DonMcCoy 0 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Lately I've been trying to get a good recommendation on a great cash game strategy book. I went with what I was getting the most positive feedback from, and chose No Limit Hold'em Theory and Practice by David Sklansky, and Ed Miller. I get to page 5, "About This Book", and I read the following: I have been reluctant all these years to write a no limit book, even one that dealt mainly with theory, because I know that theoreticians without other talents will still be underdogs to talented non-theoreticians, especially if stacks are large relative to the blinds. By that I mean that many no limit skills are not theoretical in nature, and they require you to observe and adjust well to your surroundings. I'm talking about skills like:1. Reading hands and/or assigning probabilities to competing hands.2. Knowing when to "change gears"3. Using deception.4. Making others play badly (through mannerisms, conversation, or strategy).5. Playing hands in ways that set up extra profits in the future.A "talented" player who is good at these skills, but who has a shaky theoretical understanding of the game, can often easily beat a less talented player who has mastered the theory.Is there any books that you could recommend to me that focuses on the skills necessary to be talented? I am only interested in NO Limit Hold'em for small stakes cash games. Thank you very much!Thank you for your time. Link to post Share on other sites
babylondonks 5 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Honestly the only way to become "talented" in such a manner is to dive right in and get experience Link to post Share on other sites
trystero 0 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 listen to this donk Link to post Share on other sites
Danege 1 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Read John Grishams "The Client".It will tell you everything you need to on how to learn the right skills to beat poker. Link to post Share on other sites
mtdesmoines 3 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Lately I've been trying to get a good recommendation on a great cash game strategy book. I went with what I was getting the most positive feedback from, and chose No Limit Hold'em Theory and Practice by David Sklansky, and Ed Miller. I get to page 5, "About This Book", and I read the following: I have been reluctant all these years to write a no limit book, even one that dealt mainly with theory, because I know that theoreticians without other talents will still be underdogs to talented non-theoreticians, especially if stacks are large relative to the blinds. By that I mean that many no limit skills are not theoretical in nature, and they require you to observe and adjust well to your surroundings. I'm talking about skills like:1. Reading hands and/or assigning probabilities to competing hands.2. Knowing when to "change gears"3. Using deception.4. Making others play badly (through mannerisms, conversation, or strategy).5. Playing hands in ways that set up extra profits in the future.A "talented" player who is good at these skills, but who has a shaky theoretical understanding of the game, can often easily beat a less talented player who has mastered the theory.Is there any books that you could recommend to me that focuses on the skills necessary to be talented? I am only interested in NO Limit Hold'em for small stakes cash games. Thank you very much!Thank you for your time.I take it that's the quoted part. I think the difficult part Sklansky is referring to is that the game is organic. People change styles and different people play different styles and table texture means more than anything (esp in live poker). I've seen tables seem like a dead thing for 4 hours and then suddenly wake up and go ape with no explanation other than someone did one thing and someone else noticed and tried to exploit what they perceive as a mistake or even a tendency. It's when those cycles of style exploitation begin that the game really starts. So watch players. See them make adjustments to one another and think about why that might be happening. Think about the windows of opportunity that styles, tendencies, and mistakes offer to you. I think "talent" might be boiled down to being observant and being a good critical thinker. Link to post Share on other sites
Ninja Ace 1 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 Honestly this book is fantastic, and a required reading for my students. It is true that you need experience to gain those other edges, but this book teaches a ton of principles of how to think properly Link to post Share on other sites
JoblessBast 0 Posted February 18, 2010 Share Posted February 18, 2010 I think the difficult part Sklansky is referring to is that the game is organic. People change styles and different people play different styles and table texture means more than anything (esp in live poker). I've seen tables seem like a dead thing for 4 hours and then suddenly wake up and go ape with no explanation other than someone did one thing and someone else noticed and tried to exploit what they perceive as a mistake or even a tendency. It's when those cycles of style exploitation begin that the game really starts. So watch players. See them make adjustments to one another and think about why that might be happening. Think about the windows of opportunity that styles, tendencies, and mistakes offer to you. I think "talent" might be boiled down to being observant and being a good critical thinker.Well put. Link to post Share on other sites
BaseJester 1 Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 Beginning players tend to overestimate the importance of deception in small stakes games and underestimate the importance (and difficulty) of self-control. Many times people intellectually capable of the correct move allow their emotions rule to overrule their intellects. There are books on this (e.g., Zen of Poker), but you really have to practice over a stretch of hands. Link to post Share on other sites
fighter 4 Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 Lately I've been trying to get a good recommendation on a great cash game strategy book. I went with what I was getting the most positive feedback from, and chose No Limit Hold'em Theory and Practice by David Sklansky, and Ed Miller. I get to page 5, "About This Book", and I read the following: I have been reluctant all these years to write a no limit book, even one that dealt mainly with theory, because I know that theoreticians without other talents will still be underdogs to talented non-theoreticians, especially if stacks are large relative to the blinds. By that I mean that many no limit skills are not theoretical in nature, and they require you to observe and adjust well to your surroundings. I'm talking about skills like:1. Reading hands and/or assigning probabilities to competing hands.2. Knowing when to "change gears"3. Using deception.4. Making others play badly (through mannerisms, conversation, or strategy).5. Playing hands in ways that set up extra profits in the future.A "talented" player who is good at these skills, but who has a shaky theoretical understanding of the game, can often easily beat a less talented player who has mastered the theory.Is there any books that you could recommend to me that focuses on the skills necessary to be talented? I am only interested in NO Limit Hold'em for small stakes cash games. Thank you very much!Thank you for your time.mathematics of poker. It is the completely opposite direction for what you are looking for and breaks down what you are talking about into mathematical theories. It is the book you need, not the book you want. Link to post Share on other sites
Ninja Ace 1 Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 mathematics of poker. It is the completely opposite direction for what you are looking for and breaks down what you are talking about into mathematical theories. It is the book you need, not the book you want.I tried reading this after Simo suggested it and wanted to light my head on fire. Link to post Share on other sites
DonMcCoy 0 Posted February 19, 2010 Author Share Posted February 19, 2010 I tried reading this after Simo suggested it and wanted to light my head on fire.LMMFAO!!! So, what else did you get out of it? LOL! Link to post Share on other sites
Ninja Ace 1 Posted February 19, 2010 Share Posted February 19, 2010 LMMFAO!!! So, what else did you get out of it? LOL!Well if you play sit and goes the section on push/fold is good... and the A/K/Q game tells you a decent amount about balancing ranges (and how little it usually takes) but honestly it's such complex statistics I didn't want to put in the effort to understand more. It's got a lot of info I just hated it Link to post Share on other sites
30odd6 0 Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 well, ive found that poker is about setting people up. the way to do that is deception i.e.losing small pots on a bluff and showing, chk-raisng out of position to see what a certain player will do, etc. lose small to win big. the way to do gain these skills is practice and some times practice costs money. you need to give action to get action and math and theory dont mean as much as setting the trap. sure, grinding it out pays off too but thats hard work and aint as fun. the math will fall into place later when you have it. theory is what you make it. the art to poker is knowing what your oppenent has and telling him/making him believe you have better...but this can only be done so often. it puts doubt in thier mind that will get you paid off big. then its back to solid poker. so poker is....if i have this and he does that but the turn brings this will he do that and believe i have it when i do this??? its all experience! or will i get paid off if i do this and he catches that but it makes me this and i have the nuts when he doesnt see it...on and on we can go godd luck! Link to post Share on other sites
Danege 1 Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 math and theory dont mean as much as setting the trap.Hellmuth ITT. Link to post Share on other sites
fighter 4 Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 Well if you play sit and goes the section on push/fold is good... and the A/K/Q game tells you a decent amount about balancing ranges (and how little it usually takes) but honestly it's such complex statistics I didn't want to put in the effort to understand more. It's got a lot of info I just hated itWell at least you explained why you got nothing out of this book. Link to post Share on other sites
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