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Ok, i'm in a live 2-5 game, in for a G. I'm at about 600, when this hand comes up. I've been playing tight, and the villain, whom recently moved to table 30 min ago, has folded every hand pre-flop. He has me covered.UTG - foldsUTG + 1 - foldsMP1 - foldsMP2 - foldsMP3 - folds Cutoff Hero (stack is $600)- calls $5 9 :5c 8 :3h (i know probably should raise, but really, other than for taking the betting lead, that's all it was going to accomplish at this table, especially with SB state of mind)Button foldsSB (stack is $500ish) - calls $5BB Villain (stack is over $700) - raises to $25Hero callsSB callsOk, the SB has recently got stacked, twice, and has been calling ALOT of raises pre-flop, and c/f on flop. I chose to call with position, even though BB seems tight at the moment. Flop ($90) -3 :club: 10 :ts J :4h SB checksBB checksHero bets $60SB foldsBB calls $60Obv, had there been a c-bet, i probably would've folded. BB took 1/2 a minute to call.Turn2 :qh BB checksHero ?Do you check for pot control? Do you fire 2nd barrel? I find it odd BB has checked twice now. Keep in mind that BB hasn't seen play a hand past pre-flop either. He just got to table, never played with me, and this is both our first hand (with both us at table).I'll let you know what happened. I'm really interested on thoughts of flop, and turn. Thanks for the feedback.

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The problem with this flop is that, with more than 2 to the flop, it likely hits people square on the head. What are you going to do when you bet, and get c/r by one of them with KdQx or with AdTx or by any bazillion combos out there?Check behind so you can save a sticky turn situation when you get called light and you don't hit one of the 6 cards that help you (and even a Q isn't that good because villain could have AK w/ a diamond)

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The problem with this flop is that, with more than 2 to the flop, it likely hits people square on the head. What are you going to do when you bet, and get c/r by one of them with KdQx or with AdTx or by any bazillion combos out there?Check behind so you can save a sticky turn situation when you get called light and you don't hit one of the 6 cards that help you (and even a Q isn't that good because villain could have AK w/ a diamond)
I agree with you. Terrible flop. 9 timesout of 10 i check behind. My reasoning, for betting, is i felt i had a really good chance to get both to fold. SB was cfolding ALOT on flops, and he would normally bet out if he caught a piece or even a draw. I should mention that he kept saying that he needed to get back to even..definitely tilting.BB, is kind of the wildcard. His check on flop led me to believe he had nothing..so i wasn't betting for my draw, i was trying to take the pot away. Any aggression i was going to fold, unless the c-raise was the min...then i guess i could justify going for the 6 outs...
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The problem with this flop is that, with more than 2 to the flop, it likely hits people square on the head. What are you going to do when you bet, and get c/r by one of them with KdQx or with AdTx or by any bazillion combos out there?Check behind so you can save a sticky turn situation when you get called light and you don't hit one of the 6 cards that help you (and even a Q isn't that good because villain could have AK w/ a diamond)
Agree that the peel is the best play here, not only to try and make your hand but it it looks like you can bluff a lot of non diamond river cards as well
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I think having bet the flop, the hero should keep firing on all streets. Bet flop, check turn, and then bet river is often looked up by the villain.

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I think it's a standard spot to bet. I'd double barrel and be prepared to fire the river too, he's not folding overpairs ever or even like AJ, but he has a lot of 1dia high card hands. By checking you are just giving up, SB can literally have any 2 cards and once this flop gets checked and not c/r BB is basically saying he has a medium strength hand that you can push him off. Obv you fold if you get c/r but getting c/r off of a hand where you have the bad side of a tsraight draw and any dia hurts you isn't bad at all. You have at most 6 outs.By betting flop you get to turn your hand into a bluff right off the bat and still can hit good cards. If you aren't going to attack good boards in position you probably aren't going to turn a profit with suited connectors by playing them just for value. It's pretty close though.I think betting every street and folding to a raise is by far the most profitable way to play this hand.

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I think it's a standard spot to bet. I'd double barrel and be prepared to fire the river too, he's not folding overpairs ever or even like AJ, but he has a lot of 1dia high card hands. By checking you are just giving up, SB can literally have any 2 cards and once this flop gets checked and not c/r BB is basically saying he has a medium strength hand that you can push him off. Obv you fold if you get c/r but getting c/r off of a hand where you have the bad side of a tsraight draw and any dia hurts you isn't bad at all. You have at most 6 outs.By betting flop you get to turn your hand into a bluff right off the bat and still can hit good cards. If you aren't going to attack good boards in position you probably aren't going to turn a profit with suited connectors by playing them just for value. It's pretty close though.I think betting every street and folding to a raise is by far the most profitable way to play this hand.
I like the bolded as I have always been told that monotone boards are good to bluff at, but we should do it with hands which have lesss/no equity. Right?
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I think it's a standard spot to bet. I'd double barrel and be prepared to fire the river too, he's not folding overpairs ever or even like AJ, but he has a lot of 1dia high card hands. By checking you are just giving up, SB can literally have any 2 cards and once this flop gets checked and not c/r BB is basically saying he has a medium strength hand that you can push him off. Obv you fold if you get c/r but getting c/r off of a hand where you have the bad side of a tsraight draw and any dia hurts you isn't bad at all. You have at most 6 outs.By betting flop you get to turn your hand into a bluff right off the bat and still can hit good cards. If you aren't going to attack good boards in position you probably aren't going to turn a profit with suited connectors by playing them just for value. It's pretty close though.I think betting every street and folding to a raise is by far the most profitable way to play this hand.
i completely agree with this. i was hoping i wasnt the only one thinking this. the flop check is what made me decide to barrell. if c/raised, im folding, and if villain bets out on turn, depending, i'm most likely folding.....so on with the hand:on turn:BB checksHero bets $80 (too small in hindsight)BB tanks for a minute, and callsRiver $3608 :club: FINAL BOARD Villain bets $165Hero?At this point, i'm thinking he either hit 88, or, he has air. HIS bet made no sense to me...
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Passive opps sometimes play TT/JJ this way because they wanna make sure no diamond falls before they get it in. You're basically hoping he only has AQ/AK with a diamond, because you beat zero of the rest of his range. I think I fold.

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Passive opps sometimes play TT/JJ this way because they wanna make sure no diamond falls before they get it in. You're basically hoping he only has AQ/AK with a diamond, because you beat zero of the rest of his range. I think I fold.
That's definitely a possibility....but being as far as i was in the hand, and with that odd river bet, would you give up? a c-bet would have to bet that flop, unless they are super passive...that's my thinking...anyways, i insta-called. i put himon a-k/a-q, with a big diamond...he mucked...i really think i should have shoved, just in case he had something like a-10/a-j/q-j, that i couldn't beat but he couldnt call..not sure if i would have called/raised river if i didnt make a pair...but all those combos, would most likely check from BB...especially with the image i had (for the time he sat down)...only one, was 1010, JJ for a set..however, i really really think they'd bet flop/turn instead of c-calling...especially against only 2 other ppl...everything screamed of big diamond draw and no pair...anyone think i played this really bad?
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i really think i should have shoved, just in case he had something like a-10/a-j/q-j, that i couldn't beat but he couldnt call..
Shoving here would be pretty bad. The vast majority of players are only taking the check-call, check-call, donk line with a bluff or a monster.
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Shoving here would be pretty bad. The vast majority of players are only taking the check-call, check-call, donk line with a bluff or a monster.
So do you think calling>folding>shove on river? Or folding>calling>shove? How about the rest of the hand? If u dont mind commenting a bit more..
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So do you think calling>folding>shove on river? Or folding>calling>shove? How about the rest of the hand? If u dont mind commenting a bit more..
I would call, but I tend to be a call station. I think he's repping exactly the flopped flush or weakly played over cards with a flush draw.As for the rest of the hand..."(i know probably should raise, but really, other than for taking the betting lead, that's all it was going to accomplish at this table, especially with SB state of mind)"This is really bad. Just raise coming into the hand. There are better 6m/FR players than me here, but I can't imagine open-limping from the cutoff is ever going to be an optimal way to play. That said, it's even worse because of the way the SB is playing. You say he's calling a lot, but you also said this:"SB was cfolding ALOT on flops, and he would normally bet out if he caught a piece or even a draw."You're just throwing money away by not trying to get heads up with this guy every chance you can. What more can you ask than having a guy call every raise and check-fold a lot?Your turn bet is too small, but you already know that. Make it 140-160 and you have a nice sized river bluff bet still in the chamber.
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