you must be kidding me

[Mattnxtc 0]

Ok so heres the situation....Im in a sit and go and im dealt pocket 5s. On the flop I trip up my 5s but there is now a flush draw opportunity. Two people bet and i know instantly they are drawin to the flush. So i reraise it to put both of them all in. They had bet about 50 and i raised it up to almost 1000. Both of them call chasing flush which of course the catch on the river. (wouldnt be online poker if u didnt get screwed on the river). So my question to yall is, why is online poker so bad that people will put it all on the line on a flush draw? Maybe im just crazy but im not a believer in putting all my money in when my odds of winning are less then what about 30% for them? Now usually a half way decent player wont put it on the line for a flush draw so should i chalk that up to a poor player or should i have just folded the trips knowing the flush was gonna come.

[Suited_Up 2]

Bad players. You had to make them pay to draw.

[Mattnxtc 0]

haha and if by pay you mean put them all in...Thats exactly what i did...yet i still got 2 people calling on draws...its just mind boggling... I can see why pros dont like playin amateurs..they dont seem to understand the odds

[jayistheman 0]

haha and if by pay you mean put them all in...Thats exactly what i did...yet i still got 2 people calling on draws...its just mind boggling... I can see why pros dont like playin amateurs..they dont seem to understand the odds

2 people calling on draws is more acceptable than one.... at least pot odds were better.... u shouldnt mind... the majority of the time that draw misses, you triple your stack, and win the damn thing

[justblaze 0]

which pros exactly dont like playing amateurs? You lost once on a 7 outer. wow. big deal. This isnt even a terrible beat, and the pot could very well have been laying them proper odds ( i dont know because you posted very few details about the hand, but if either of them had a nut draw, it wouldnt be TERRIBLE to call, and the 2nd caller definitely had good odds). These are exactly the type of people you want to play with all the time. The reason its called a bad play is because IT DOESNT USUALLY WORK. this means that more often than not, you will make money from these people. would you rather everyone play perfect strategic poker? it might become a little more difficult to win...

[LIPOKERPACK 0]

my theopry is that peole are more intimidated in live play than online. If they call off all their chipa on a draw and lose, they will be out of the room b4 any critcism starts, and they can sign up for another table. (This mostly applies to lower limit tourneys, cash games)

[justblaze 0]

that theory does seem to make some sense. Also, the fact that they cannot be forced to show their hands online, whereas in live play any player can request to see the cards, revealing an embarassingly bad play.

[digitalmonkey 929]

It all boils down to the fact that they don't know anything about odds and the 30% of the time they hit their flush is much more memorable than the 70% they don't.By the way, did you know...."42% of all statistics are made up" Steven Wright

[Wilderness 0]

By the way, did you know...."42% of all statistics are made up"  Steven Wright

Yeah, well I hear that 83% of people don't believe in statistics.Back to the point of this thread ... there is a bad beat section, in case you didn't know. And why get so bothered by it? People who chase longshots and don't understand odds are the ones who make you money in the long run. Besides, at least the 2nd caller may very well have had proper odds to call once the first guy calls. Even though in tournaments, you may lay down proper odds if it would knock you out of the tournament.I know you're tilting from this, and probably from the bad beats you mentioned in another thread playing 15/30, but if you can't get control of yourself mentally then you won't do well in the long run even if you are a good player.

[justblaze 0]

"42% of all statistics are made up"  

geez way to post useless info. 83% of all people already knew that.

[Wilderness 0]

geez way to post useless info. 83% of all people already knew that.

100% of people who use 83% in a fake statistic right after the poster above them used 83% in his fake statistic are jackmonkeys.

[justblaze 0]

aw nuts, i fold.

[faketree 0]

that theory does seem to make some sense. Also, the fact that they cannot be forced to show their hands online, whereas in live play any player can request to see the cards, revealing an embarassingly bad play.

two things about someone asking to see your cards:first is either change tables or tell whoever it is that it is bad etiquette to do that. which it is. unless a guy is being completely erratic and breaking poker etiquette himself, i never ask to see a losing hand. it really is in bad taste.second, quickly throw your cards in the muck. once the cards touch the muck they are dead and the dealer cannot flip them over.

[justblaze 0]

that theory does seem to make some sense. Also, the fact that they cannot be forced to show their hands online, whereas in live play any player can request to see the cards, revealing an embarassingly bad play.

two things about someone asking to see your cards:first is either change tables or tell whoever it is that it is bad etiquette to do that. which it is. unless a guy is being completely erratic and breaking poker etiquette himself, i never ask to see a losing hand. it really is in bad taste.

if you are going to switch tables every time someone asks to see your cards, you wont be sitting for long. ettiquette be damned, if its in the rules, its legal. Its free information, and i will obtain it when i see fit. Plus it has the added benefit of putting people like you who are so hung up on etiquette on tilt for no apparent reason other than that you did something dumb and i exposed it.

second, quickly throw your cards in the muck.  once the cards touch the muck they are dead and the dealer cannot flip them over.

survey says.... incorrect. Your cards can be removed from the muck and overturned as long as they are still clearly identifiable. In fact, prior to turning up cards, a dealer is REQUIRED to touch them to the muck to ensure they are dead. No player can be forced to expose live cards. Dead cards are in fact the only type of cards which can be forcibly exposed, with the exception of the player who made the last action on the river, who is forced to turn his cards up immediately. the way to prevent this is to slide them with some force into the BOTTOM of the muck so they become mixed up immediately with the stub.

[AceOfSpaiDs 0]

this happens all day every day....I see this so frequently online it's not even funny....you made the right move, if they're gonna chase, they better pay...just the few times they miss it, your stack got tripled...also, even if they get it, there is a possibility the board can pair up and u can take em down with a full boat

[Pupsta 0]

that theory does seem to make some sense. Also, the fact that they cannot be forced to show their hands online, whereas in live play any player can request to see the cards, revealing an embarassingly bad play.

[pimping]This is one of the features I love about FullTilt. If you are allin, in a tourney or a cash game, and get called, it shows both hands. On stars, this only happens in a tourney. If you reach showdown and win the hand, and the other person mucks, you can use the "last hand" feature to see what hand they had. Haven't seen another site where you can do this.[/pimping]

[faketree 0]

f you are going to switch tables every time someone asks to see your cards, you wont be sitting for long. ettiquette be damned, if its in the rules, its legal. Its free information, and i will obtain it when i see fit. Plus it has the added benefit of putting people like you who are so hung up on etiquette on tilt for no apparent reason other than that you did something dumb and i exposed it.  

that really is a shame though. you obviously don't know anything about game preservation. i remember when i started a few years ago playing the 2/4 and 3/6 levels, i would do that a lot. but once you move up in levels, people won't stand for it anymore. and you are right. it is your right. but if you start pissing everyone off at the table it can really turn into not being fun anymore.if you can't play without asking to see someones cards all the time, stick to online. its bad for the game and could turn out to be bad for you in the long run.

[iveyfan30 0]

Ok so heres the situation....Im in a sit and go and im dealt pocket 5s.  On the flop I trip up my 5s but there is now a flush draw opportunity. Two people bet and i know instantly they are drawin to the flush. So i reraise it to put both of them all in. They had bet about 50 and i raised it up to almost 1000. Both of them call chasing flush which of course the catch on the river. (wouldnt be online poker if u didnt get screwed on the river).  So my question to yall is, why is online poker so bad that people will put it all on the line on a flush draw? Maybe im just crazy but im not a believer in putting all my money in when my odds of winning are less then what about 30% for them? Now usually a half way decent player wont put it on the line for a flush draw so should i chalk that up to a poor player or should i have just folded the trips knowing the flush was gonna come.

i was also playing a sit and go on pp...was dealt aces ...first hand of the tourney.....go all in ...get a caller...he turs over j 8 off.....im laughing thinking i double up....he catches a straight....if i dont go all in with the aces i get outdrwn,, if i do go all in i get outdrawn..next time i get dealt aces preflop i swear to god im folding them...<well not really lol.

[Randy Reed 0]

Unfortunately in the smaller sng's people don't know the odds and will chase flushes all day long. I know you had trips but you didn't have to go all in even though YOU knew the odds were in your favor. I tend to just throw out a big raise like 200 and let them chase, if the flush comes you can still survive if not you've still gained a nice portion of the stack.

[justblaze 0]

f you are going to switch tables every time someone asks to see your cards, you wont be sitting for long. ettiquette be damned, if its in the rules, its legal. Its free information, and i will obtain it when i see fit. Plus it has the added benefit of putting people like you who are so hung up on etiquette on tilt for no apparent reason other than that you did something dumb and i exposed it.  

that really is a shame though. you obviously don't know anything about game preservation. i remember when i started a few years ago playing the 2/4 and 3/6 levels, i would do that a lot. but once you move up in levels, people won't stand for it anymore. and you are right. it is your right. but if you start censored everyone off at the table it can really turn into not being fun anymore.if you can't play without asking to see someones cards all the time, stick to online. its bad for the game and could turn out to be bad for you in the long run.

buddy, i play 10-20. live. I dont do it every hand. Most times, i know what they had without looking. I do it when someone does something that doesnt make sense, or makes a fold i cant figure out given what i had put them on. As for sticking to online, that would be pretty dumb as then i couldnt do it ever. And if you are suggesting someone will inflict bodily harm upon me for asking to see their cards, i think you better stop watching tilt. "you wanna see my cards? [pulls out .45 caliber hand gun] I had 45 offsuit, biatch!"

[faketree 0]

f you are going to switch tables every time someone asks to see your cards, you wont be sitting for long. ettiquette be damned, if its in the rules, its legal. Its free information, and i will obtain it when i see fit. Plus it has the added benefit of putting people like you who are so hung up on etiquette on tilt for no apparent reason other than that you did something dumb and i exposed it.  

that really is a shame though. you obviously don't know anything about game preservation. i remember when i started a few years ago playing the 2/4 and 3/6 levels, i would do that a lot. but once you move up in levels, people won't stand for it anymore. and you are right. it is your right. but if you start censored everyone off at the table it can really turn into not being fun anymore.if you can't play without asking to see someones cards all the time, stick to online. its bad for the game and could turn out to be bad for you in the long run.

buddy, i play 10-20. live. I dont do it every hand. Most times, i know what they had without looking. I do it when someone does something that doesnt make sense, or makes a fold i cant figure out given what i had put them on. As for sticking to online, that would be pretty dumb as then i couldnt do it ever. And if you are suggesting someone will inflict bodily harm upon me for asking to see their cards, i think you better stop watching tilt. "you wanna see my cards? [pulls out .45 caliber hand gun] I had 45 offsuit, biatch!"

lol. i'm not talking about someone kicking your ass. and i'm not telling you how to change how you do things. all i am saying, for me and my style of play, its better to keep all the players at my table happy and not aggravated with me. this actually saves me bets in the long run. i know some people like putting people on tilt, but there are ways to do it without upsetting the etiquette of the game. but hey, if it works for you, keep it up. but you said it yourself, for people like you and me, once you are playing 10/20 its less necessary to ask to see someones cards because your reading skills are better than a 3/6 player (hopefully). so, why do it unless it is absolutely necessary. thats just how i see it anyway.

[justblaze 0]

well one reason i might do it is to put people on tilt. To say that having people not tilting at you saves you money shows a lack of fundamental understanding of poker. You make money by other players making mistakes. Players who are on tilt make more mistakes. You want to put players on tilt. While i would not go around telling players i slept with their mothers, if asking to see their cards (something i am entitled to do) is enough to set them off, i will do it often. I love to have players gunning for me. I know they are gunning for me, but they dont know that i know. This is a huge advantage. Players will often call me down with 2nd pair because "you saw my cards i want to see your cards". the difference is they will see my cards as im dragging the pot.

[Sullyarmy 0]

well if someone folds you can't see there cards but if u call there bet and they just throw them in the muck that is bad etiquette...and you should be able to see there cards...i hate when people get called and wait for you to show them...or in a tourney 2 people go all in the cards are dealt out (for some reason where i play/played they don't flip them until all cards are dealt even if both players are all in) then they have showdown...but the people will just sit there waiting for the other to expose cards WTF SHOW YOUR CARDS IF YOU BET BE A MAN IF U GOT CAUGHT BLUFFING AND SHOW YOUR MOTHER SUCKING CARDSI HATE THAT SHIT...or they sit there and wait for you to say i've got 2 pair..and they slowly say WELL I"VE GOT THE FULL HOUSE GIVE ME THE CHIPS BITCH IM RICK JAMES BITCH

[TheIceman05 0]

f you are going to switch tables every time someone asks to see your cards, you wont be sitting for long. ettiquette be damned, if its in the rules, its legal. Its free information, and i will obtain it when i see fit. Plus it has the added benefit of putting people like you who are so hung up on etiquette on tilt for no apparent reason other than that you did something dumb and i exposed it.  

that really is a shame though. you obviously don't know anything about game preservation. i remember when i started a few years ago playing the 2/4 and 3/6 levels, i would do that a lot. but once you move up in levels, people won't stand for it anymore. and you are right. it is your right. but if you start censored everyone off at the table it can really turn into not being fun anymore.if you can't play without asking to see someones cards all the time, stick to online. its bad for the game and could turn out to be bad for you in the long run.

buddy, i play 10-20. live. I dont do it every hand. Most times, i know what they had without looking. I do it when someone does something that doesnt make sense, or makes a fold i cant figure out given what i had put them on. As for sticking to online, that would be pretty dumb as then i couldnt do it ever. And if you are suggesting someone will inflict bodily harm upon me for asking to see their cards, i think you better stop watching tilt. "you wanna see my cards? [pulls out .45 caliber hand gun] I had 45 offsuit, biatch!"

You don't want to be known as an angle-shooter, do you? Because that's what people will say. (shrug) If your goal is primarily and ONLY to make money and maximize profits, I guess being a jackass and asking to see someone's mucked hand is totally legit. But if you don't want people thinking you're an angle-shooting cheeseball, then it might not be the best thing to do.I'd do it to Annie Duke only.Ice

[faketree 0]

well one reason i might do it is to put people on tilt. To say that having people not tilting at you saves you money shows a lack of fundamental understanding of poker. You make money by other players making mistakes. Players who are on tilt make more mistakes. You want to put players on tilt. While i would not go around telling players i slept with their mothers, if asking to see their cards (something i am entitled to do) is enough to set them off, i will do it often. I love to have players gunning for me. I know they are gunning for me, but they dont know that i know. This is a huge advantage. Players will often call me down with 2nd pair because "you saw my cards i want to see your cards". the difference is they will see my cards as im dragging the pot.

like i said, if it works for you thats great. but to say that because i don't think its a good idea means i don't have a good fundamental understanding of poker is just complete nonsense. i find that people will check the river or not trying check raising me or anything else that will build the pot or be deceptive, which, when i have a marginal hand, save me many bets because maybe i get a free showdown with second pair and actually have the best hand where i may have mucked it if he bet at me.i see the advantage of having someone on tilt at my table but i am not one to send them on that tilt. i'll just recognize it and use it to my advantage instead of inducing tilt. its just my style and it works great for me. people don't need to be on tilt to make mistakes. they do it just fine on their own. lots of 'em.