negreanu eliminated....

[speedz99 145]

To be fair, I really think he was just trying to have fun with the situation.  It's unfortunate that he didn't realize how bad it looks.

Sure he was just having fun, but he also admitted to dumping to someone he knows, which is more than appearances, it's just wrong.You guys were saying all kinds of crap about dumping before you even heard his side of it and I waited to give an opinion until he spoke on it. Now that he has told his side and pretty much admitted to dumping, your backing off?seems a little backwards to me

I'm not backing off of anything. I just think that this might start to get out of hand. Your post was pretty harsh, and I'm on the fence on how bad of an offense it actually was.I dunno, it's like I said. He wasn't intentionally trying to ruin anyone's tournament or be shady, but it most certainly was a shitty thing to do and pretty unethical IMO.

[poguemahone68 0]

To be fair, I really think he was just trying to have fun with the situation.  It's unfortunate that he didn't realize how bad it looks.

Sure he was just having fun, but he also admitted to dumping to someone he knows, which is more than appearances, it's just wrong.You guys were saying all kinds of crap about dumping before you even heard his side of it and I waited to give an opinion until he spoke on it. Now that he has told his side and pretty much admitted to dumping, your backing off?seems a little backwards to me

I'm not backing off of anything. I just think that this might start to get out of hand. Your post was pretty harsh, and I'm on the fence on how bad of an offense it actually was.I dunno, it's like I said. He wasn't intentionally trying to ruin anyone's tournament or be shady, but it most certainly was a shitty thing to do and pretty unethical IMO.

I don't think it was intentionally shady either. I said in my post that I think it's that he's just out of touch and probably doesn't even see it as something that's potentially over the line.It's like all the shit talking and antagonizing Tony G. was doing on that WPT paris event. Some well respected players were saying that he was crossing the line and should have received a warning. I think this might possibly be a situation where a player crossed the line too.What do I know though, I've only been playing a few years and never have played at his level. Just calling it as I see it and I'm not sugar coating it because it's DN. I don't even know the guy and I probably know less about him than most at this site. I have usually respected him and his integrity through what I've read, seen and heard though, but this time, not so much.

[poguemahone68 0]

So, do you think my autographed shirt from DN will read something like...Here ya go, dickheadI apologize if I was a little harsh, sometimes I don't know how to shut up.

[lboarts 0]

I've refrained from commenting on this matter until I heard DN's side of the matter. And after reading his blog, I've got to say I'm a little disappointed and concerned with how this unfolded.For one, DN admitted he didn't have time to play this tournament, and yet he registered anyway. He also admitted he wouldn't have even played had he known it wasn't televised, because untelevised events draw less people. So was his plan, before even showing up to Harrah's, to build a monster stack, then sit out while he runs errands and attends to personal business, then return in the hopes he could make the final table? And how could he know it wasn't televised? What has his assistant been doing while DN has been busy with his other obligations? The whole thing leaves me confused.Secondly, he admitted he dumped chips to Alan Goering. It sounds like if Jen or E-dog was at his table, they'd have wound up with his chips. This is inherently unethical, and I'll be curious to see how the WSOP reacts to this. He admitted he knows he's going to take some flack for this, but I wonder if he knows how much.IMO, DN has too many irons in the fire, and is way too busy with his business ventures to focus on playing poker. His blog left me with the impression that he's becoming burnt out, and his attitude is going down hill. If he's not careful, he's going to start losing his fan base, which is what enabled him to land these lucrative deals with STACKED, the Wynn, etc. in the first place. He acquired his fan base by displaying tremendous skills at the poker table, so adopting an "I don't give a shit" attitude about his game will only hurt his future marketability.Another point to ponder: this tournament had a $10k buy in, and while that may be nothing to DN, that's more than most of his fans can afford to spend on a vehicle without getting a loan. So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.I still like DN, as a fan, and I hope he corrects this situation before it adversely affects him on so many fronts.

[Loismustdie 0]

I don't like it, I don't like doing it when I have done it but I have done it- there are other angles to this, alot actually. He did say that he regrets buying in, that he should not have with everything going on- now, on the other hand, if I would have gotten a phone call last night I would have been on a plane in an hour to play for him, if he really needed it. I'm good, too. Seriously, Dan, it does not need to go down like that I am your man when you need a fill in. My hand selection is better, too. ( Generally. ) :-)

[looshle 6]

Another point to ponder: this tournament had a $10k buy in, and while that may be nothing to DN, that's more than most of his fans can afford to spend on a vehicle without getting a loan. So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is. He never said the buyin is chump change, I think he was trying to say he would have done the same thing no matter the buy in.

[TheBob 0]

So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has. He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

[Loismustdie 0]

So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has. He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

Actually, that is a funny statement. I really doubt that him deciding to throw a tourney will change anyones allegiance to this site- it's a fun site, and really the fact that it's Daniels is kind of an afterthought most of the time- I usually don't even notice when he posts in his blog. That being said ten grand to some people is chump change, and that is just the way it is.

[BigDMcGee 3,367]

So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has. He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

SERIOUSLY!! I think sports fans are psycho, and WAY out of line in what they expect of their hero's. BUt at least season ticket holders can make an agrument. The people who have contributed to DN"S success are the sucker's he's busted along the way, not his fans. LMAO Get a grip.

[PocketRocks 0]

WTF is that?Maybe there's a context we don't know about.But I'm ready to just go ahead and say that DN is officially a businessman first and poker player waaaaaaaaaay second (possibly third now after husband).

Well, can you blame him? Poker can be up, down, and out (just ask Gus ) As a business man, he can make "X" amount of money doing specific things and have that guarenteed money, with gambling, there is no sure thing. It kinda sucks though because I really thought DN had a really good chance to be one of the greatest. But now it does seem that he is way to busy with everything else and that poker is on the back burner.

[Leafs 0]

Daniel I appreciate your reasoning of what you did and that it was too late for you to take your buy-in back, but I have a question for you. You got a crap hand like K4 and went in with it. What happens if you double up? You got a message saying you had to go, so if you river a King, what happens? It reminds me of the guy at my home game that starts at 9:00. He moves in every hand saying he has to pick up his sister at 10... What happens if you double through someone and have a mountain of chips? Whats the point of even playing?

[romanian_holdem 0]

he has a life too, poker isn't the most important thing ALL THE TIMEhe's not a robot, try to understand him

[alf13 0]

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has.  He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

In 2006 he will make more money off of his fans than he will from poker.....so his continued success WILL come from his fans.

[SuM827 0]

he has a life too, poker isn't the most important thing ALL THE TIMEhe's not a robot, try to understand him

First off, DN doesn't owe anything to people who post on his forum. All I was saying was that he owed it to everyone else playing in that tournament, to just get up, and and let the antes and blinds to do their work.

[lboarts 0]

So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has. He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

Reality? LMAO, you apparently have no idea how the REAL world works. My point was that DN should take care that he doesn't do anything to decrease his fan base, because that's what gives him marketability, and marketability is what enables him to land lucrative deals with companies like STACKED and the Wynn. You actually think the only fans he has are the people who post in this forum? You, sir, need to come back to reality.

[lboarts 0]

So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has. He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

SERIOUSLY!! I think sports fans are psycho, and WAY out of line in what they expect of their hero's. BUt at least season ticket holders can make an agrument. The people who have contributed to DN"S success are the sucker's he's busted along the way, not his fans. LMAO Get a grip.

There are many players who have made more than DN at the poker tables, yet not landed lucrative endorsements such as DN has. Why is that? Because DN has marketability because of his TV exposure, likable personality, and poker skills. In short, he has gained a reputation that has made him marketable, and doing anything to adversely affect that reputation will only hurt his marketability in the long run. Try not to be so close minded and you may be able to grasp the point I'm trying to make.

[kennyg1966 0]

lets say you are playing a a $200.00 buyin..tourney...and you "know" that one person is dumping chips to his friend to give him a better chance...most of the people in this forum would be pissed...true or not ????Now the fact that it was Dn now makes it OK to some of you...I have the upmost respect for DN...now perhaps the emergency that needed his attention clouded his judgement a little I don't know!!

[Allie 0]

So telling his minions that the buyin is chump change (not his words, mine) will only serve to isolate him further from the very people that have helped him to become the huge success that he is.

How about you come back to reality? You've done nothing to contribute to his success. No one on this forum has. He's a success because he plays poker well not because people post on his forum.

Reality? LMAO, you apparently have no idea how the REAL world works. My point was that DN should take care that he doesn't do anything to decrease his fan base, because that's what gives him marketability, and marketability is what enables him to land lucrative deals with companies like STACKED and the Wynn. You actually think the only fans he has are the people who post in this forum? You, sir, need to come back to reality.

I totally agree with lboats on this. I don't think when he said "fans", he just meant people who post at FCP...lol. Daniel has enjoyed a pretty big fan base, including but not limited to FCP......and by his own admission is more involved with things like Stacked and his new DVD than poker. Who exactly is going to buy Stacked and the new DVD? His fans. And why are they his fans? Because they think he's a great poker player, and a good guy. Because he seems so accessible and personable. So...his success is borne of great poker accomplishments, and a large fan base. And he's banking on that to sell video games and DVD's....not to win friends and influence people...but to MAKE MONEY. So, if he wants to continue to being able to view 10K as "chump change"....he might want to remember how he got here in the first place. By playing great poker and secondarily, by extension...winning the popularity of the fans.

[Wingmaster05 0]

obvious daniel didn't make a prior arrangement with this guy, unless his character is completely different then the one he displays here. How many times have you seen donkeys get bored or w/e in the beginning of a tournament and just go all in? It doesn't matter whether it was a bad play or not, whoever gets a very big hand has a perfect chance to double up. Fair? Sure. Unlucky for whoever didn't get the cards to call. This got me thinking...how does chip dumping work? Wouldn't the "dumper" (haha, how degrading for that person) wait until the final round of betting so as to avoid a miracle card, and thus knocking out your boss? That would be pretty obvious, but it secures who get's the chips. Imagine organizing a mass team to dump chips to you throughout the tournament, you pay this guy X amount of money (nothing compared to what you should make), and then he hits a 3 outer and goes on to win the event!

[elkang 0]

I asked Daniel (in between his busy MTV shoot) if he was going to play at the Harrah's circuit event and he quickly said yes. I didn't get the chance to follow up with the TV coverage issues (and others going on at Harrah's) and perhaps this all could have been avoided. It was a small event and not very well produced in my opinion. There is NO TV coverage here until the end and it will be a handheld camera crew. This is a horrible thing to do as a business as these decisions get announced just a week or two before the event.I was there and let me say that Daniel was playing crazy the entire time. My camera could not keep up with him. I should have just used the flash and gotten all 1001 Daniel Negreanu faces. Personally, I feel it's shame the Image Masters photo crew (now owned by Harrah's) didn't go shutterbug crazy there.Anyway, DN played loose and crazy. Every hand. All-in at least 6-7 times.Jen Harmon also decided to play (since everyone in the Bellagio game was kinda there) and played quite loosely. Repeatedly getting lucky at the end when she clearly wanted to go home. Minh Ly got knocked out in the first hand after making his buy-in.There's a pattern here... all these guys have better things to do and lots of money. Who cares about a $10K buy in when the blinds in your big game are $12K?? Anyway, there are many other things in poker to complain about than Daniel having some fun with a big buy in tourney, and I hope more of you realize that.

[Wingmaster05 0]

All I was saying was that he owed it to everyone else playing in that tournament, to just get up, and and let the antes and blinds to do their work.

He doesn't owe that to anyone. So if you bought in a tournament for chump change (whatever tht is for you. 1 dollar or 30 dollars, or somewhere in the middle, pick one) and you realize you have to do something important. You think you can get back in time to play if you get some chips. Do youA) pick up and leave, guaranteeing no chance at victory. B) Go all in as many times as you can, hope to triple up and then leave, knowing you should still have enough chips to cash later.I know B is what i've done in the past, and what i would do if the same situation presented itself again.

[speedz99 145]

All I was saying was that he owed it to everyone else playing in that tournament, to just get up, and and let the antes and blinds to do their work.

He doesn't owe that to anyone. So if you bought in a tournament for chump change (whatever tht is for you. 1 dollar or 30 dollars, or somewhere in the middle, pick one) and you realize you have to do something important. You think you can get back in time to play if you get some chips. Do youA) pick up and leave, guaranteeing no chance at victory. B) Go all in as many times as you can, hope to triple up and then leave, knowing you should still have enough chips to cash later.I know B is what i've done in the past, and what i would do if the same situation presented itself again.

You're missing the point, which is the fact that he made the ridiculous moves against a friend. This is borderline chip dumping.

[Wingmaster05 0]

gotcha speedy. i gotta stop reading the first page of a post and then begin posting. I missed a lot of important details. I don't see the point of arguing any more until Daniel says his side, although he already has, kinda. We can make this a 20 page **** fight if necessary, i know this forum has been itching for a monster subject...let's hope not

[elkang 0]

I think the debate here is between these three things:Ethics. Etiquette. Rules.Daniel did not break any rules. That is clear. The TD would have to do something.Daniel is pushing etiquette. I mean who else does what he does? But, I think what he does is great. What a character! Now of course I also realize that he annoys some people to no end. But, such is as it is with etiquette. One man likes his tea with milk and sugar and another plain. I like mine with madelines.As for ethics... like so much in poker, the game of limited information, this is unknown. If we knew Daniel's heart we would see the truth but no one knows that but God. People fool themselves too - so I'm serious about the God part, and certainly some random guy on the internet WHO WASN'T EVEN THERE should not be so bold to make any judgements.I'll talk to Martin de Knijff later about the hand. He was not at the table but he has spoken publically about ethical and etiquette matters before. Also, I'd ask Paul Phillips on the ethics side -- but he's not around (but his friends are).

[Wingmaster05 0]

by the way speedz, super troopers is the funniest movie I've seen in years. Is broken lizard coming out with another comedy? club dread was decent, but not of the same caliber of humor as their first movie.