when to stop on a lhe table

[Breaking Liberty 0]

I'm currently hit and running the .50/1 LHE tables to build my bankroll.I seem to keep running into a similiar pattern:I reach my net profit goal on two or three tables ($5-$10 at this level) and I then leave the table(s). But I always seem to have one or two tables that I start off with a bad run of cards. (Get sucked out on, miss some draws or flops, ect.) and find myself down $5-$10. I try to focus on these tables for up to a couple hours sometimes trying to get back to even and I will continue to get sucked out on, until I'm down in between 20-25BB's (I buy in with 35).Now I'm not on tilt, I'm not playing badly. I'm playing my A-game, simply variance is catching up with me. My question is though, should I stop after I loose a buy in at these tables? Or should I keep going.Suck outs and bad beats are a sign of a great table. People keep putting their money in when they are behind hand after hand.But if the cards aren't falling my way, the cards aren't falling my way. I have no defense against that other then to stop I feel.Is that what I should be doing, or should I keep buying in until the cards start to fall my way again? I hate to leave down on tables when I'm not playing badly.

[jayistheman 0]

i used to 4 table 1/2 and 2/4 and this kind of stuff would always happen.i would crush 2 of them usually, and i would run badly on one or two of them... its just variance working out concurrently really... you shouldnt consistently win as much as you do on the good tables, and you shouldnt lose as much on the bad tables... it evens out to equal an average session on one table usually.i would always leave the bad tables after a bit, simply for confidence/image issues... if you are losing, it can turn into a downward spiral of negativity... which can affect your game in a few ways.... it kills your image, and as much as you might not realize it, it can kill your confidence.

[Breaking Liberty 0]

bump

[whoomprat 0]

But if the cards aren't falling my way' date=' the cards aren't falling my way. I have no defense against that other then to stop I feel.

Put tape over your stack. It should not affect where or how you play.If the table's good and you're playing good (not nessecarily winning) keep playing. you will win.There is no way to avoid luck or variance except to quit forever

[Breaking Liberty 0]

It dosen't affect the way I play.My question is should I stop playing on the table because the cards aren't falling my way or should I keep playing on the same table where I keep getting sucked out on until I start to win. Even if it means rebuying 30 times?

[psujohn 0]

Mathematically speaking there's no such thing as "running bad". I don't mean that you won't get streaks of bad cards but rather that just because you've gotten a streak of bad cards, you're not any more or less likely to get bad cards in the future. As long as the psychological factors don't affect you - you don't tilt or start overplaying hands - there's not real reason to leave the table.On a related note, I had a friend who was a math teacher of all things who would go to the casino and watch the big wheel. The $10 should come up roughly one in 10 spins (actually more like 1 in 11 since it paid 10-1). If 12 or so spins didn't come up 10 he'd start playing it saying that "it was due". It wasn't of course since each spin has independant odds and the 10 was no more likely to come up after 12 non-10s than on any other spin. That's a long way to say that just because you've gotten a streak of bad cards it doesn't mean you're "due" for a streak of good cards.

[wizzle 0]

if the game is good, KEEP GOING. that is, if you mean it when you say you are not going on tilt when you start to run low. tilt can be very subtle, will have you folding to river bets and misplacing your aggression before you even notice that it is happening. i find putting tape over the dollar amount very unnecessary - i used to be very results-oriented like you, and what i started doing when i am getting killed at a particular table is to always rebuy to keep 30 BB on the table when i catch a bad one, reloading when i am down at least 10 BB, and it works well, erases the evidence of the bad beat you just took and within minutes it is forgotten.

[whoomprat 0]

It dosen't affect the way I play.My question is should I stop playing on the table because the cards aren't falling my way or should I keep playing on the same table where I keep getting sucked out on until I start to win. Even if it means rebuying 30 times?

Calls "fall" the same at every table. The only difference are opponents. I can't believe you can have long term success without understanding this.

[rog 0]

Hit and run is a dumb strategy. If you realize the table is too tight, or the players are mostly better than you, you should leave, up or down. If the game is ripe, and people are just dying for a chance to give you their money, you should stay wether you are up or down. The cards come randomly no matter where you sit. Sit with players you can beat, and stay as long as you think you can beat them. You dont protect your winnings by changing tables (in limit anyway) because you are just as likely to get crappy cards at the next table as at this one.Two days ago I was ready to quit poker. I dropped almost 30 BB in an hour two-tabling. It was an endless stream of middle pair flops, missed draws and second best hands. I stuck with it because the players sucked. Okay, I never got back to even in that session, but I made back about 10 BB of my losses because they all sucked. Yesterday, I went back looking for more sucky players and went on a stellar run of +20BB in only 38 hands against 2 super-lags and 7 tighties. The moral of the story is, when cards run bad, you lose money. Period. When cards run your way you make money. The worse the players you're sitting with, the more you make.

[Breaking Liberty 0]

I understand all of this. It's most of you who aren't understanding me.I know that every new hand dealt is completely unrelated (mathematically speaking) to any hand before it and any hand that will come after it.That being said I'm aware that the cards fall the same way at every table, but theoretically speaking you could flip a coin a million times and it could land on only heads or tails each time.So my question was, hoping to be answered by those of you with more experience multi-tabling online games than I have, as long as your playing right do you stay at the table until you start to win, or do you stop.But you've pretty much answered me. I'd be interested to hear from someone like.. Aki though... :wink:

[jayboogie 0]

Something to factor in when your at these tables is whether the other players are gaining confidence when playing hands with you. Are they playing you tougher and playing back at you with nothing sometimes. If you find that you are constantly losing pots, especially against bad players, very often it's because your table image is shot. They do not fear you and will play back at you more and force you to make a hand to win the pot.

[rog 0]

I understand all of this. It's most of you who aren't understanding me.I know that every new hand dealt is completely unrelated (mathematically speaking) to any hand before it and any hand that will come after it.That being said I'm aware that the cards fall the same way at every table, but theoretically speaking you could flip a coin a million times and it could land on only heads or tails each time.

If you knew all this, you wouldn't even be asking the question. If you are better than your opponents, you will make money in the long run. Your question to us is should you stick around and wait for the long run. The answer is obvious. You can wait for Aseem to say so if you like. Switching tables for reasons other than the players at the table is nothing more than superstition.

[Blumonkey 0]

If I'm reading your question right this is my answer:I As for the tables I'm winning at I usually stay there till I can't look at the screen any longer or till the table empties. As for tables I'm running bad at (even though I might be playing my A game) I will usually play one more rotation and then get up and find another table. Thats the reat thing about online poker is the amount of tables going on at once and the choice it presents you. By getting up and moving it kinda shocks my system and gives me maybe a touch more confidence plus I can establish a new table image. If that does not work then I just am content to continue and crush the tables I am doing well at and stick to those.

[screech 0]

Don't quit because your losing if you can beat the game. That's silly. Treat it like a job with a lot of variance from paycheck to paycheck.I think DN said it best when he said he used to 'play hours, not results'.

[Petoria 0]

I recently read an articled, that relates to this situation and will show why it doesnt make sense. I can't seems to find it, but it goes like this: Everytime you sit down at a table you're playing the same game you played last night, every session is really just an extension of the previous session. It doesnt matter what you leave with bc it's the same amount of money you quit with the previous night.

[Breaking Liberty 0]

I'm playing .50/1 tables. I play with retarded monkey's with a mouse and money to blow.There is no table image at this level, its purely mechanical, mathematical grinding.Let me put my question in a new light for you all:If you were playing someone heads up and you had pocket Aces every hand and he had pocket twos every hand and you were all in preflop every hand, but by the river you lost every hand, how long would you stay at the table?How many times would you rebuy? How much of your bankroll would you go through before you left the table?You’re pushing preflop with aces every hand and he's calling you with twos every hand and winning. That has nothing to do with table image. He's not afraid of you because he keeps winning? So what. He's still putting his money in when he is behind.I want people to call me down when they are behind because they sucked out on me the hand before. I'm still putting my money in when I'm ahead and it's completely unrelated to the previous hand.So would you stay at that table where you kept getting sucked out on hand after hand, until you went through your entire bankroll, or would you say to yourself: "I can't win here when I put my money in when I am ahead, I need to go some where else." What is the right thing to do?And if you haven't been in my shoes and/or you don't know the answer to my question or don't understand what I am saying, please don't even bother to respond.Thank you to those that have at least shed some bit of light on my question.

[Ninjaballz 0]

To answer your question....When I go down 15bb I will usually leave a table unless it is very juicy. At that point I just figure im running bad and take a short break from playing for a bit then find another table.

[Breaking Liberty 0]

Thanks, Ninja. That is the kinda response I'm looking for.

[rog 0]

If you were playing someone heads up and you had pocket Aces every hand and he had pocket twos every hand and you were all in preflop every hand, but by the river you lost every hand, how long would you stay at the table?

Until one of us was broke. Where am I going to find a better game than this?

How many times would you rebuy? How much of your bankroll would you go through before you left the table?

Rebuy forever. All of my bankroll.

So would you stay at that table where you kept getting sucked out on hand after hand, until you went through your entire bankroll, or would you say to yourself: "I can't win here when I put my money in when I am ahead, I need to go some where else." What is the right thing to do?

If you say that to yourself, you're better off just quitting playing poker altogether.

[whoomprat 0]

Thanks, Ninja. That is the kinda response I'm looking for.

Oh! You were looking for a totally irrational response. You DON"T understand that the deck has no memory of the prior hands because you accept advice that is based of what is dealt.Ninja-Going down 15BB? You can lose that in 2 or 3 hands? What's your average session 10 hands? I was down 65BB across two 6max tables this week and ended the session up 15BB. BY your strategy i would have ended the day down 15BB after about 15 minutes. Just terrible if you want to win playing poker.

[Breaking Liberty 0]

You DON"T understand that the deck has no memory of the prior hands because you accept advice that is based of what is dealt.

No whoomp, I do understand that. Apparently you can't read or you aren't reading what I am saying.This is all theory. It has nothing to do with the cards.Yes, each hand is completely unrelated to the previous hand.All I wanted to know is how long you would stay on a table that you kept loosing on when you were a favorite to win the hand until the river.You can sit there and tell yourself that each hand is unrelated to the last one, just because you were a favorite to win the last hand and you lost doesn’t mean you are going to loose again the next hand you put your money in as a favorite. And you will be right.But if you are constantly putting your money in has a huge favorite and getting out drawn by the river every time and you can't seem to win no matter what you, if you are willing to go through your whole bank roll because you are on a table of idiots that you know you can beat but your hands can't hold up, then in my opinion your an idiot.Sometimes you need to know when to quit. You need to accept that even though you’re doing everything right the cards aren't running your way and take a break. Waiting until you've gone through your entire BR doesn’t sound like a good time to stop.There is more to poker than math. There is luck involved in this game, good and bad. Poker is gambling. If you choose to ignore these facts, then you’re either a loosing player or probably not winning as much as you could be.

[Breaking Liberty 0]

That is all I have to say. I won't be responding to this thread any more.

[speedz99 145]

But if you are constantly putting your money in has a huge favorite and getting out drawn by the river every time and you can't seem to win no matter what you, if you are willing to go through your whole bank roll because you are on a table of idiots that you know you can beat but your hands can't hold up, then in my opinion your an idiot

Sorry, but you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. To say that you would leave a table of a bunch of idiots because of some suckouts shows that you are more into superstition than realistic probabilities and the art of making money from bad players. Wow. I can't believe you're still defending this position after everyone is telling you you're wrong.Anyways...I usually leave a table if I'm down to 12BB and would have to rebuy anyways (always have more than 12BB in case you need to cap every street). I only do this to ensure that I won't start thinking along your lines of not being able to beat the donkeys. I call it tilt prevention.Seriously though, I just moved up from .5-1 to 1-2 (go bankroll management!)...and I can tell you that if you are a good player you should be able to beat every single .5-1 table out there. Pay no attention to suckouts...just shrug them off as something that happens in poker. No one table will give you more or less bad beats than another. You need to get this through your head immediately or you have no chance to be successful.

[speedz99 145]

I reach my net profit goal on two or three tables ($5-$10 at this level) and I then leave the table(s).

And as for this strategy...it sucks also. Sorry to be harsh.Limit poker has nothing to do with reaching set goals like how many big blinds to win at a table. I'll keep bolding important sentences for you...no one hand can in any way affect the next hand. You say you understand this, but by leaving what might be a juicy table just because you won a few hands is costing you a ton of money in the long run. Don't stop posting in this thread. We're trying to help you understand a pretty important issue here...unless you want to keep losing.

[speedz99 145]

First of all, if you want to cry, go to the bad beats section. Second of all. Shut the f*ck up. If you don't have the bankroll to handle getting outdrawn on, that's your own fault. And if you don't like getting sucked out on for an entire buy in, go play limit where as someone said earlier, you get sucked out on like that four times a day and still make money. If you can't win against bad players you aren't a good player.

As a parting jab, I have quoted you from another thread.Think about it.