Scrooge 0 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The other day I was playing No limit hold em with a buddy of mine at the casino. He is heads up in a hand with another player. On the river, my buddy bets $75 dollars, the other player moves 75 to the middle of the table and dealer says flip them up. As my buddy flips his hand up, the other pulls back his chips and says he never called. Though he never did let go of his chips, did moving them to the middle of the table and with the dealer saying flip em mean he basically made the call? The house ruling was for my buddy to take down the pot. Well of course he would take the pot, he had the nuts, but did the other player got lucky? Should the house have to pay for the mistake? Link to post Share on other sites
custom36 4 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I think you should've fired the people that asked for Christmas off. Link to post Share on other sites
nutzbuster 7 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 moving them to the middle of the table and the dealer saying flip em means he made the call Link to post Share on other sites
Scrooge 0 Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 One of the guys at the table told me he had did it earlier that night to some other guy. The house told him he can't do that and warned him. Me and my buddy arent regulars at that specific poker room but the other guy was. I think just cause you know the player doesnt mean he has special rights. To me that makes me wonder why we even use dealers or the house if its based on who you are and not the hand you are playing. Link to post Share on other sites
bullmoose 0 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The other day I was playing No limit hold em with a buddy of mine at the casino. He is heads up in a hand with another player. On the river, my buddy bets $75 dollars, the other player moves 75 to the middle of the table and dealer says flip them up. As my buddy flips his hand up, the other pulls back his chips and says he never called. Though he never did let go of his chips, did moving them to the middle of the table and with the dealer saying flip em mean he basically made the call? The house ruling was for my buddy to take down the pot. Well of course he would take the pot, he had the nuts, but did the other player got lucky? Should the house have to pay for the mistake?That's an OBVIOUS call. I cant believe the Casino would allow him to take those chips back. One thing I have learned, is that if I am not 100% sure that my opponent in a live game called (or checked)......before I do anything......I will ask the dealer....."was that a call ??" or "was that a check ??" before I act in any way. I have noticed, on more than one occasion at the casino, an opponent making a sort of vague checking motion when the dealers attention may not be on them (as if they want to see what the players after them do). I think they call this angle shooting (or something). If I am not positive.....I ask. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 One of the guys at the table told me he had did it earlier that night to some other guy. The house told him he can't do that and warned him. Me and my buddy arent regulars at that specific poker room but the other guy was. I think just cause you know the player doesnt mean he has special rights. To me that makes me wonder why we even use dealers or the house if its based on who you are and not the hand you are playing.1st: your buddy got screwed.2nd: Casinos will always try to side with the guy who comes in all the time over someone who pops in once a year.3rd: Don't ever flip over your cards while your opponent still hasn't released the money.4th: Why can't they have Christmas off? Link to post Share on other sites
mrpaddyx 13 Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Did the guy think he was playing chess or something? It shouldn't matter if he was still holding onto the chips, once they cross the line they should be in play. Link to post Share on other sites
BaseJester 1 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 The other day I was playing No limit hold em with a buddy of mine at the casino. He is heads up in a hand with another player. On the river, my buddy bets $75 dollars, the other player moves 75 to the middle of the table and dealer says flip them up. The dealer has, at this point, ruled the villain's action a call. There's no new possible information that should cause him to unrule this. Link to post Share on other sites
DiamondDixie 12 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 When the Russian guy did that in the WSOP they ruled it was forward motion but since he didn't release them it wasn't a call, at least that's how I remember it. But that was tournament play. I'm pretty sure I heard in cash games in most casinos if the chips cross the line on the table then it's a call release or not. Link to post Share on other sites
nutzbuster 7 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Once the dealer observes the forward motion and announces "flip em" that indicates his betting action has taken place and is valid. period.Find another poker room imo. Link to post Share on other sites
XXEddie 0 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 When the Russian guy did that in the WSOP they ruled it was forward motion but since he didn't release them it wasn't a call, at least that's how I remember it. But that was tournament play. I'm pretty sure I heard in cash games in most casinos if the chips cross the line on the table then it's a call release or not.In this case the OP is making it seem like he held them out there while the dealer said 'flip em' and OP's friend turned them over. That's a little more than what Losev did against Cantu. Besides, that was also a bullshit ruling. Link to post Share on other sites
Suited_Up 2 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 When the Russian guy did that in the WSOP they ruled it was forward motion but since he didn't release them it wasn't a call, at least that's how I remember it. But that was tournament play. I'm pretty sure I heard in cash games in most casinos if the chips cross the line on the table then it's a call release or not.You heard wrong. Caesar's used to do that but got so many complaints they changed it. Generally that's what the line was meant for, but rarely have I seen that rule used. I liked the rule, but too many people grab a big stack and then drop a few chips from it, and they were getting caught having to put them all in the pot instead. (Stupid by them anyway)This is all exclusive of what happened with this dealer saying 'flip em' though. Link to post Share on other sites
Jam-Fly 8 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 the player was probably angle shooting, but this was more of a dealer error than anything else. If they guy didn't release his chips into the pot, I can see why he has a case for saying he didn't call. The dealer saying 'flip em' without it being 100% obvious it's a call is the biggest joke.As it played out, I would have ruled your buddy wins the pot (incl the $75) and tell the other player to be more careful next time. Link to post Share on other sites
Timinator99 0 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Most casino's do not really recognize the line on the table HOWEVER in this case the fact that the player cut out $75 and moved it forward and the dealer signified it was a call by asking the players to flip the cards then this should 100% be ruled a call and the pot plus the guys $75 call awarded. Terrible decision by the floor. Link to post Share on other sites
jbage007 0 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Sounds to me like the guy obviously was just exercising his arms and the chips he just cut out just happened to be in the way.jeezus.are you freakin' serious?why is this even a question? Link to post Share on other sites
TrueAce13 18 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Sounds to me like the guy obviously was just exercising his arms and the chips he just cut out just happened to be in the way.jeezus.are you freakin' serious?why is this even a question?sick post! Link to post Share on other sites
chrozzo 19 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 just disappear him...and it wont happen againi know a guy... Link to post Share on other sites
mtdesmoines 3 Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 This is kind of on the dealer for not clarifying/grabbing the chips and putting them in the pot before saying "flip them over" or whatever. Dealers have a bigger responsibility than we hold them accountable for. The floor should also have corrected this mistake. If the casino basically has no rules, and this guy did the same angle shoot earlier in the same night, I'm wondering why no one just didn't kick his ass? Link to post Share on other sites
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