Local Immigration Case

[FCP Bob 1,312]

If that last one is not the law now, inserting that in any immigration reform would go a long way toward getting sensible policy implemented.

Here in Canada if you sponsor one of your Family members to immigrate you're financially responsible for them for a period of time. If they go on Welfare or other social assistance you're responsible for paying the gov't back. If you have a bad financial record with bankruptcies for example you can't sponsor somebody and for some types of sponsorship you have to have a minimum income.

[akoff 0]

I just had a meeting with a 72 year old man who immigrated here legally from Amsterdam in 1967. He knows more about US law and the Constitution that 99% of people I know, including myself.He told me when he became a citizen some of the requirements were:* Speak and Read English* Read a current newspaper and be able to comment and understand current events* Sign a document stating you would not apply for government assistance for at least 5 years, if you did you would be deported.**This I did not know.

in 1967 the WW2 generation was still in charge and they didn't take any shit. When the baby boom took over it all fell apart. or at least that is my opinion until someone does the research to tell me i am wrong, then i will change it!!Seriously thought the WW2 gen was an amazing generation. I honestly believe the only thing of real importance they failed in was child raising. for a group that saved europe and asia in the war, build a industrial war machine unmatched in history for production, turned that into the cold war ecomomic boom and redeveloped our nation transit they sure raised a bunch of pussies. the baby boom is quite possibly the most worthless generation in history.

[akoff 0]

Here in Canada if you sponsor one of your Family members to immigrate you're financially responsible for them for a period of time. If they go on Welfare or other social assistance you're responsible for paying the gov't back. If you have a bad financial record with bankruptcies for example you can't sponsor somebody and for some types of sponsorship you have to have a minimum income.

well this is one thing Canada certainly has right. Crown Royal for everyone!!!

[Balloon guy 158]

If that last one is not the law now, inserting that in any immigration reform would go a long way toward getting sensible policy implemented.

Hey I found some common ground with Henry on immigration.

[Roll the Bones 74]

Dream Act failed in Senate today getting 55 votes, 5 short. *sigh*

[custom36 4]

Dream Act failed in Senate today getting 55 votes, 5 short. *sigh*

55/100 votes and it FAILS? God I hate the Senate.

[brvheart 1,752]

Dream Act failed in Senate today getting 55 votes, 5 short. *sigh*

I love the spirit of the DREAM act, but there is no doubt that it would increase illegal immigration. If I lived in Mexico, I would bring my kids into the US over and over and over again, I wouldn't ever stop until my kids were accepted in the program.

[Roll the Bones 74]

I love the spirit of the DREAM act, but there is no doubt that it would increase illegal immigration. If I lived in Mexico, I would bring my kids into the US over and over and over again, I wouldn't ever stop until my kids were accepted in the program.

That's because you are a loving caring person much like them.

[85suited 0]

Dream Act failed in Senate today getting 55 votes, 5 short. *sigh*

I believe 5 Democrats voted against it

[akoff 0]

I believe 5 Democrats voted against it

I would have assume that is because it is a nice idea in a pefect world but it just doesn't work here in real life.

[brvheart 1,752]

That's because you are a loving caring person much like them.

Lol @ your face for believing that the laws of our country, and general federal policy, should be based on how loving and caring someone might be toward their family members.

[Roll the Bones 74]

Lol @ your face for believing that the laws of our country, and general federal policy, should be based on how loving and caring someone might be toward their family members.

I was refering to this comment,

If I lived in Mexico, I would bring my kids into the US over and over and over again, I wouldn't ever stop until my kids were accepted in the program.

And I assume that you would do whatever you could to help your kids out.

I love the spirit of the DREAM act, but there is no doubt that it would increase illegal immigration.

But this is different. For years we turned a blind eye to illegal immigration and punishing some kid that has spent his whole life here and been no problem and offers no reason he will be shouldn't be jailed and then shipped out of the country. I just see it as a cruel punishment to an innocent victim.

[Balloon guy 158]

But this is different. For years we turned a blind eye to illegal immigration and punishing some kid that has spent his whole life here and been no problem and offers no reason he will be shouldn't be jailed and then shipped out of the country. I just see it as a cruel punishment to a person who's parents were responsible for him committing a crime.

Do you feel equally bad for the kids who join gangs that are here illegally?Or how about the kids like my daughter who's 1st grade class was split into two classes, one for those who spoke no english, and the other for those who spoke some english.Just because sometimes people kill people who are scums and deserve it, doesn't mean we should change our murder laws.And just because some illegal immigrants are good people who would be a positive for this country, doesn't mean we should change our immigration laws.We aren't hurting for people who want to come here, so we can afford to be EXTREMELY picky and only pick those who don't commit crimes for years by being here illegally. Is that little benchmark really that hard to meet? Come to America, if you can obey the law, otherwise stay there in your rat hole of a country that the liberals all tell us are better than us anyway.

[Roll the Bones 74]

Do you feel equally bad for the kids who join gangs that are here illegally?Or how about the kids like my daughter who's 1st grade class was split into two classes, one for those who spoke no english, and the other for those who spoke some english.Just because sometimes people kill people who are scums and deserve it, doesn't mean we should change our murder laws.And just because some illegal immigrants are good people who would be a positive for this country, doesn't mean we should change our immigration laws.We aren't hurting for people who want to come here, so we can afford to be EXTREMELY picky and only pick those who don't commit crimes for years by being here illegally. Is that little benchmark really that hard to meet? Come to America, if you can obey the law, otherwise stay there in your rat hole of a country that the liberals all tell us are better than us anyway.

There are alot of reasons to change the immigration laws so don't twist what I said. This kids parents came here and applied for asylum 15 years ago. There was nothing about them being illegal for 10 years until they were denied. So the parents took a chance coming here instead of being killed where they did live and even the local Republican senator got the kid out of jail to await an appeal and help him.

[Balloon guy 158]

There are alot of reasons to change the immigration laws so don't twist what I said. This kids parents came here and applied for asylum 15 years ago. There was nothing about them being illegal for 10 years until they were denied. So the parents took a chance coming here instead of being killed where they did live and even the local Republican senator got the kid out of jail to await an appeal and help him.

One story about one kid though, is not enough for me to look at questioning the way our immigration laws suck.

[brvheart 1,752]

I was refering to this comment, And I assume that you would do whatever you could to help your kids out.But this is different. For years we turned a blind eye to illegal immigration and punishing some kid that has spent his whole life here and been no problem and offers no reason he will be shouldn't be jailed and then shipped out of the country. I just see it as a cruel punishment to an innocent victim.

Don't bother replying... I already laughed right at your face.

[nutzbuster 7]

http://www.hulu.com/watch/134774/genesis-illegal-alien

[Roll the Bones 74]

Don't bother replying... I already laughed right at your face.

So you are saying don't make the Dream Act law since it will encourage illegal immigrantion so that their kids can become citizens. I am not saying that that wouldn't happen, but I doubt that is the primary reason Undoc Workers come here. It is mainly for work to be able to support their family.In any case there are about 65,000 undocs graduating high school each year, much like the kid I mentioned. These kids aren't saying, well, since I can't go to college I'll just leave and go back to some foriegn country where I don't know anyone and hardly speak the language, and you know, I don't have any money so I'll just hitch hike there. But, I can see them turning to illegal activities if no other avenues are open to them. They can also work under the table the rest of their lives and try to avoid paying taxes, let alone the law.Or, we can give them a path to cititizenship which would entail them getting a college diploma or entering the military. They can be eligible for student loans, but not grants (like Pell). They must be good moral charachter meaning good school history and no past problems with the law. This way, the innocent victims, the children, would have a path to being productive valued citizens. It wouldn't cost anything and would in fact have many, many benefits for the country.And people talk about not looking at one specific kid as an example, but that is what you have to do. People watch the news and don't care about 5000 people dying in a flood in Pakistan or millions starving in Africa, until you break it down to a personal level. Charities no this and the fact the less number of kids shown in the ad, the more money you raise. It becomes more peronal when you relate to a single individual.So, this kid has been here since he was 3 and only knows this country and is as American as anyone you know. We can give him a path to become a citizen. One that will pay taxes and add value to our society, or we can put him in prison for a crime he had nothing to do with, and if that torture isn't enough for a kid, we can kick him back to Guatemala where he knows no one and barely knows the language. He would go to prison there which is mostly run by the gangs; the guards don't enter the facility just protect the perimeter from escapes. To get food and water you have to have someone bring it, bribe the guards and the gangs, and hope something is left. But, you know, he doesn't know anyone there to bring it anyway. You could always become someone's bitch and hope to live a year or two. If he could avoid prison, living on the streets wouldn't be that much better. Now, imagine if that was YOUR kid.

[Roll the Bones 74]

I understand laws are laws and we have principle to follow, but at what point are do we consider human well-being into this equation? Isn't that what we should really be about as humans regarding laws and principles?

[Balloon guy 158]

I understand laws are laws and we have principle to follow, but at what point are do we consider human well-being into this equation? Isn't that what we should really be about as humans regarding laws and principles?

Which government employee do you want making the decision as to which person should be exempt from the current laws?

[hblask 1]

Which government employee do you want making the decision as to which person should be exempt from the current laws?

If the laws were based on fundamental moral principles, we wouldn't have to be making choices like this. Flawed laws produce flawed results.

[Balloon guy 158]

If the laws were based on fundamental moral principles, we wouldn't have to be making choices like this. Flawed laws produce flawed results.

Judeo-Christian ones?Which morality do we use to allow a law on immigration to be based on a person's qualities? While overlooking their current status as a law breaker?Step One qualifications for automatic front of the line citizenship:1. Is the person committing a crime?NO? Go to 2Yes? Qualification test over, you failed!2. Is the person employed?No? Qualification test over, you failed!Yes? How? You aren't allowed to be in this country, rethink answer.

[Roll the Bones 74]

Judeo-Christian ones?Which morality do we use to allow a law on immigration to be based on a person's qualities? While overlooking their current status as a law breaker?Step One qualifications for automatic front of the line citizenship:1. Is the person committing a crime?NO? Go to 2Yes? Qualification test over, you failed!2. Is the person employed?No? Qualification test over, you failed!Yes? How? You aren't allowed to be in this country, rethink answer.

We already do this when allowing people to immigrate. Are you saying that we can't make a law because we can't use some common sense to come up with rules to decide which of these kids can stay?

[Balloon guy 158]

We already do this when allowing people to immigrate. Are you saying that we can't make a law because we can't use some common sense to come up with rules to decide which of these kids can stay?

I'm saying that almost 100% of blanket benchmarks for a law will ALWAYS have an instance where it doesn't produce the results we expect. Some kids should be allowed to drive at 14, others not till they are 24, doesn't mean we shouldn't have the 16 year old law and not let some DMV employee have the ability to circumvent the law whenever they think the can?

[Roll the Bones 74]

I'm saying that almost 100% of blanket benchmarks for a law will ALWAYS have an instance where it doesn't produce the results we expect. Some kids should be allowed to drive at 14, others not till they are 24, doesn't mean we shouldn't have the 16 year old law and not let some DMV employee have the ability to circumvent the law whenever they think the can?

I think we will eventually be able to come up with testing that will determine driving ability and maturity levels scientifically, until then having a basic age for priveledges makes sense. But we are rally talkling about a bigger issue here. In some cases this is life or death for innocent victims.