i used collusion the other day... am i wrong?

[NickTheKid 0]

The people that I play against in school are a bunch of jerks (yes, really) who bad mouth people and do a lot of retarded betting with very crap hands, they have friends with them a lot of the time and they get pissed off when they lose, in other words: They are uncurtious loud-mouths. My friend and I entered a 10$ buy-in 10 man tourney and used collusion with signals. We won and split the money, I know morally this was not a good thing to do.. but to tell you the truth I don't feel the least bit bad about it. What is your take on it? Am I evil? :evil:

[Ebonwoulfe 0]

You probably would have beat them anyway, even without the collusion. That's the thing about collusion, you have to be really good for it to work.

[oldadmin 0]

All i know is your signature is probably one of the best i've seen in a long time.

[faketree 0]

Horrible. I definitely think what you did was wrong. It sucks enough to have to worry about people cheating online, but in live games as well, it just sucks.I also heard tonight that one of the cardrooms in San Francisco has a whole bunch of teams working the tables. Just freakin' great I'm thinking. It sucks to have to add cheating into something you are looking for with regards to table selection.While its not the worst thing in the world what you did, its still dishonest and brings you down to, or lower, than their level.

[TarHeelAce 0]

Being a loud mouth and playing bad hands is nowhere near as bad as cheating. That's what collusion is: cheating. By doing it you disgrace the game, and if you ever get caught, you won't find anyone else willing to play with you. If you care about poker at all, beyond being able to make a few bucks, I suggest you stop colluding.

[Mandelbrot 0]

I know morally this was not a good thing to do.. but to tell you the truth I don't feel the least bit bad about it.

Sorry to hear that. What you did was much, much worse than trash talking or playing loosely. You should feel bad about it.

[DK 0]

I have a freind I play with all the time, and we dont signal what we have or anything like that, but we agree to get out of eachothers way, as neither of us want to take money from the other.. do you guys still consider that collusion/cheating?

[2AceSuited 0]

Be prepared to get your ass kicked if you're ever caught cheating in a home game.If it was a friend who did it to me I'd kick his ass. If it was someone I didn't know, I'd probably break his nose, or worse.

[JimmyWellington 1]

The people that I play against in school are a bunch of jerks (yes, really) who bad mouth people and do a lot of retarded betting with very crap hands, they have friends with them a lot of the time and they get censored off when they lose, in other words: They are uncurtious loud-mouths. My friend and I entered a 10$ buy-in 10 man tourney and used collusion with signals. We won and split the money, I know morally this was not a good thing to do.. but to tell you the truth I don't feel the least bit bad about it. What is your take on it? Am I evil?  :evil:

Yes, what you did was wrong, and it's something that you definitely don't want to get caught at in the wrong place doing. Why you even have to ask if cheating is wrong is beyond me

[chuckf410 0]

The people that I play against in school are a bunch of jerks (yes, really) who bad mouth people and do a lot of retarded betting with very crap hands, they have friends with them a lot of the time and they get censored off when they lose, in other words: They are uncurtious loud-mouths. My friend and I entered a 10$ buy-in 10 man tourney and used collusion with signals. We won and split the money, I know morally this was not a good thing to do.. but to tell you the truth I don't feel the least bit bad about it. What is your take on it? Am I evil?  :evil:

You're young and you made a mistake. I understand where you are coming from in thinking that it's okay. But your thinking is wrong. If you have such issues with these people that you play with, stop playing. It's not like they are the only ones around that want to play poker. If you continue to play with this group, you will sink lower and lower. You won't be able to respect yourself much less get respect from others. Because cheating is simply another way of playing badly.

[ForumMod 0]

When we first began doing large tournaments at my friends house we'd have around 6 tables of 6 (little did I know how much I'd miss these short handed tournaments!) And well, there were a LOT of assholes playing.. needless to say they eventually lost there money enough that they quit coming.. a few of them that matured we would call up and ask them to come back and became good friends with them, even hanging out with them away from the table (they always play with us now, which helps profits). You'll have these problems at any poker table, I even saw it at the casino, two guys were just dicks to all the young guys at the table making snide remark as us. Needless to say I doubled up off him with Kings and made him apologize for earlier making a comment about me. If you're a young player you're going to run into these people at home games, and you're going to get berated as a "tv player" while at casino's.

[Eclypse 0]

The people that I play against in school are a bunch of jerks (yes, really) who bad mouth people and do a lot of retarded betting with very crap hands, they have friends with them a lot of the time and they get censored off when they lose, in other words: They are uncurtious loud-mouths. My friend and I entered a 10$ buy-in 10 man tourney and used collusion with signals. We won and split the money, I know morally this was not a good thing to do.. but to tell you the truth I don't feel the least bit bad about it. What is your take on it? Am I evil?  :evil:

Stop doing this right now and learn to feel bad about what you've already done.Otherwise, you are going to end up a lowlife scumbag.10 years from now, remember I said this when your wandering Freemont Street begging for quarters.

[NickTheKid 0]

Yes, you guys are right. BTW, my Signature is from Trainspotting admin, if you didn't know already. Bloody brilliant. :-)

[theresa113 0]

I felt very sad after reading this story.I had a feeling something simular to this was going on at a game I played Friday night. There were some new people in the mix, the vibe felt bad and some really weird stuff was going on. But that is all beside the point.Does anyone even know what honor is anymore? Wouldn't you want respect for yourself? Anyway, I feel sick that you do not feel any shame in this act. What would your parents think of you told them this story? OK... I guess enough guilt from me, but please think about it.

[Guest XXEddie]

so you cheated...and you asking if you were wrong.....

[Guido 0]

Just ask yourself this. How would you feel if the 'loudmouths' had done the same thing to you. I imagine you would be pretty upset if the same thing happened to you and want some sort of justice.

[CaptDrew 0]

Dude, You were way wrong.-CaptDrew

[Matt Miner 0]

you couldn't beat these idots without cheating?oh well. i like your sig too fwiw. very good film.

[Bullagio 0]

To freely admit "I don't feel the least bit bad about it' would suggest you do not have much of a conscience. Also, you describe the people you are playing with in a derogatory manner which does not reflect well on your character. :think: You've probably heard the old adage 'What goes around comes around'? - perhaps you should remember that in future.In my youth I often played poker with both friends and acquaintances, and one thing we NEVER EVER did was to collude or cheat. This message was reinforced by our elders, e.g. fathers, uncles, etc. Even the toughest of dudes observed this unwritten law. Anybody who did try and cheat or collude were swiftly dealt with, usually resulting in a beating and being banned from future games. :cry: I do hope you will learn something from the responses to this thread.

[Matt Miner 0]

i'd never cheat out of respect for the game. poker is the source of aproximitely 50% of my household income. eventually i'd like to be able to make a substantial living from the game. i would never cheat under any circumstances not only because of the moral issue but because i love the game so much. i've had one idiot acquaintance approach me a number of times about colluding. he's a losing player. i'm not. i've tried to explain to him that (as andy glazer pointed out) if you're too stupid to beat the game on the square you're probably too stupid to collude too. i've never really understood why people collude. even if you are a moral degenerate why would you try to cheat at a game where you don't have to cheat to be able to win consistently? if you want to improve your results go read super system 2 and some sklansky and then play more hours. don't collude - if not out of respect for your fellow players how about out of respect for the game - or even just out of respect for yourself? are you really too stupid to win without cheating? when you collude what you're saying to yourself is "i'm not skilled enough / smart enough to beat this game on the square so i'm going to cheat."

[Pokerghost2 0]

I agree with what everyone else is saying. Cheating is bad. Have i colluded? yes. Me and a friend got hooked up with a bookie from Bmore got him a bunch of business around our way, and he would come down once a week to settle up and party. He was always throwing money around, and so we decided to fleece him playing poker. We had signals pre and postflop, nut hand signals drawing hand hit signals the whole nine yards.We fleeced him real good every time he came down. I think when u get right down to it morally, poker is not church. A guy like our man is gonna blow all that cash somewhere why not on me? Whats 5 or 600 to a guy like that? Im sorry but when it comes to right and wrong and such, im gonna fleece a guy who makes his living on the shady side. Me and my partner have played w coke dealers bookies, and other "evil" types. And if i got a chance id do it again. Higher end games id say prolly 60 or 70% of the tables either have partners or a whole team. You have to realise with that much money to chance these guys are gonna eliminate luck as much as they can and fleece the high roller every way they can. To not believe that is naive.

[jack24bauer24 0]

Hey if it was good enough for Worm and Mike, its good enough for me.If I see a mark, I take it down, thats what I do.

[711Buddha 0]

Cheating is a horrible habit to develop. Even if you remove the question of right and wrong, the problem with cheating is that you start to look at your performance in terms of "how much better" you could have done if you had the fix in. Pretty soon, that's the only way you think and then you aren't working on your game. You're working on how to cheat better.There's the problem. Even if you are very very good, 99% good, you will get caught, and once that happens you'll never get another game. A wise man said you can shear a sheep regularly, but you can skin them only once. Learn to play poker, because when you get beat you lose a hand. If you cheat and get beat you lose the whole game.

[KDawgCometh 2]

I colluded a couple times too, but it was for a lot more money than $10. There was this jerk of a coke dealer and his friend playing with us. We coul've broke them straight up, but it would've taken much much longer. we were able to take these guys for several hundred. My reasons were because these had ripped off plenty of people in the past so this was our justification, and I'd do it again against those guys, but only those guys

[krazyjaney 0]

some of u are saying that you only "cheat" against shady people like bookies and coke dealers. what are u thinking? these are the type of people that will hurt you or kill you. a hustler can spot a hustle. i'm sure u boys don't have very sophisticated signals. if you get caught, you might end up dead. so smarten up and play straight or don't play at all. just my 2 cents.