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Union Worker Protests In Wi


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Well, when you take this, add in the cuts to her medical insurance, add in the cuts to her salary (12 months to 10 months) and then factor in that she was already being paid WELL below the national average for school psychologists......the picture looks a little different. But nice try.
No fair using your wife as the example cause I don't want to say things offensive when its this personal....but we could also use my examples:My medical insurance went from $250 a month to $600 a month with a $5,000 deductible per year per person in the last 2 years. Did your wife's insurance change like mine? Cause I don't have any choice but to find new insurance of pay it. No political complaining will change my insurance.Also for the last 2 years I have not put anything towards my retirement, which means my retirement didn't increase at all. In fact it went down 75%.My salary decreased by 90% for the last 2 years, now granted I have to do less work, but so far not one credit card company will accept less because I make less. The salaries for school psychologists isn't set by republican governors, its set by union teacher management. Is the salary of school management equally WELL below the national average?In other words...the whole country is facing cuts, why should teachers unions be exempt?Besides, she's got some hot shot lawyer fresh out of law school to be her sugar daddy, she could stay behind 'for the children' if she wanted to.
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And yet we have decided to slash education spending while continuing to grow prisons. If we were cutting prisons and NOT giving billions in business tax cuts in addition to cutting education spending, I would get it. But we are choosing those two things over education and that is madness.It's like the Ryan plan. In a vacuum, I don't have a problem with cutting Medicare. We need to rein in entitlement costs. But, Ryan's plan is stupid and dangerous. Any good budget deficit reduction plan will make EVERYONE feel the pain. Ryan's plan left SS and defense alone while giving the rich a huge tax break. What the H?Florida should be cutting prisons and raising taxes on businesses if it is going to gut education and enact policies that will drive away the best educators. Also, just because spending more money has not borne good results the last three decades does not mean spending less money going forward will make things better. Most of the charter schools down here are a complete disaster and there are not many private schools to begin with.
Taxes from businesses, and indirectly their employees, are what is going to fund everything for the state. Protecting them should be job 1.Pretending that ignoring criminals will make their problem go away is short sighted.If you raise taxes on businesses, then make sure that you increase crime, you are going to lose your whole future.Yes, increased spending has not resulted in better test scores, and you are right that cutting spending will not 'make things better'. However businesses are the only way to get the money to do anything. And unfortunately, you cannot help businesses without the rich getting the benefits, since the poor do not start and operate businesses ( except me )
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And yet we have decided to slash education spending while continuing to grow prisons. If we were cutting prisons and NOT giving billions in business tax cuts in addition to cutting education spending, I would get it. But we are choosing those two things over education and that is madness.
Well, I'm certainly not going to defend more spending on the prison system, when we could reduce spending on that by half by eliminating victimless crimes from the list of things people go to jail for. But spending on education has been out of control, and needs to be reined in, regardless of what happens in other areas of the budget.
It's like the Ryan plan. In a vacuum, I don't have a problem with cutting Medicare. We need to rein in entitlement costs. But, Ryan's plan is stupid and dangerous. Any good budget deficit reduction plan will make EVERYONE feel the pain. Ryan's plan left SS and defense alone while giving the rich a huge tax break. What the H?
Yeah, the radical, he wants to balance the budget 65 years from now. How can he be so reckless?
Also, just because spending more money has not borne good results the last three decades does not mean spending less money going forward will make things better.
Would you like to make a donation to the DNC now that you've tasted their wonderful Kool-Aid?Think about your statement, and what it means in the real world. Let's say a business did that for 30 years, what do you think would happen? Would it be an indicator that change is just around the corner, or maybe that there is a systemic incompetence that needs to be eliminated?
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I don't see everything through the prism of what a business would do. I think treating some things like a business is a recipe for disaster.And I didn't say Ryan was a radical. I said his plan is stupid and politically hilarious. Let's keep everything republicans like and cut everything Dens like. That will go over great. It's not only a disastrous political approach but it reeks of someone playing politics and clearly not serious about actually reducing our debt.

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I'm not the only one who thinks Rick Scott is the worst governor ever thankfully. His poll numbers are already a disaster; everyone hates him. Stuff like this won't help:http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2011-0...cott-supporterswhat a moron.
I think he is just reaching out to the average Florida voter at their level....
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I don't see everything through the prism of what a business would do. I think treating some things like a business is a recipe for disaster.And I didn't say Ryan was a radical. I said his plan is stupid and politically hilarious. Let's keep everything republicans like and cut everything Dens like. That will go over great. It's not only a disastrous political approach but it reeks of someone playing politics and clearly not serious about actually reducing our debt.
The only thing I know that he is keeping untouched is the DoD, and I think that's ridiculous. I believe his original plan cut defense; I think he had to give in to politics this time around. It's really too bad, because his original plan had across-the-board cuts.But basically, if you don't take on Medicare, SS, and defense, you're not serious. The Dems don't want any of those cut, Ryan wants at least two, and maybe all three of those cut.
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  • 5 weeks later...

Damn that Walker and his irresponsible policy of letting school districts save hundreds of thousands of dollars!

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Damn that Walker and his irresponsible policy of letting school districts save hundreds of thousands of dollars!
Not one word in that article about whether the new insurance policy is as good as the old insurance policy. It's easy to say....they saved money so this is obviously good. Except in Florida, a right to work state, the same thing happened. The school district changed the health care plan in 2009 and saved money. Yay! Sadly, the new insurance was much worse than the old insurance. The network of doctors that it covered was much smaller. The co-pay was higher. The coverage was not as good or extensive. Out of pocket costs went way up. The cost of adding a family member went up. It was a terrible insurance policy and one of the motivating factors for my wife to quit her job and take one with University of Miami (whose health care plan is absurdly good).I would be willing to bet that the new insurance these teachers get in WI is worse than their old policy by quite a bit. It's the most logical explanation for why it is so much cheaper. I'd bet the teachers voted for it because otherwise they would be forced to pay the difference out of their paychecks (that's what happened here where you can't collectively bargain....notice the pattern?).But hooray for Scott Walker! His law helped WI schools give their teachers lower quality insurance at a lower cost and save money! What a hero. We already knew his law was good for the school district's bottom line and bad for teachers. Glad you guys found an article to confirm that.
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Looks like stopping collective bargaining is breaking the union money laundering scheme and saving school districts money and teachers jobs.Wisconsin schools buck union to cut health costs
Given a very small budget for teachers, the governor was forced to make the choice between having decent benefits and firing teachers or retaining more teachers but with worse benefits. He chose the latter.The issue isn't really his choice, it's the fact that the budget for teachers and schools is so low to begin with. I don't mean to say that the state doesn't spend a lot of money on education. I mean to say that it's money well spend and even more should be spent if it's necessary to retain competent teachers. We can afford it if we properly budget for it.
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Not one word in that article about whether the new insurance policy is as good as the old insurance policy.
The teachers had asked for it the previous year, but the union wouldn't let them. You may draw your own conclusions from that.
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Given a very small budget for teachers, the governor was forced to make the choice between having decent benefits and firing teachers or retaining more teachers but with worse benefits. He chose the latter.The issue isn't really his choice, it's the fact that the budget for teachers and schools is so low to begin with. I don't mean to say that the state doesn't spend a lot of money on education. I mean to say that it's money well spend and even more should be spent if it's necessary to retain competent teachers. We can afford it if we properly budget for it.
The teachers prefer the new plan. And it's cheaper.Fiscal responsibility, FTW.
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Not one word in that article about whether the new insurance policy is as good as the old insurance policy. It's easy to say....they saved money so this is obviously good. Except in Florida, a right to work state, the same thing happened. The school district changed the health care plan in 2009 and saved money. Yay! Sadly, the new insurance was much worse than the old insurance. The network of doctors that it covered was much smaller. The co-pay was higher. The coverage was not as good or extensive. Out of pocket costs went way up. The cost of adding a family member went up. It was a terrible insurance policy and one of the motivating factors for my wife to quit her job and take one with University of Miami (whose health care plan is absurdly good).I would be willing to bet that the new insurance these teachers get in WI is worse than their old policy by quite a bit. It's the most logical explanation for why it is so much cheaper. I'd bet the teachers voted for it because otherwise they would be forced to pay the difference out of their paychecks (that's what happened here where you can't collectively bargain....notice the pattern?).But hooray for Scott Walker! His law helped WI schools give their teachers lower quality insurance at a lower cost and save money! What a hero. We already knew his law was good for the school district's bottom line and bad for teachers. Glad you guys found an article to confirm that.
How much? Also what is the democrat definition of "quite a bit"?
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It was racketeering plain and simple and the perfect example of what's wrong with modern unions.

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Seriously, how did this whole idea that the guy who gave you a job, should also take responsibility for you and your families health care anyway.
It's because of the US Tax Code.If your employer buys you health insurance directly as part of your compensation package it's tax free to you and a tax write off for the employer and there are no Social Security taxes paid on that money. There are also benefits to being part of a large group when it comes to insurance.If your employer pays you that same amount of money and you go out and buy the insurance yourself that money is taxed as regular income and Social Security taxes are paid on it. Tying health insurance to employment is one of the largest weaknesses in the US Health Care System.Edit: I'm making an assumption on the health care benefits not being subject to SS Taxes, correct me if I'm wrong.
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It's because of the US Tax Code.If your employer buys you health insurance directly as part of your compensation package it's tax free to you and a tax write off for the employer and there are no Social Security taxes paid on that money. There are also benefits to being part of a large group when it comes to insurance.If your employer pays you that same amount of money and you go out and buy the insurance yourself that money is taxed as regular income and Social Security taxes are paid on it. Tying health insurance to employment is one of the largest weaknesses in the US Health Care System.Edit: I'm making an assumption on the health care benefits not being subject to SS Taxes, correct me if I'm wrong.
You are correct, on all counts. Get rid of the tax deduction for employers, give it to workers, and allow interstate competition of insurance. Fix those two things and the calls for reform would fade quickly. There's still be a lot of problems, but it would comparable to telecommunications and cable rather than what it is.
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  • 2 weeks later...

In the recall elections, it looks like the R's are trouncing the D's in 5 of the 6 districts.So much for voter anger at fiscal reform.

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I may have spoken too early, another race has moved into a tie. Still, that would be 4-2.Edit: changing quickly now... hmmm I think I'll wait til they call all of them.

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So no comments? All the people who were so sure that the WI protests would be the end of Walker and the R's are pretty quiet today, and not just in here.I guess being loud and petulant is not the same as winning the debate.

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So no comments? All the people who were so sure that the WI protests would be the end of Walker and the R's are pretty quiet today, and not just in here.I guess being loud and petulant is not the same as winning the debate.
and I hope union workers don't mind the wasting of millions of their dollars in the attempt.
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  • 3 weeks later...

I'm not sure this belongs in this thread, but it's close enough and I didn't want to start a new thread for it....Today, my middle son finished a private tutoring program. He had been diagnosed with several learning disabilities (primarily ADHD), and one of the doctors recommended this place. It was insanely expensive, so I was skeptical. Now, after twenty-some weeks of one hour per day sessions, on ten different cognitive measures he has increased from around 30th percentile to 70th percentile, and advanced two grade levels. They said the skills will stick because they cause the brain to be rewired to accept learning more easily from now on. In kindergarten, he didn't even learn to write his name in six months of daily trying. Here it took them about two weeks, and then he kept moving on from there. In public school, he made no movement whatsoever in terms of percentile.So as I was leaving I thought, shouldn't public schools at least be able to get a *fraction* of this kind of result? Why don't they just do this? My first thought: too expensive. But really, they could do a shorter school year and get *more* results for about the same per student cost as they currently spend here in MN. Obviously, it's not going to show that kind of improvement on everyone, as it probably gets increasingly difficult to get further gains as the child moves up the ranks. But still, for all those kids who are in the bottom third, why make them waste their time in a horrible classroom setting that doesn't work for them when you can get *better* results in a fraction of the time?And that, in the end, is why public schools are failing. They are doing nothing for a large segment of the kids.

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I'm not sure this belongs in this thread, but it's close enough and I didn't want to start a new thread for it....Today, my middle son finished a private tutoring program. He had been diagnosed with several learning disabilities (primarily ADHD), and one of the doctors recommended this place. It was insanely expensive, so I was skeptical. Now, after twenty-some weeks of one hour per day sessions, on ten different cognitive measures he has increased from around 30th percentile to 70th percentile, and advanced two grade levels. They said the skills will stick because they cause the brain to be rewired to accept learning more easily from now on. In kindergarten, he didn't even learn to write his name in six months of daily trying. Here it took them about two weeks, and then he kept moving on from there. In public school, he made no movement whatsoever in terms of percentile.So as I was leaving I thought, shouldn't public schools at least be able to get a *fraction* of this kind of result? Why don't they just do this? My first thought: too expensive. But really, they could do a shorter school year and get *more* results for about the same per student cost as they currently spend here in MN. Obviously, it's not going to show that kind of improvement on everyone, as it probably gets increasingly difficult to get further gains as the child moves up the ranks. But still, for all those kids who are in the bottom third, why make them waste their time in a horrible classroom setting that doesn't work for them when you can get *better* results in a fraction of the time?And that, in the end, is why public schools are failing. They are doing nothing for a large segment of the kids.
i can only comment on the public schools in my surrounding area and they doing well. the kids learn and have done well in college and life. i actually had a manager of mine try and convince me to give him a bonus because he can "no longer afford to send his daughter to his church school and doesn't want her exposed to element of public school" LOL i told him i appreciated his concern but that the public school he was scared of was very good and they had treated both of my sons very well....LOL the guy tries to pull on my heart strings to convince to pay him extra so he can keep his precious daughter out of the very school i send my kids to....that was special.
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