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should there be drug testing for the wsop?


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What would drug testing accomplish in poker???
Maybe the greatest poker player alive would have straightened himself out before going out like a chump. Maybe we would have got to see years and years of Ungar playing. Wouldn't that be something for poker.In the immortal words of Napoleon Dynamite: IDIOTS!
Yes, I bet Ungar would have stopped using if poker regulated drug testing. His nose melting away, and his health deteriorating to the point of barely being able to function didn't deter him, but i'm sure testing would have.
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I've never used an illegal drug in my life, and even I think it's a lame suggestion. Also, from a strictly "+EV" point of view, who hasn't won significant pots off of opponents that were drunk? I say, as long as they don't vomit all over me or start fights, let 'em be on steroids, coke, heroin, weed, speed, super-size fries, and 10 pounds of sugar. More money for the rest of us.

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Blah... i got tired of reading the posts on the second page.Yeah, buddy, you're an awesome debater! You open the thread with an open accusation that Matusow has been snorting coke because he was once caught with coke? Am I going out on a limb to say that you don't know the full story (as most don't, aside from Mike and his good friends)?
Don't you see how there wouldn't even be speculation if there were testing?I'm not saying he was. That was a suspicous video but inconclusive. I just don't want to hear about it and HONESTLY think it would be a good thing if we kept the drunks and user off the tables. Even if it means losing producers and some excellent talent.
Ridiculous. It's just a game. A game in which people put up THEIR OWN money. I don't even touch any drugs aside from alcohol and I would not play in any event where I was told I could put up my own $10k for the opportunity to get censored tested. Invasion of privacy. These aren't pros under a contract making millions. It's some guys putting up their own money, GAMBLING that they can win more.
Fair but the WSOP is supposedly about winning braclets and being the best. I think to recognize the distinction there should be standards set. And again poker is being pushed mainstream by the pros.
Get your morals out of my business. You have yours, others have theirs, I have mine. If some guy thinks he is going to help himself by using a highly addictive and threatening drug, fine. I'm not too worried about it.
Should there be drug testing in the olympics? Simple question.
I do'nt know what type of people you hang around that have told themselves coke will help them focus, but you're wrong. That's so rare, it's ridiculous. The only drugs that could possibly help are those that are prescribed to persons suffering from ADD or ADHD.
Meth isn't perscribed for ADD or ADHD so it doesn't help? you're just wrong - coke can help in a game where you need to put in long hours.
I may be wrong, but I don't believe the USCF tests their players (professional chess) at tournaments. That is a much better comparison than football and poker.
Then how am I so out to lunch if chess players are already doing it.
You're being ridiculous, and backing it up by a "Holier Than Thou" attitude. Tone it down. Come back to Earth. You are better than no one.
Perhaps the holier than thou attitude comes from the piss-ants that think they own this place and the discussions that can take place in it.
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trying to use the law to protect you to do something illegal
I don't recall saying anything about the law. I said that to me, testing me to gamble is an invasion of privacy. Are you saying that every citizen in the United States should have to succumb to mandatory random drug testing because drugs are illegal? You don't see anything wrong with that? You don't see that as totalitarian in any way?It's not a double standard (in fact, that phrase doesn't even make sense the way you were using it) to say that I should not be tested for drugs unless my employer wishes to do so. I do not blame an employer for wanting their employees to be clean when on the job. Poker players are not employees. I still can't quite understand what the hell you are talking about. Hopefully I accidentally addressed it.
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ugh we're just on different pages right now..if my head clears in a bit, I'll try to explain. I see what you're saying about every person being tested though. I'm still not sure on how I feel about drug testing for the WSOP. I do however think it's a valid question.

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no, but there should be drug testing for posting on this forum.
Potentially the most truthful thing said on this site in the last 2 weeks....and it comes from Mexico, Who woulda thought?? :-)
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I don't think the big question is wether or not it gives players an advantage. I think the bigger question is should it be done to clean up poker's image and the fact that they are being idolized now.
If the best player in the world was a complete degenrate methhead (I doubt this is possible)Who are we to take that away from that individual based on how we think others will be affected. Personally I always thought Daniel Baldwin went to far during that wpt game. So I believe standards of behavior should be the real issue here. Let the IOC decide on the drug issue someday. Imho.
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Blah... i got tired of reading the posts on the second page.Yeah, buddy, you're an awesome debater! You open the thread with an open accusation that Matusow has been snorting coke because he was once caught with coke? Am I going out on a limb to say that you don't know the full story (as most don't, aside from Mike and his good friends)?
Don't you see how there wouldn't even be speculation if there were testing?I'm not saying he was. That was a suspicous video but inconclusive. I just don't want to hear about it and HONESTLY think it would be a good thing if we kept the drunks and user off the tables. Even if it means losing producers and some excellent talent.
Ridiculous. It's just a game. A game in which people put up THEIR OWN money. I don't even touch any drugs aside from alcohol and I would not play in any event where I was told I could put up my own $10k for the opportunity to get censored tested. Invasion of privacy. These aren't pros under a contract making millions. It's some guys putting up their own money, GAMBLING that they can win more.
Fair but the WSOP is supposedly about winning braclets and being the best. I think to recognize the distinction there should be standards set. And again poker is being pushed mainstream by the pros.
Get your morals out of my business. You have yours, others have theirs, I have mine. If some guy thinks he is going to help himself by using a highly addictive and threatening drug, fine. I'm not too worried about it.
Should there be drug testing in the olympics? Simple question.
I do'nt know what type of people you hang around that have told themselves coke will help them focus, but you're wrong. That's so rare, it's ridiculous. The only drugs that could possibly help are those that are prescribed to persons suffering from ADD or ADHD.
Meth isn't perscribed for ADD or ADHD so it doesn't help? you're just wrong - coke can help in a game where you need to put in long hours.
I may be wrong, but I don't believe the USCF tests their players (professional chess) at tournaments. That is a much better comparison than football and poker.
Then how am I so out to lunch if chess players are already doing it.
You're being ridiculous, and backing it up by a "Holier Than Thou" attitude. Tone it down. Come back to Earth. You are better than no one.
Perhaps the holier than thou attitude comes from the censored-ants that think they own this place and the discussions that can take place in it.
You are creating a problem. You are saying you think drugs run rampant in poker. That is completely unsubstantiated, so your whole argument is a wash. Poker is getting pushed mainstream by the media and us as consumers. Pay attention.The Olympics are not related to poker. In any way. Poker is not a sport, so forget that. Poker is just a game of chance and skill. I said chess players ARE NOT TESTED. Read carefully.You are coming off as a "piss-ant" by not listening to any argument, but rather saying we are all "piss-ants". You sound like you want to control peoples lives, and I wholly disagree with that -- vehemently. By the way, all of the sudden deciding to test all players would create a media frenzy that paints all poker players as druggies. Think of the backlash. You want a holier than thou attitude in this thread, you got it buddy. You obviously didn't think about this at all. You should probably just stop. Now.
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Blah... i got tired of reading the posts on the second page.Yeah, buddy, you're an awesome debater! You open the thread with an open accusation that Matusow has been snorting coke because he was once caught with coke? Am I going out on a limb to say that you don't know the full story (as most don't, aside from Mike and his good friends)?
Don't you see how there wouldn't even be speculation if there were testing?I'm not saying he was. That was a suspicous video but inconclusive. I just don't want to hear about it and HONESTLY think it would be a good thing if we kept the drunks and user off the tables. Even if it means losing producers and some excellent talent.
Ridiculous. It's just a game. A game in which people put up THEIR OWN money. I don't even touch any drugs aside from alcohol and I would not play in any event where I was told I could put up my own $10k for the opportunity to get censored tested. Invasion of privacy. These aren't pros under a contract making millions. It's some guys putting up their own money, GAMBLING that they can win more.
Fair but the WSOP is supposedly about winning braclets and being the best. I think to recognize the distinction there should be standards set. And again poker is being pushed mainstream by the pros.
Get your morals out of my business. You have yours, others have theirs, I have mine. If some guy thinks he is going to help himself by using a highly addictive and threatening drug, fine. I'm not too worried about it.
Should there be drug testing in the olympics? Simple question.
I do'nt know what type of people you hang around that have told themselves coke will help them focus, but you're wrong. That's so rare, it's ridiculous. The only drugs that could possibly help are those that are prescribed to persons suffering from ADD or ADHD.
Meth isn't perscribed for ADD or ADHD so it doesn't help? you're just wrong - coke can help in a game where you need to put in long hours.
I may be wrong, but I don't believe the USCF tests their players (professional chess) at tournaments. That is a much better comparison than football and poker.
Then how am I so out to lunch if chess players are already doing it.
You're being ridiculous, and backing it up by a "Holier Than Thou" attitude. Tone it down. Come back to Earth. You are better than no one.
Perhaps the holier than thou attitude comes from the censored-ants that think they own this place and the discussions that can take place in it.
You still haven't answered the question we have asked you. What are the effective positive results that would come about by enforcing drug testing for the ME. Don't give your opinion, give factual information and data to back it up. You will also need to show the current state in which it exists today and once you have your data compiled from field research and comparitive analysis, come back to us and we'll listen. Other than that, you are just enforcing your own opinion and that is not arguing effectively, that is being self absorbed in your own moral dilemas.
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Thank you. I would like to know how any of these people know that any player is actually doing or has done drugs. Someone saying they did is not proof, they may very well have been lying. This is where the original OP and his supporter have lost track and made assumptions.
I've made no assuptions other than saying drugs can enhance the concentration, stamina and focus of a poker player, and that is supported by medical evidence.(or they wouldn't let pilots take billion dollar jets out all hoped up on the stuff.)
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I don't think the big question is wether or not it gives players an advantage. I think the bigger question is should it be done to clean up poker's image and the fact that they are being idolized now.
If the best player in the world was a complete degenrate methhead (I doubt this is possible)Who are we to take that away from that individual based on how we think others will be affected. Personally I always thought Daniel Baldwin went to far during that wpt game. So I believe standards of behavior should be the real issue here. Let the IOC decide on the drug issue someday. Imho.
I see what you're saying and the athlete/celebrity/role model argument could go on forever with no real conclusion. If it's illegal we can already do something about it.
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You still haven't answered the question we have asked you. What are the effective positive results that would come about by enforcing drug testing for the ME. Don't give your opinion, give factual information and data to back it up. You will also need to show the current state in which it exists today and once you have your data compiled from field research and comparitive analysis, come back to us and we'll listen. Other than that, you are just enforcing your own opinion and that is not arguing effectively, that is being self absorbed in your own moral dilemas.
cute. :roll:
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You still haven't answered the question we have asked you. What are the effective positive results that would come about by enforcing drug testing for the ME. Don't give your opinion, give factual information and data to back it up. You will also need to show the current state in which it exists today and once you have your data compiled from field research and comparitive analysis, come back to us and we'll listen. Other than that, you are just enforcing your own opinion and that is not arguing effectively, that is being self absorbed in your own moral dilemas.
cute. :roll:
Is it cute because it's so dead-on? I'm not sure you understand how you are hurting yourself in this debate. Unfortunately, I have to go to work. Carry on Socrates.
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So let me get this straight, there is no proof of drugs being used during the WSOP and you had this idea to test for drugs because poker is getting bigger and bigger? People need to take responsibility for themselves and stop blaming bad role models or whatever else as an excuse. If Matusow wins and his past is reveiled, so what? He is what he is, if you don't like it too bad. Why must we constrain everything into this perfect politically correct bubble? As far as drugs helping players during play..... umm yeah this is another one of those things ya kinda have to show evidence of. God this is rediculous stop wasting so much time about what other people do that has no affect whatsoever on your life and concentrate on something that can benefit you in the future, say your game for instance. :club:

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I don't think the big question is wether or not it gives players an advantage. I think the bigger question is should it be done to clean up poker's image and the fact that they are being idolized now.
If the best player in the world was a complete degenrate methhead (I doubt this is possible)Who are we to take that away from that individual based on how we think others will be affected. Personally I always thought Daniel Baldwin went to far during that wpt game. So I believe standards of behavior should be the real issue here. Let the IOC decide on the drug issue someday. Imho.
I see what you're saying and the athlete/celebrity/role model argument could go on forever with no real conclusion. If it's illegal we can already do something about it.
If ppl are breakin laws by all means enforce the law. Casinos and card clubs don't like to do this all the time from my observation. Maybe they should. No more be nice and ask them to leave or escort them out. I would be cool with that...
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You are creating a problem. You are saying you think drugs run rampant in poker. That is completely unsubstantiated, so your whole argument is a wash.
Where did I say drugs are rampant in poker?
Poker is getting pushed mainstream by the media and us as consumers. Pay attention.
That's why Doyle is offering to buy the WPT, DN is pushing stacked and FullTilt is creating live made for TV events. You need to come back to reality on this one.
The Olympics are not related to poker. In any way. Poker is not a sport, so forget that. Poker is just a game of chance and skill.I said chess players ARE NOT TESTED. Read carefully.
Most games are of chance and skill - you think poker should exsist outside the rest of the world. Which is a fair and valid opinion, but then you shouldn't watch the WSOP and stick to backroom games and championchips built by road gamblers. Cancel your ESPN subscription.
You are coming off as a "censored-ant" by not listening to any argument, but rather saying we are all "censored-ants". You sound like you want to control peoples lives, and I wholly disagree with that -- vehemently.
I don't want to control anybody. I just don't want to hear that there are users participating in poker tournaments as its just unhealthy for the sport. And there is consistant evidence of other sports/games (there is no real distinction when it becomes entertainment) taking the same action.
By the way, all of the sudden deciding to test all players would create a media frenzy that paints all poker players as druggies. Think of the backlash. You want a holier than thou attitude in this thread, you got it buddy. You obviously didn't think about this at all. You should probably just stop. Now.
You don't think this would be applauded by the media - its all how you sell it. I wouldn't get you to sell it thats for sure. It'd take one phychoatic episode to change this whole thing . . .Yea
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I agree with the OP. The players at the homegame I play at get MUCH harder when we're all drunk. Well, maybe that's because I'm drunk. Either way, it creates and unfair advantage. Alcoholics like myself need to be protected from these vultures.

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I am not reading this thread but let's get one thing straight...Poker is not/will not ever be considered a sport.Sports require physical skill and there is minimal to no luck involved.

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Is it cute because it's so dead-on? I'm not sure you understand how you are hurting yourself in this debate.Unfortunately, I have to go to work. Carry on Socrates.
Yeah because producing a thesis on this really clears it. up. Give your head a shake and don't hide behind weak arguments.
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meth=speedRitalin/Aderol=The Best of pharmaceutical speed....Avsfan hates these.btw if you take Ritalin and aren't hyperactive your a moron. Stop Your just turning your self into a hyper spazz.

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I am not reading this thread but let's get one thing straight...Poker is not/will not ever be considered a sport.Sports require physical skill and there is minimal to no luck involved.
Then lets call it entertainment from here on out, because that is what it is.
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I am not reading this thread but let's get one thing straight...Poker is not/will not ever be considered a sport.Sports require physical skill and there is minimal to no luck involved.
Word! It is a game and not calling it a game is a diservice to other games. Sports are just athletic games.
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