Top Chef All Stars

[LadyGrey 6]

I think flay's cooking is more respected than bourdain's, isn't he? Bourdain is more acclaimed for being an edgy writer/critic than he is for his actual cooking...Also, I don't know how much you've watched him on iron chef or throwdown, but he certainly appears to be legit to me.

Oh sorry you're right, I didn't mean Bourdain, I just had his name on my brain because we were talking about him. I was probably thinking of Ramsay when I wrote it (just finished watching the last season of Hell's Kitchen). Re: Flay - I've watched both those shows.On Iron Chef I think the producers ensure that the Iron Chefs win most of the time in order to maintain their credibility. So many times with Flay and Cora they have received more criticism than the contender, yet they have ultimately won for some bullshit like "presentation" even though the contender was better. I am not the only one who thinks so.Same deal with throwdown. I watched a few dozen episodes and a lot of the time when he won I was like "how?". He is a good chef but I don't think he is top tier.

[BigDMcGee 3,355]

Ya, this was my thought exactly.He also does that throw down where he cooks against people who have perfected a certain dish and holds his own. BBQ/Grilling just happened to be what he loves to do.

yeah, southwestern foods are his specialty. I find his throw downs particularly impressive, because he often has to learn completely foreign techniques and dishes he's never cooked before so unless his assistants are doing the cooking for him, he appears to be good.Iron Chef is really where I became impressed with him. On the orginal iron chef, he came over and beat morimoto, and I was just shocked, because he seemed like a hack. When they started iron chef america, wolf gang puck and flay were both iron chefs ( along with morimoto) bue puck was only on the first episode, and he had his "assistant" chef make and do most of the work, I thought he was a complete fraud. Where as flay was very impressive, from the start.

[BigDMcGee 3,355]

Oh sorry you're right, I didn't mean Bourdain, I just had his name on my brain because we were talking about him. I was probably thinking of Ramsay when I wrote it (just finished watching the last season of Hell's Kitchen). ...Same deal with throwdown. I watched a few dozen episodes and a lot of the time when he won I was like "how?". He is a good chef but I don't think he is top tier.

Okay, I can see that. I have no idea how high to rate flay, since, you knw, I've never actually ate his food. I would imagine Tom is considered the more highly regarded chef in high cuisine circles.

[El Guapo 8]

I have eaten his food...well he didn't personally cook it, but at Mesa Grill and it's easily in the top 2-3 meals I have ever had. Very high end SW food, with lots of layers of flavor. He also can take different cuisines and put his SW spin on it very well.We had SW tuna tar tar, it was amazing.I would also guess Tom C. is a "better" chef than Flay, but he sure as hell is no hack. As for Ramsey, I am not sure LG if you were saying you thought he wasn't that good, or that you though he was good and you were comparing the wrong person, but Ramsey is a phenomenal chef. I would love to see him on one of these Top Chef types shows competing against others, I think he would destroy.

[speedz99 145]

Yeah that's what Bourdain said, but for me it got balanced out by all the dropping stuff and knocking stuff over. Personal opinion I guess. I will say I was impressed to see Tom cooking because I haven't seen that before and I never knew if he was really a respected chef or just a Food Network type chef. Know what I mean? I only really know about English and French chefs so I haven't heard of most of the chefs they have on the show. I thought Tom might be more Bobby Flay than Bourdain. Now I am convinced that he is legit.

This has probably been covered, and I can't imagine anyone cares about my opinion, but I feel like writing about this anyway. So, that said,from what I understand:Tom is very widely respected by fellow chefs. I've really never read anything negative about him in terms of his cooking, running restaurants, etc. The guy was a star in those circles long before he was on tv.Bourdain is an average chef, and very readily admits it. But after all his travel and eating in the best restaurants all over the world, plus in amazing local places, I bet his palate is as good as anyone's.Flay is pretty damn good. He's not anywhere near the fine cuisine domain, but for what he does he does it well. Not that it matters, but I ate at his burger joint in the Mohegan Sun casino last week, and it was pretty great. Solid concept, execution above and beyond what you could get in the vast majority of restaurants, etc.

[LadyGrey 6]

I have eaten his food...well he didn't personally cook it, but at Mesa Grill and it's easily in the top 2-3 meals I have ever had. Very high end SW food, with lots of layers of flavor. He also can take different cuisines and put his SW spin on it very well.We had SW tuna tar tar, it was amazing.I would also guess Tom C. is a "better" chef than Flay, but he sure as hell is no hack. As for Ramsey, I am not sure LG if you were saying you thought he wasn't that good, or that you though he was good and you were comparing the wrong person, but Ramsey is a phenomenal chef. I would love to see him on one of these Top Chef types shows competing against others, I think he would destroy.

This has probably been covered, and I can't imagine anyone cares about my opinion, but I feel like writing about this anyway. So, that said,from what I understand:Tom is very widely respected by fellow chefs. I've really never read anything negative about him in terms of his cooking, running restaurants, etc. The guy was a star in those circles long before he was on tv.Bourdain is an average chef, and very readily admits it. But after all his travel and eating in the best restaurants all over the world, plus in amazing local places, I bet his palate is as good as anyone's.Flay is pretty damn good. He's not anywhere near the fine cuisine domain, but for what he does he does it well. Not that it matters, but I ate at his burger joint in the Mohegan Sun casino last week, and it was pretty great. Solid concept, execution above and beyond what you could get in the vast majority of restaurants, etc.

Regarding food at Flay's restaurants: I wouldn't count that as a judgement of his cooking since he didn't personally cook it. Not that it doesn't show a talent if he came up with the menu, but I can imagine that someone who enjoyed food could conceptualize a great menu but not be able to cook it. The two skills don't necessarily prove each other. I'm wording this poorly. In fact, actually it provides a good demonstration of why I was impressed to see Tom cooking. Before that I had heard great things about his restaurants (even tried to eat in Wichcraft in SF but it was inexplicably closed) but had never seen him cooking. I thought he might be more a conceptualizer than a great chef. That still doesn't really cover it but I need to leave for work now.I already explained that I typed Bourdain when I was thinking "Ramsay" earlier, didn't mean to list him as a great chef.Ramsay was my example of a top tier chef: he has a phenomenal palette, extensive training and food knowledge in a raft of different cuisines, he is award winning, Michelin starred, and has many successful and highly rated restaurants. I couldn't imagine him on TC (would be interesting though) but having seen him cooking on many other shows from Kitchen Nightmares to Hells Kitchen to that one where he has celebrities and groups of normal people come and cook in his kitchen (hate that show) he is clearly an amazing chef as well as conceptualizer.I think I just invented that word, conceptualizer.

[speedz99 145]

Regarding food at Flay's restaurants: I wouldn't count that as a judgement of his cooking since he didn't personally cook it. Not that it doesn't show a talent if he came up with the menu, but I can imagine that someone who enjoyed food could conceptualize a great menu but not be able to cook it. The two skills don't necessarily prove each other.

I guess I didn't think it was necessary to cover his cooking skills, seeing as he dominates on Iron Chef, which was already mentioned. The burger story was just a random aside.But I guess I do disagree with you...I see your point in that someone could be great at conceptualizing but not at executing a great meal, but I'm guessing it's probably extremely rare for that to be the case. Pretty much every great chef has worked on the line in top kitchens for years, and you don't get ahead in the business without being able to cook the shit out of your dishes once you do get a chance to run your own kitchen. I really can't imagine there are any highly regarded chefs that aren't great at cooking. Maybe they haven't worked the line in a long time and would be a bit rusty in terms of speed, but that's a different story.

[LadyGrey 6]

FINALLY Jamie is gone. I thought it was very lucky for the 3 guys that none of them were sent home. I would have liked Fabio to go but he could only really have been blamed for the execution of the dish so it wouldn't have been right this time. I guess their strategy of cooking 1 dish and all taking joint responsibility did work out the way they planned it.Tiffani probably did deserve to go home just for the bloodline thing.

[brvheart 1,759]

I'm very happy with how the vote went. With every passing episode I like Angelo and Fabio more and more, and Marcel less and less.I also like Trey and Richard a lot, which is nice, since I didn't see their seasons and don't know who they are.

[timwakefield 68]

Marcel's outburst on the roof would have been even more embarrassing if he hadn't been swigging gin at the same time. But it reminded me of a pirate, swigging rum I guess.

[Suited_Up 2]

That was a damn big bass.

[El Guapo 8]

[timwakefield 68]

This was the second double-elimination they've had, yes? A little lame - they coulda got 2 more episodes out of this season. I mean I'm sure that's why they did it - because they decided on 12 episodes rather than 14 (or whatever) - but I would think the network would hate to have them shorten it.

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

I also find it a little disappointing how many of the challenges are team based. I know it adds drama, but it really contributed to Jamie hanging on longer than deserved. I sort of liked her in her first season. This season she was just a total nothing. Seems like fame has changed some of these personalities a little.

[byaaatch 0]

This has been such an interesting season. Dale who really didn't seem that strong in his season is really kicking ass. I gotta say I am happy to see Marcel leave. He is one of those guys who is really talented but just can't help being an ass. He needs to go through the same process Dale did of growing up from his season. Cause when Dale was on I hated him thought he was a complete ass but this season he has greatly matured and now his cooking seems to be coming out really strong. Fabio needs his own show on Bravo. That man is entertaining as hell.

[speedz99 145]

It's funny how little suspense there was in this episode...it was just incredibly clear from the start that the good team was going to destroy it and the bad team was going to implode. I like it when there isn't any twist or creative editing, they really just showed it how it was. I wouldn't have protested too much if Tiffany went home, but I think it was the obvious decision to boot Marcel.

[timwakefield 68]

[brvheart 1,759]

FOAM!

[timwakefield 68]

When Marcel said he was doing a foam I was pretty confident he was gonna go home. One of his teammates should have been brave/stupid enough to say, 'Marcel, you do a motherfucking FOAM practically every week. Foam is not a major component of fine dining. It's kitschy and dated, as well as being overused to death. If Ferran Adria saw you putting a foam on every goddam dish you make he would laugh at you. When he did it - and note my use of the past tense - when he did it it was sexy and revolutionary*. When you do it it's embarrassing, and is increasingly old-fashioned. It was cutting edge a decade ago. I swear to you Marcel, unless you're serving hot chocolate with whipped cream, the judges will hate your foam just on principle. I don't know how else to get through to you, so I also stole your CO2 cannisters. No fucking foams today, you foamy sonofabitch.'*

[tobytobey 0]

Marcel-cooks-for-the-people - Video (now with autotune)Now that Marcel is gone, who's left to hate?Angelo "Douche Ninja" isn't nearly as douchey this season.Dale "Anger Mgnt" has calmed down a bunch (gotta be on zoloft or paxil), plus he's kickin' ass lately.

[nutzzcase 0]

Fabio must get lots of pussy

[brvheart 1,759]

Marcel-cooks-for-the-people - Video (now with autotune)

That could have been good... too bad a retard put it together.

[loogie 115]

I'm going to miss Marcel. He was good TV. I know he has his own show coming out, but I doubt he'll be butting heads on it. It will just be him making foam.

[LadyGrey 6]

Marcel is a bit of a tool for sure, but in this episode it was clearly Mike who was being an asshole. From what they showed, there were 3 instances where Marcel bugged people, and in all cases he was "in the right" in my view:1. When Mike wanted a chinoise and tried to take Marcel's. Marcel told him to get his own which is completely fair enough. For some reason Mike thought it was unreasonable and immature, but it makes sense - there is a time limit, and if Mike uses the chinoise that Marcel already chose it means Marcel has to waste time later getting another one. It's Mike's job to find and prep his own equipment.2. Telling Tiffany how to do the eggs - she got pissy and didn't listen to him -> the eggs came out wrong. She should have respected him as a fellow cook and listened to his advice rather than being defensive and stroppy.3. Heating the plates. Marcel said something about putting them on the grill, Mike started yelling about not putting them directly on the grill, and somehow it escalated into Mike yelling stupid dramatic things like "don't talk to me like that". Clearly Mike went into the challenge feeling that he didn't respect Marcel, and he acted accordingly. There was no way Marcel could succeed in the team captain role since Mike and to a lesser extent Tiffany were both deadset on disrespecting him from the start. Only Angelo was mature enough to rally around him and be diplomatic, which I admired. At the end of the day though, Marcel's dish was terrible. I agree that he deserved to go home, but not because he is a douchebag, just because his dish was awful. Tiffany would have been as good a choice to leave, since her dish was crappy and her attitude and front of house performance were also shoddy. I've had enough of Mike being a jerk. Blaise continues to impress. I was surprised that Dale won the quickfire. His stuff must taste great but as a viewer it doesn't look or sound inspiring to me so I don't find him an exciting chef.

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

Marcel is a bit of a tool for sure, but in this episode it was clearly Mike who was being an asshole. From what they showed, there were 3 instances where Marcel bugged people, and in all cases he was "in the right" in my view:1. When Mike wanted a chinoise and tried to take Marcel's. Marcel told him to get his own which is completely fair enough. For some reason Mike thought it was unreasonable and immature, but it makes sense - there is a time limit, and if Mike uses the chinoise that Marcel already chose it means Marcel has to waste time later getting another one. It's Mike's job to find and prep his own equipment.2. Telling Tiffany how to do the eggs - she got pissy and didn't listen to him -> the eggs came out wrong. She should have respected him as a fellow cook and listened to his advice rather than being defensive and stroppy.3. Heating the plates. Marcel said something about putting them on the grill, Mike started yelling about not putting them directly on the grill, and somehow it escalated into Mike yelling stupid dramatic things like "don't talk to me like that". Clearly Mike went into the challenge feeling that he didn't respect Marcel, and he acted accordingly. There was no way Marcel could succeed in the team captain role since Mike and to a lesser extent Tiffany were both deadset on disrespecting him from the start. Only Angelo was mature enough to rally around him and be diplomatic, which I admired. At the end of the day though, Marcel's dish was terrible. I agree that he deserved to go home, but not because he is a douchebag, just because his dish was awful. Tiffany would have been as good a choice to leave, since her dish was crappy and her attitude and front of house performance were also shoddy. I've had enough of Mike being a jerk. Blaise continues to impress. I was surprised that Dale won the quickfire. His stuff must taste great but as a viewer it doesn't look or sound inspiring to me so I don't find him an exciting chef.

Marcel comes off as an immature condescending ass. While this could be enhanced by good editing, it seems to be a somewhat universal assessment even by the chefs who are competing with him. So yeah, he may have been "right" in certain instances. But that doesn't mean Mike and Tiffany were wrong in their reaction to him - especially in instances #2 & #3 above. Marcel treating them like his Sous Chefs - especially on camera on a high profile TV Show - is going to result in a confrontation.