medium to semibig pocket pairs

[sirch1 0]

Allright so lately I have been playing more nolimit than limit and i seem to keep having the same problem. I keep getting involved in pots with medium pair like 8's through j's only to lose to a higher pocket pair. Situation25 no limit i am on the button and 4 seat raises to a dollar and I smoth call with pocket tens. The flop bring all low cards with no straight or flush possibilities. The original raiser will bet and then i will raise usually to around 4 dollars or so. Turn and river bring blanks and eventually i lose the hand and pay dude off with jacks or somethins higher.Am i overplaying my hands or just not seeing the warning signs of my opponets good hands? A dollar bet is pretty common in these games. You see people raise a dollar with 68 suited so you can't really put somebody on anything wiith this type of raise.How do you guys think you should play hands like these? Should you reraise the raiser preflop to try to put him on a hand and then play the flop cautiouslly if he calls or smooth call and then put a raise in on the flop or turn? Basically I am asking what are the best ways to determine if you have the best pocketpair and not end up paying somebody off with your pair on a harmless flop?

[tripOne 0]

Re-raising pre-flop is your best bet in getting an idea of your opponent's strength IMO. If he comes back over the top, you can be pretty sure you have a coinflip at best when holding a med pair. If he just calls and you have position, you should be able to get an idea from his post-flop actions where he is at. If you are out of position, lead out with a small "feeler" bet to get a reaction and take it from there (unless of course you hit your set)....I also tend to stay away from a big pre-flop raise with med-pairs. Good luck.

[snakster 0]

I'm no expert.That said, if he bets the flop and you raise, and he calls; I'd be a little concerned that my medium pair may not be good. If the turn is another low blank and he leads out again, I'd be pretty certain, in the abstract, that he had a high pair. I'd probably cut my losses.The raise on the flop should be of sufficient amount to guage his hand. An easy call should get the warning lights flashing.But like I said, I'm no expert. Just my 2 cents.

[budfox427 0]

don't smooth call 10's or better pre-flop. Reraise strong. If you get a call, bet out on the turn if you are first to act--pot sized bet should do it. If you get called, or reraised, you should get real suspicious.This should usually work against TAG players. You have to showdown with maniacs most of the time with pocket 10s on an low uncoordinated board.

[sirch1 0]

I'm no expert.That said, if he bets the flop and you raise, and he calls; I'd be a little concerned that my medium pair may not be good. If the turn is another low blank and he leads out again, I'd be pretty certain, in the abstract, that he had a high pair. I'd probably cut my losses.The raise on the flop should be of sufficient amount to guage his hand. An easy call should get the warning lights flashing.But like I said, I'm no expert. Just my 2 cents.

I usually don't raise preflop I don't know why but i put in a raise on the flop is this bad?

[sirch1 0]

don't smooth call 10's or better pre-flop. Reraise strong. If you get a call, bet out on the turn if you are first to act--pot sized bet should do it. If you get called, or reraised, you should get real suspicious.This should usually work against TAG players. You have to showdown with maniacs most of the time with pocket 10s on an low uncoordinated board.

when you say reraise strong how strong do you mean. Should I raise the size of the pot double or what?

[budfox427 0]

in the hand above, there should be $1.75 in the pot or so, with $1 to you to call. I would bet $$2.50-$3, or 5-6X bb (assuming you are playing .25-.50 NL tables). This is a true sign of strength to me. A lot of times you will take the pot down right there, which is a good thing with med-pocket pairs.

[sirch1 0]

I sometimes play .25 .50 but since my bankroll took a hit I have been playing .10 .25 . Anyways thanks for the help guys

[benhoug 0]

I usually don't raise preflop I don't know why but i put in a raise on the flop is this bad?

YES that is BAD. You must raise pre-flop w/ big hands. If you don't you're letting anyone who wants to into the pot. W/ a pre-flop raise you'll get the blinds out if they're holding a weak hands like J6, or Q4. Those sound like harmless hands until the flop comes down J62 or Q42, then your AA, KK, QQ, 10 10 are worhtless and you lose a huge pot. Not raising w/ big hands is a big, big mistake. Period.

[sirch1 0]

I usually don't raise preflop I don't know why but i put in a raise on the flop is this bad?

YES that is BAD. You must raise pre-flop w/ big hands. If you don't you're letting anyone who wants to into the pot. W/ a pre-flop raise you'll get the blinds out if they're holding a weak hands like J6, or Q4. Those sound like harmless hands until the flop comes down J62 or Q42, then your AA, KK, QQ, 10 10 are worhtless and you lose a huge pot. Not raising w/ big hands is a big, big mistake. Period.

You misunderstood what i was saying i meant that i don't reraise someone with these middle to big pairs i merely just call and wait for the flop.

[budfox427 0]

You are still going to get callers at the stakes we play at, but then you have the upperhand because they will know you are strong from the get go. Be ready to fold if any paint comes out and you get reraised on the turn though. You won't win every hand this way, but over the long run, this should be +EV.

[benhoug 0]

I usually don't raise preflop I don't know why but i put in a raise on the flop is this bad?

YES that is BAD. You must raise pre-flop w/ big hands. If you don't you're letting anyone who wants to into the pot. W/ a pre-flop raise you'll get the blinds out if they're holding a weak hands like J6, or Q4. Those sound like harmless hands until the flop comes down J62 or Q42, then your AA, KK, QQ, 10 10 are worhtless and you lose a huge pot. Not raising w/ big hands is a big, big mistake. Period.

You misunderstood what i was saying i meant that i don't reraise someone with these middle to big pairs i merely just call and wait for the flop.

Sorry... In any case, I think it's a good idea to re-raise w/ AQ and higher pre-flop. In my experience people will raise with a wide range of hands. If you re-raise w/ AQ, AK, JJ, QQ, KK, or AA and the original raiser has a hand like KQ, KJ, QJ, K10, A10, A9, etc he'll likely lay the hand down 'cause he knows it's no good (if he's a decent player). Conversely, if he has AA, or KK he'll let you know when he moves in over the top of you.

[mbreon 0]

Well you definitely need to learn how to raise/re-raise preflop to be successful....taking control of pots is an extremely valuable tool.

[SabaAba 0]

I don't think people have given you good advice in my opinion. When you have 66-TT, in position, I think you should never raise preflop. You are now disguising your strength and the preflop raiser has no idea what you have. Essentially, you are trying to hit a set, and if you don't, you are trying to either steel the pot or make it as cheap as possible to win if the board is all undercards. The hand you gave as an example for instance, you played preflop fine. When the board comes all low cards and he bets out, you need to raise. If the pot is $2.40 (.15sb+.25bb+$1 JJ+$1 you), he leads out say $2, you should make it $5 and not $4. If he calls, you need to be careful, but since you are in position, I would expect him to check and then I would bet $5 again on turn with the intention of folding to a reraise or checking the river for a free showdown. The benefit of being in position.The fact is, in the .15/.25 NL level, people are not good enough to lay JJ down with a 269 rainbow board. And you are trying to get a cheap showdown but not loosing control of the hand.The thing I don't like about reraising, is that if he reraises, you have to fold and then loose one of the best ways to double up with a set especially if he has AA or KK. Also, mid pairs are not that great, reraising preflop and maybe winning the blnds and his $1 is not as profitable as if you hit your hand and can win big. pocket pairs should be played primarily for sets and primarily to win huge pots, don't try win blinds and a $1 raise with 77-TT, not worth it.

[LongOdds 0]

I don't think people have given you good advice in my opinion.  When you have 66-TT, in position, I think you should never raise preflop. You are now disguising your strength and the preflop raiser has no idea what you have. Essentially, you are trying to hit a set, and if you don't, you are trying to either steel the pot or make it as cheap as possible to win if the board is all undercards.  The hand you gave as an example for instance, you played preflop fine. When the board comes all low cards and he bets out, you need to raise. If the pot is $2.40 (.15sb+.25bb+$1 JJ+$1 you), he leads out say $2, you should make it $5 and not $4. If he calls, you need to be careful, but since you are in position, I would expect him to check and then I would bet $5 again on turn with the intention of folding to a reraise or checking the river for a free showdown. The benefit of being in position.The fact is, in the .15/.25 NL level, people are not good enough to lay JJ down with a 269 rainbow board. And you are trying to get a cheap showdown but not loosing control of the hand.The thing I don't like about reraising, is that if he reraises, you have to fold and then loose one of the best ways to double up with a set especially if he has AA or KK. Also, mid pairs are not that great, reraising preflop and maybe winning the blnds and his $1 is not as profitable as if you hit your hand and can win big. pocket pairs should be played primarily for sets and primarily to win huge pots, don't try win blinds and a $1 raise with 77-TT, not worth it.

Very good advice. If you are not in position, you should mix up your play preflop. A small raise is acceptable, if you are capable of folding to a reraise. At other times, limping is fine. Once the flop comes out, these hands generally play themselves. If you hit, depending on your opponent(s) you should either make a small raise (hoping for that reraise), or check (if the board is completely non-threatening, i.e., no 4 to a flush, etc.) if you are trying to trap. If you miss the set, but there are no overcards, you should make a healthy bet (60-80% of the pot). A reraise means you fold. A cold call means you are likely in trouble (if you are playing good players), or you are up against a calling station willing to call that bet with a low top pair or second pair (excellent news). When the undercards come, you are looking to win the pot right there. If the flop comes with overcards, you should generally check and fold to any raise (well, not any raise, but most raises). This is, in my opinion, a +EV approach to playing these middle pocket pairs out of position.