laughed this hard in days. Thanks. If anyone wants to know why I am laughing so hard at this statement, I supply the following.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...4286&highlight=That said, online poker is not rigged, despite what some would want you to believe. There is collusion, but sites take steps to insure security. PokerStars and Party take random screenshots to check for bots and messaging services, and tournament winners are audited regularly to check for collusion (checking all players at the table) If they see that the same 5 people always play together, they will take steps to end that practice. Can you please tell me what the @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ means?

[turd ferguson 1]

Everyone, for the love of god, please leave me out of this.

I have not laughed this hard in days. Thanks. If anyone wants to know why I am laughing so hard at this statement, I supply the following.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...4286&highlight=That said, online poker is not rigged, despite what some would want you to believe. There is collusion, but sites take steps to insure security. PokerStars and Party take random screenshots to check for bots and messaging services, and tournament winners are audited regularly to check for collusion (checking all players at the table) If they see that the same 5 people always play together, they will take steps to end that practice. Can you please tell me what the @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ means?

at at at at at at at at at at at at at at atduh.

[Smiggarette 0]

Everyone, for the love of god, please leave me out of this.

You did it to yourself.

[jayboogie 0]

Bots definitely can be made, but again you don't need to worry about it as it's probably profitable for you to play against one since it does the same thing repetitively. They can be made profitable at the lower limits, but of course are programmed to make the same plays over and over again which means a small profit, but not much of one.Collusion however is a concern. I know this goes on quite a bit, anyone who thinks otherwise is just being ignorant about it. You will notice some strange patterns between 2 players sometimes and I've been asked on several occassions to collude with a bunch of players and share my hole cards and chop the profits between everyone.Really though, the low limit cheaters you don't need to be worried about, because although they're cheating, they're probably not that good even if they do cheat. If you encounter cheating at the higher limits, it will be tough to overcome though and the best thing to do is leave the game and notify the site/casino(if you're playing live).

[econ_tim 0]

can the mods please do something about thread titles that contain lots of *s @s or other symbols?

[Logun 0]

Profitable bots exist, I've made one, but they're so rare that they're not worth worrying about, if you're a profitable player, you can beat a profitable bot.Oh, and my bot played exclusively NL

I call bullsh.itSend me the code and I'll let you know if you're full of it or not

[jayboogie 0]

Profitable bots exist, I've made one, but they're so rare that they're not worth worrying about, if you're a profitable player, you can beat a profitable bot.Oh, and my bot played exclusively NL

I call bullsh.itSend me the code and I'll let you know if you're full of it or not

They definitely exist and supposedly are not that hard to write. You kind of just have to write in the commands ie. fold 73 offsuit all the time, raise AJ in late position with no limpers, but fold in EP in a tight game and etc etc. It's really not that hard to create one if you think about it.

[Logun 0]

I'm not debating the existance of bots. But I've been privy to some of the code that created Loki and Poki and there is a reason why people with their Phd's have worked on these bots. The math is not that simple.Some of the math we do as players is intrinsic to ourselves - we lable players as tight, weak...etc. We make moves based on this as well as pot odds etc.when you try to do something of this nature in NL you are opening yourself up to a whole new realm of math.I'm not saying it can't be done (its not completely impossible) and I'm not saying it hasn't been done. I'm just saying that I don't believe it can be done to a long term sustainable and profitable level.I would be totally stoked to see some code and some analysis that proves it can be done.

[justblaze 0]

writing a bot algorythm that can beat a table of moderately competent players is ludicrously complicated. in fact, it probably cant be done without getting into neural networking and adaptive coding. if anyone here has written a bot, please put it in a game and tell me where so i can take its money.

[jayboogie 0]

I'm not debating the existance of bots. But I've been privy to some of the code that created Loki and Poki and there is a reason why people with their Phd's have worked on these bots. The math is not that simple.Some of the math we do as players is intrinsic to ourselves - we lable players as tight, weak...etc. We make moves based on this as well as pot odds etc.when you try to do something of this nature in NL you are opening yourself up to a whole new realm of math.I'm not saying it can't be done (its not completely impossible) and I'm not saying it hasn't been done. I'm just saying that I don't believe it can be done to a long term sustainable and profitable level.I would be totally stoked to see some code and some analysis that proves it can be done.

That's why I said it can be done at the low limits where using simple strategy will net you a small profit. It doesn't exactly take a genius to clean up at a low limit NL game, that's why strategies like Smash's work at the low limits. What you'd be doing if you ran a bot is be running like 20 of them at a time to be chopping away a small profit with each one which will add up over time.

[10'sorbetter 0]

Even though I don't play at the higher limits yet, I've noticed something strange going on during cash games only. I'm a tight player until I get to know the table. I've noticed that it seems that two players consitantly keep winning at certain tables. I realized playing these other individuals netted a loss. Not sure about the software either, but interesting. Is there anyone out there who is a programer who can clear this up for "newbies" per say. It makes sense to take $ from lower limit games because it's probably below the sites detection. Not sure though maybe they monitor all levels the same way.