2016 Elections

[Balloon guy 158]

Boeing builds a lot of military stuff.

 

Congress passed a law a long time ago that our military hardware must be built in the US so we have internal production should a war arise with anyone. We don't want to find out we can't finish the tank we need because the turrets are made in China and we can't ship them here because of enemy sinking cargo ships.

 

Therefore it is illegal for Boeing to build major parts for planes, tanks, drones etc. in another country.

 

To use them as an example compared to Ford moving manufacturing to Mexico is silly.

 

And Tesla sells about the same number of cars a year as my local Ford dealer does. Bit of an exaggeration, but they are a tiny player, hardly an example of behemoths of manufacturing. Add to it they run a net loss without government subsidies, and have a very short future without government subsidies. Elon Musk is all hat no cattle.

 

And "That's not how a piggy bank works" Really? Trump doesn't even know how a piggy bank works, you know you stick money into it to store it, or on an adult scale, you take your profits you need to protect from a communist regime and buy land and other tangible goods to protect them from being stolen by your own government......hey wait a minute...that's just like a piggy bank.....

 

But my favorite is that China isn't manipulating their currency as proven by the Chinese government currently propping up their currency because of economic issues....hey wait a minute..that's ALSO a lot like what currency manipulation is.

 

Truth is when you try to disprove China manipulating their currency, you are required to lie because that's what they've done for decades now. The only people who don't know that are the uninformed, and liberal economist apparently.

 

Which is another example of why the people Bob gets to tell us why Trump isn't right about economics are idiots, or just lying with full knowledge.

 

You pick which one they are.

 

Are they too stupid to know things a balloon guy who never went to high school knows?

 

Or are they lying because they expect you to be too stupid to know what a balloon guy who never went to high school knows?

 

Either way, they are wrong again.

[Balloon guy 158]

I wonder what Mitt Romney was thinking last night watching that mess.

 

Probably spent most the night realizing that the guy he said wasn't as good as him made 3 times Romney's net worth in one year.

 

Then he spewed nonsense to his wife until she left the room.

[Balloon guy 158]

Personally I think the debate was a bore fest.

 

Hillary didn't collapse or have a seizure.

 

Trump didn't start screaming anf foaming at mouth.

 

 

Hillary called Trump Racist, misogynistic, and angry

 

Trump called her Secretary.

 

Lester Holt asked Trump about Tax returns, Birther charge, and comments on women.

 

He asked Hillary aboutTrump's tax returns, Trump's birther charge and Trump's comments on women.

 

He fact checked Trump 4 or 5 times, Hillary zero. Even after she said Trump believes Global Warming is a Russian Plot????? Man she's kooky.

 

Got his fact checks wrong, like Stop and Frisk being settled in courts.

 

And at end of night, most polls showed Trump won slightly, CNN had a landslide for Hillary ( let that sick in for a second )

 

But I was bored, no real meat, no real sound bites.

 

Bore fest.

[brvheart 1,758]

The CNN poll that showed Hillary won was a group of 521 people that they had preselected. 41% claimed to be democrats, 26% claimed to be republicans. That's why the numbers were so skewed.

[Dubey 1,035]

Trump did say that he believes Climate change is a hoax propagated by the Chinese. His campaign deleted the tweet from 2013 during the debates last night though.

[brvheart 1,758]

Do you have the clip or tweet or whatever where he says that global warming isn't happening or doesn't exist? Because you can think that the Chinese are manipulating something without making a truth claim to something else.

[Dubey 1,035]

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/265895292191248385?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

 

"The concept of global warming was created by and for the Chinese in order to make U.S. manufacturing non-competitive."

 

 

there have been a handful of other tweets and soundbites over the last few years where he explicitly called climate change a hoax as well/

[Balloon guy 158]

I doubt they masterminded the global warming scam, that's more in Algore's bailiwick since he profited so much from the scam.

 

But China was exempt from Kyoto treaty, and would have won bigly from the implementation of Kyoto. Good thing President Clinton rejected Kyoto.

 

 

Made Hillary look kooky though. Nobody but far left nutcases buy that kid of stuff. Glad she said it, made independents more likely to ignore the rest of her 'claims' about Trump.

 

Which is inline with the racist label being so overused that now its a caricature of its former self.

 

She threw everything she had, had a "moderator" on her side, and came off with a tie at best.

 

Trump looked Presidential.

 

Another nail in her coffin.

[Balloon guy 158]

Ten Three Eight has Trump winning.

 

Michael Moore said Trump won debate.

 

Time for some celebrities to start looking for moving companies...

[Dubey 1,035]

I'm actually shocked that anyone could have watched that debate and thought Trump won, let alone looked "presidential".

 

I'm assuming "ten three eight" = fiverthirtyeight? They do not have Trump winning the debate or the election.

 

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/clinton-won-the-debate-which-means-shes-likely-to-gain-in-the-polls/?ex_cid=2016-forecast

[Balloon guy 158]

Yes, got name wrong and looks like they only had trump winning by 54.9% for a few hours couple days ago before they found a way to massage the numbers after many liberals started calling suicide hot line

 

 

As far as silver having anyone win debate he's a far left liberal, of course he thinks hillary won.

 

But far left Moore saw the truth, and it scares him.

[Scrim 115]

And this is a problem. The average person, actually the majority of people know nothing about trade policy and economics.

 

Trump last night for example talked about Mexico's VAT tax as being unfair to American exporters but it's a sales tax like the GST in Canada that is put on everything no matter where it comes from. Taxes like that don't effect trade at all so Trump either was lying about it or doesn't understand it.

 

Matthew Yglesias ‏@mattyglesias 7h7 hours ago

Trade is the only economic issue Trump cares about, but he doesn’t know anything about trade http://www.vox.com/2...rade-fact-check …

 

 

I'd say an even bigger problem than people who know nothing about trade policy and economics are people who likewise know absolutely nothing about same, certainly not enough to develop an informed opinion, yet bleat partisan narratives.

 

The problem is, Brandolini's Law. Trump says something like "The Chinese are devaluing their currency" and because Trump said it, someone who would otherwise defend that statement if Hillary Clinton had said it decides to refute it by saying UNTRUE! THEY'RE TRYING TO PROP UP THEIR CURRENCY!

 

Now, we dance with Brandolini.

 

The Chinese are in fact devaluing their currency.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/07/07/world-faces-deflation-shock-as-china-devalues-at-accelerating-pa/

 

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/01/07/chinese-yuan-heres-whats-happening-to-the-currency.html

 

Unless, of course, those media outlets have it wrong and that Twitter guy has it right.

 

While "employment has been steadily increasing for years" (a true statement), it's a statement relative to the utter bloodbath that occurred about a decade ago. A ton of the job creation is low wage service work, not the kind of jobs that are most directly affected by trade policy.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/28/business/economy/recovery-has-created-far-more-low-wage-jobs-than-better-paid-ones.html?_r=0

 

Manufacturing in Mexico is indeed booming precisely because of the backward trade policy and wage policy (and regulatory policy, etc, etc). Here we see Canadians lamenting the same thing.

 

http://www.canadianbusiness.com/global-report/how-mexicos-manufacturing-sector-is-eclipsing-canadas/

 

 

So that utter trash bulletpoint you posted is incredibly shitty and shallow information. It's a perfect example of partisan arguing, where someone you don't like says "Man, I sure do like Dr Pepper" and without even knowing much about Dr Pepper, you create a narration about how they're somehow 'wrong' and how Dr Pepper is really 'bad' according to some academia.

 

While Trump is guilty in not speaking in politically measured tones, everything he said there was totally true and its kind of amusing watching a bunch if idiots who actually, truly, sincerely know absolutely nothing about any of this start in with the whole "... ANYONE WHO UNDERSTANDS REAL ECONOMICS KNOWS..." and then post a link to something someone said on Twitter.

[FCP Bob 1,321]

with China there is a difference between the currency falling and them fighting to prop it up because it's actually overvalued to what it would be in a free market which is actually what is happening.

 

I follow one of the prominent people in that CNBC article Patrick Chovanec and he would and does say that the Chinese are actively trying to keep the value of their currency higher than it would be in a free market which is exactly the oppostie of what Trump says.

[Balloon guy 158]

Interesting video.

 

https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=7ShAE_l-hww

 

Not sure I buy it, but it is interesting

[scuudagouch 15]

it fits the MO of the Clintons and the democrats in general, probably higher % then a coin flip would be my guess.

[FCP Bob 1,321]

Interesting video.

 

https://www.youtube....?ci=7ShAE_l-hww

 

Not sure I buy it, but it is interesting

 

The Alex Jonesastion of a nation. Everything is a conspiracy.

[Balloon guy 158]

Saw Alex Jones at RNC. He had a beautiful woman with him. Some of the Union guys went up and talked to him. Once I asked him if that was the guy from info wars it green lighted him to tell me every conspiracy theory he knew while we were on catwalks waiting to drop balloons. About 2hours.

[serge 904]

My travel buddy who I traveled to many places around the world is a Canadian and he says in Canada he is considered ultra-conservative and in America is considered liberal

 

I lived in Canada most of my life..

 

I have recently moved to the US and have been living in California for the last year. I can echo those sentiments.

[Scrim 115]

I follow one of the prominent people in that CNBC article Patrick Chovanec and he would and does say that the Chinese are actively trying to keep the value of their currency higher than it would be in a free market which is exactly the oppostie of what Trump says.

 

The Chinese economy is a huge and dynamic thing. Is it possible that in the short term, they're trying to prop it up because weird things are happening this month? Sure, but overall there's no doubt (like, its not even arguable) that they've kept their currency artificially low for a very long time. They were even formally pegged to the USD until the mid 00's.

[FCP Bob 1,321]

The Chinese economy is a huge and dynamic thing. Is it possible that in the short term, they're trying to prop it up because weird things are happening this month? Sure, but overall there's no doubt (like, its not even arguable) that they've kept their currency artificially low for a very long time. They were even formally pegged to the USD until the mid 00's.

 

yes the story of their currency historically was one of undervaluation. The last 3 years or so the story has changed and they have been propping it up. If they got rid of capital controls and stopped trying to prop it up there would be a massive exodus of capital out of the Chinese economy and their currencey would go way down in value.

[Scrim 115]

So lets say that Trump, again, speaking in generalities, said that the Chinese have devalued their currency at the expense of US manufacturing.

 

True. Unarguably, absolutely 100% true. In the short term, now that the RMB is floating and weird things are happening with the Chinese economy (including what China's richest man calles the biggest bubble in history), maybe they're trying to prop up its value.

 

So that's true as well.

 

Here lately, in the past few months, the Chinese have been propping up their currency... I don't see how this falsifies what Trump says, given that for the past 20 or so years, they've kept it artificially low. At that point, trying to claim his statement as 'untrue' is semantic quibbling.

 

He lost the debate but not on facts. He lost the debate on that weird thing he does where he goes off onto defensive tangents related to Hillary's weak trolling of his personal details.

[Balloon guy 158]

Plus he called a fat chick who may have helped murder someone a pig.

 

And he obeyed tax laws and paid as little as possible. Unlike the Clinton's who once wrote off used underwear that he donated to goodwill...

[Scrim 115]

When confronted by something like that, he's got to learn how to say "Yeah, I've made hasty remarks in the past, some I stand by, some I don't, maybe I shouldn't have said that out loud but lets focus on what matters here... The murder of Vince Foster..." because this is going to be a close one and he can't afford to alienate large numbers of people by publicly picking on deeply held sensitivities.

[FCP Bob 1,321]

This matters because he's focused on a policy position that is totally behind today's reality and yes is a sign that he's either lying or totally ignorant of the economics. Well it's probably both since he is a serial liar and is totally economically illiterate.

 

WSJ Central BanksVerified account

‏@WSJCentralBanks

Donald Trump wants to name China a currency manipulator. He's a step behind Beijing's latest actions http://on.wsj.com/2ds7VGM

 

 

Patrick Chovanec ‏@prchovanec 2h2 hours ago

Patrick Chovanec Retweeted WSJ Central Banks

Donald Trump is about 4 years behind the curve on the China currency issue. But so are most politicians in Washington.

[Balloon guy 158]

Trump doesn't understand the finesse and nuance needed to maneuvere in the intricately developed world of Washington.

 

The Washington that voted to go to war in Iraq.

The government that created loopholes to allow Trump to pay almost no taxes

The government that spies on its citizens

The government that bailed out banks that loaned money to people who couldn't pay, while allowing those people to lose everything.

The government that just sent a billion dollars to a theocratic government trying to make nuclear weapons to destroy the Jews.

The government that spent $10 trillion more than it took in to boost the economy and got less than 1.5% grown each year.

The government that took tax money to prop up banks with bad leadership, who turned around and used that money and bought up banks with good leadership, and fired those leaders while keeping the bad ones.

 

 

Trump is a buffoon when it comes to the ability to keep the status quo.