Trouble Moving Up

[KosinTrouble 0]

i have been playing poker for about 2 months now (Started jan 1), I have played a handfull of games live at friends houses before but just started trying to really learn the game as a new years resolution.I started out with a small bankroll (just under 100) and I am up to $150. I have been only playing the .01/.02 tables trying to figure out the game, the tells ect....i am trying to move up to the .02/.05 tables but I find I just can not hold my own. And I am not sure what I am doing wrong. It seems that everytime I get a decent starting hand, AJ/AQ/AK ect... Let me start over, sorry if this turns out to be a long post, but I was told to give as much info as possible...I get a good starting hand, AJ/AQ/AK/JJ/QQ, I raise the pot to 4bb's to .20 (is this too low should i be raising more? if so how much more?). if I miss the flop, I usually do a cbet of the amount I orig raised too (again is this correct, should i do more). I either get raised or cold called. So my question is should I continue to bet after? i am finding if I continue someone almost always has bottom pair and beats me. if I check then they raise it to .50-1.00 which for an a high card hand I have to auto fold. (Again is this correct?)I am using the Poker Tracker 3 to show my hands and stuff, what should I be looking at to figure out where my holes are? I know i am hardly making anything on my non-showdown stat, nearly all the money I make is when I make 2pair, trips, boat ect and get paid off. but I find those are the only hands I ever win. I maybe win 1-10 cbet's that I make, so any profit from the good hands I lose. if I dont cbet, then everyone does fold when I do finally make a hand and I bet. so i seem to be trapped. I just dont know what to do or where to look to figure out where my hole is.Kos

[KingJames 11]

i have been playing poker for about 2 months now (Started jan 1), I have played a handfull of games live at friends houses before but just started trying to really learn the game as a new years resolution.I started out with a small bankroll (just under 100) and I am up to $150. I have been only playing the .01/.02 tables trying to figure out the game, the tells ect....i am trying to move up to the .02/.05 tables but I find I just can not hold my own. And I am not sure what I am doing wrong. It seems that everytime I get a decent starting hand, AJ/AQ/AK ect... Let me start over, sorry if this turns out to be a long post, but I was told to give as much info as possible...I get a good starting hand, AJ/AQ/AK/JJ/QQ, I raise the pot to 4bb's to .20 (is this too low should i be raising more? if so how much more?). if I miss the flop, I usually do a cbet of the amount I orig raised too (again is this correct, should i do more). I either get raised or cold called. So my question is should I continue to bet after?i am finding if I continue someone almost always has bottom pair and beats me. if I check then they raise it to .50-1.00 which for an a high card hand I have to auto fold. (Again is this correct?)I am using the Poker Tracker 3 to show my hands and stuff, what should I be looking at to figure out where my holes are? I know i am hardly making anything on my non-showdown stat, nearly all the money I make is when I make 2pair, trips, boat ect and get paid off. but I find those are the only hands I ever win. I maybe win 1-10 cbet's that I make, so any profit from the good hands I lose. if I dont cbet, then everyone does fold when I do finally make a hand and I bet. so i seem to be trapped. I just dont know what to do or where to look to figure out where my hole is.Kos

1) C-betting needs to be tailored the the board, the player, positions etc.2) Winning money is the goal. Regardless of how you do it; SD or Non-SD. And yes, at the micros the way to win the gold is to make hands and value-bet. Your bluffs are mainly limited to c-betting good boards etc.

[spydur86 0]

I rarely ever C-Bet at low limits with air. You're going to get called by too many random hands fishing to build a hand. I prefer C/F or C/R because at least then you're trying to represent strength as opposed to betting just because you did preflop.

[FARGOpokerND 22]

Do not worry about nonSD winnings. For the record, most players are losers at nonSD.As KingJames said, you cbet dependent on the flop. If you are in position on a dry flop (Kc-8d-2h) you can get away with betting ~1/2 pot, if you are out of position on a wet board (Kh-Th-8s) you can bet 3/4 pot.Sounds like you are going about this the right way...remember poker is a game that takes a long time to learn so be patient!

[KosinTrouble 0]

Do not worry about nonSD winnings. For the record, most players are losers at nonSD.As KingJames said, you cbet dependent on the flop. If you are in position on a dry flop (Kc-8d-2h) you can get away with betting ~1/2 pot, if you are out of position on a wet board (Kh-Th-8s) you can bet 3/4 pot.Sounds like you are going about this the right way...remember poker is a game that takes a long time to learn so be patient!

*SIGH*Looks like I am moving back down to the .01/.02... Just lost $15 which was my limit I put on those tables.. If I lose that much then I am to move back down till I hit 150 again..... And just when I was making progress. I know I was losing to much from cbetting and losing too much from chasing. Other times, I just couldnt let go of my pocket pairs...Like you said, its a game of patientence, and I just didnt have it today, and now I have to spend who knows how long trying to get it back... lolThanks again for the advice.kosin Trouble AKA Loser of the .02/.05 micros

[KosinTrouble 0]

*SIGH*Looks like I am moving back down to the .01/.02... Just lost $15 which was my limit I put on those tables.. If I lose that much then I am to move back down till I hit 150 again..... And just when I was making progress. I know I was losing to much from cbetting and losing too much from chasing. Other times, I just couldnt let go of my pocket pairs...Like you said, its a game of patientence, and I just didnt have it today, and now I have to spend who knows how long trying to get it back... lolThanks again for the advice.kosin Trouble AKA Loser of the .02/.05 micros

Ouch Nice bad beatPokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comHero (SB) ($5.62)BB ($3)UTG ($0.46)UTG+1 ($3.19)MP1 ($4.74)MP2 ($2.51)CO ($2.22)Button ($5)Preflop: Hero is SB with K, K1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.02, 4 folds, Hero bets $0.06, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.04Flop: ($0.14) 10, 7, K(2 players)Hero bets $0.10, UTG+1 calls $0.10Turn: ($0.34) 10(2 players)Hero bets $0.10, UTG+1 raises to $0.20, Hero raises to $5.46 (All-In), UTG+1 calls $2.83 (All-In)River: ($6.40) 10(2 players, 2 all-in)Total pot: $6.40 | Rake: $0.30What it didnt show is the Villian made Quad 10's... I lost sadly.. but damn, I had him good!Kos

[Suited_Up 2]

*SIGH*Looks like I am moving back down to the .01/.02... Just lost $15 which was my limit I put on those tables.. If I lose that much then I am to move back down till I hit 150 again..... And just when I was making progress. I know I was losing to much from cbetting and losing too much from chasing. Other times, I just couldnt let go of my pocket pairs...Like you said, its a game of patientence, and I just didnt have it today, and now I have to spend who knows how long trying to get it back... lolThanks again for the advice.kosin Trouble AKA Loser of the .02/.05 micros

Regarding not folding... tip of the century....If they show strength on the turn, raise, checkraise, something along those lines... you better have a monster to continue.

[CobaltBlue 662]

Ouch Nice bad beatPokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comHero (SB) ($5.62)BB ($3)UTG ($0.46)UTG+1 ($3.19)MP1 ($4.74)MP2 ($2.51)CO ($2.22)Button ($5)Preflop: Hero is SB with K, K1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.02, 4 folds, Hero bets $0.06, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.04Flop: ($0.14) 10, 7, K(2 players)Hero bets $0.10, UTG+1 calls $0.10Turn: ($0.34) 10(2 players)Hero bets $0.10, UTG+1 raises to $0.20, Hero raises to $5.46 (All-In), UTG+1 calls $2.83 (All-In)River: ($6.40) 10(2 players, 2 all-in)Total pot: $6.40 | Rake: $0.30What it didnt show is the Villian made Quad 10's... I lost sadly.. but damn, I had him good!Kos

Raise more pre-flop. Flop bet's fine. If your plan was to look weak on the turn to induce a raise, looks good. If your plan was to value bet, bet more. When he raises the turn, I suppose you're getting value by shoving against trip tens, but you're pretty much shutting out every other hand.

[lurbz 2]

Do not worry about nonSD winnings. For the record, most players are losers at nonSD.

You know the sad part is that I'm a winner @ nonSD in cash games and a slight loser @ showdown.Does this mean I suck?

[MaxStPolish 4]

you do seem to be going about this exactly the right way though, these guys here can give you mad tips/ideas to help your solid foundation. GL bud.

[Naked_Cowboy 0]

At these stakes, imagine that your opponents are sitting at a desk with a button that says call that's about 1 foot in diameter. They also have a button that says fold that's about half an inch in diameter, and it's barely within reach. There's also a raise button, but it's in another room, guarded by a sharktopus. They have to press a button. They need a pretty compelling reason (Oh no, i only have ace high, bottom pair, etc are not compelling enough to them) to reach over to hit the tiny fold button, and they need a HUGE reason to go storm the sharktopus and raise. Got it?For the level you're playing, this is what i want you to do:You don't have to balance your range by cbetting flops you miss, because especially in a multiway pot, you aren't going to get your opponent to find their fold button. When you do make a pair, bet it. the stronger your made hand, the more you should bet. "but won't they know if i bet half pot i only have a pair and almost pot i have a big hand? that seems obvious" No, no they will not. I promise. Good luck at the tables. When you beat this level for enough that you are ready to move up, come back and we'll tweak your strategy for the next level. Also, don't get discouraged by bad beats. In the long run, the fact that you're thinking this much about what you're doing to want to fix it means you're better than almost everyone you're playing against so far. The long run can be very long.

[chrispycream 0]

ROFL

[KingJames 11]

Great post, NC!I did LOL at the sharktopus

[Naked_Cowboy 0]

i realize i presented it in a humorous fashion, but i'm very serious about the underlying point.Sklansky talks about how every poker player is thinking on a specific level. Level 0: what are my cardsLevel 1: what does my opponent haveLevel 2: what does my oppenent think I haveLevel 3: what does my opponent think i think he hasetc.If someone is on level zero, and they're only thinking about what they have, expecting your opponent to react to information you're attempting to give him about your hand - expecting him to make decisions based on that information is a waste. you may as well be giving him instructions in klingon. you cannot effectively play more than 1 level above your opponents in this regard or you will be "leveling yourself". When you cbet as a bluff, you are saying "i have a better hand than you, you should fold". This is not effective vs. someone only considering his or her own cards.

[Suited_Up 2]

aka Bar Poker.

[KosinTrouble 0]

i realize i presented it in a humorous fashion, but i'm very serious about the underlying point.Sklansky talks about how every poker player is thinking on a specific level. Level 0: what are my cardsLevel 1: what does my opponent haveLevel 2: what does my oppenent think I haveLevel 3: what does my opponent think i think he hasetc.If someone is on level zero, and they're only thinking about what they have, expecting your opponent to react to information you're attempting to give him about your hand - expecting him to make decisions based on that information is a waste. you may as well be giving him instructions in klingon. you cannot effectively play more than 1 level above your opponents in this regard or you will be "leveling yourself". When you cbet as a bluff, you are saying "i have a better hand than you, you should fold". This is not effective vs. someone only considering his or her own cards.

yeah I have read that book, and I think my problem is that I am not thinking at level 0... I am thinking at level 1, and just naturally thinking the people I am playing with are also thinking that. But thanks again for pointing that out and I did take it to heart during my session tonight, and I am happy to say I ended up +$5... Which I know isnt much, but when you are playing .01/.02 tables I think is ok. Definitly better than my usual $1-$2sessions.I was really really cognisant of how many hands i was playing. I layed down the suited connectors in EP, limped sometimes raised with them in co/button position to mix it up. If I hit TPTK, I did a good size bet, if someone called, I went really slow. If I flopped a monster I still bet like I did with TPTK but then really let lose after the turn or right after the flop if there was chances at straights/flushes bet so the price isnt right...KingJames... I droped my vpip by about 10 so I was more along 18-20% instead of my normal 30%.So thanks again for the replys everyone. Fish/Donks like me appriciate the help! Sadly many more posts will be coming with questions ect...Kosin Trouble

[Suited_Up 2]

Limping with anything is almost always bad.

[KosinTrouble 0]

Limping with anything is almost always bad.

This is a good statement but I would like to throw a few scenario's and hope you will give your take on them. Any and all feedback is always appriciated.In some late position (including button) and you have 78s, 79s, 56s, 57s, there is 2 people that limped in, you know SB/BB will just call/check to see the flop. Would you raise it up a few BB's or just limp in? In this case I usually just limp in. What if there is more than 2 limpers?In some late position (including button) and you have K10s, there is 2 people that limped in, you know SB/BB will just call/check to see the flop. Would you raise it up a few BB's or just limp in? In this case I usually pop it up 3BB's. What if there is more than 3 limpers? I still pop it 3BB or something even 5BB if I know I will only get the 1 caller.In some late position (including button) and you have 34s,35s, there is 2 people that limped in, you know SB/BB will just call/check to see the flop. Would you raise it up a few BB's or just limp in? In this case I usually just limp in.KosinTrouble

[KingJames 11]

Open-limping with anything is almost always bad.

fypKT, just post a bunch of hands in the NLcash forum, yo

[Suited_Up 2]

fypKT, just post a bunch of hands in the NLcash forum, yo

Yeah, you're right.

[KosinTrouble 0]

Yeah, you're right.

Well it lookd like i get to try moving up again tonight. I won back my money to put me over the 150 mark again. So I will try again tonight at the .02/.05 tables and see how it goes. Last 4-5 days been playing really well, I think, at least I feel confident. Been raising more to get of the limpers, been picking my cbets ect.. I know still have a long way to go.I dont play a lot of tables, only have 2 going at any given time. I just really focus on who I am playing against and try figuring out their opening ranges and figure out what they are playing then just steal their staks when I can. Kosin Trouble