Townsend Admits Violation Of Tilt T&c

[TheWynn 0]

Pokernews ArticleWhat do you guys think about this?

[dna4ever 2]

Pokernews ArticleWhat do you guys think about this?

wowYou have to expect at those stakes this is happening behind the scenes, but to so nonchalantly disclose this as if it wasn't a big deal is a huge blunder that will probably end up with some sort of financial restitution for Isildur1.

[zengame 0]

Collusion...in my mind it's cheating.

[Ship_itt 0]

if its against T&C then i guess its 'cheating' and there should be a penalty..but i believe this happens alllll the time even in tournaments. If someone goes deep in a tourney its very common for a buddy to give any info he has on the table to his friend. "dutchslugger min raises alot pre and makes few mistakes post flop" or even live tourneys gong up to a buddy and seeing a familar face at his table "hey i played with that guy 3 hours yesterday he 4xs all his big hands and is capable of 3barreling his stack off with air" ..I mean this isnt as in dept as the research and work put into the HHs they shared but is this not the exact same thing? Is this 'wrong' as well?

[mrpaddyx 13]

Its one thing to acutally share hand history (which given the scale is very wrong) but a complete dumb ass thing to admit it in an interview. I think Isildur1 definately has a case in getting some money back of FT.

[CaneBrain 95]

not a huge deal. if they want to give Isuldur some money back, hey fine whatever.

[DonkSlayer 1]

if its against T&C then i guess its 'cheating' and there should be a penalty..but i believe this happens alllll the time even in tournaments. If someone goes deep in a tourney its very common for a buddy to give any info he has on the table to his friend. "dutchslugger min raises alot pre and makes few mistakes post flop" or even live tourneys gong up to a buddy and seeing a familar face at his table "hey i played with that guy 3 hours yesterday he 4xs all his big hands and is capable of 3barreling his stack off with air" ..I mean this isnt as in dept as the research and work put into the HHs they shared but is this not the exact same thing? Is this 'wrong' as well?

To me this is massively different than what they've admitted to. It's one thing to share rather anecdotal evidence from a couple of times you've played the guy (really, is it any different than yelling at a football game to watch a safety blitz??), but to share hand histories and analyses imo is a complete new level.The other issue here is that this was done specifically to take money from one other play or "beat" someone, rather than to 1. train to get better and/or 2. find out a little more about a players' tendencies. Given the circumstances of Isildur's rush and hand volume in the given period of time, to me this is akin to a HU tourney where each player Isildur beats shares his HH and opinions with the next guy, just so SOMEONE can knock him off. BS.

[Ship_itt 0]

what about ghosting someone to a win?

[Jambot 0]

I can't help but feel that this is something that happens very frequently at all levels of the game, but it's just not something that's talked about.The problem is, probably due to excitement and naivity, it has been talked about. Now that it's going to get a massive amount of publicity in poker news sites and forums, it's quite likely that Full Tilt will have to do something.What that is, I'm not exactly sure though. Can they return $4mm to Isildur1 based purely on something said in an interview?As with all most things about online poker, I wouldn't think anyone at FT has much of an idea about exactly what action should be taken either, because so much stuff is made up as folks go along! I guess this will set the precedent for any future cases.All in all - keeping mouth shut would have been smart. I'm betting Townsend did a 'D'oh!' acompanied by a facepalm so hard the smack could be heard blocks away when he saw this.

[keith crime 8]

If they weren't using a computer program with a billion hands i don't feel like there is really anything wrong with itIt seems to me to be the equivalent of two poker friends watching every Phil Hellmuth television episode together and figuring out the best way to beat him based on thatIf Lebron James and Carmelo Anthony spent all summer trying to figure out how to shut Kobe Bryant down would that be wrongIf it's against the site rules that one thing, but unless it's a huge corporate effort i don't think it is that unethicalWhat if a company hired the top ten US pros to be a team and constantly play heads up against one guy and analyzed all of the data of the people that they backed?That's essentially what people do in the stock market - although it would be a lot easier to analyze a single player than the whole stock market

[Donnie Ray 0]

townsend should keep his mouth shut and i think The Wynn should post more so we can look at the pics.

[Mercury69 3]

3rd party apps ruin almost everything except the IPhone.

[Jariso13 1]

At first I was like alright who cares its poker and Isodur could have easily readjusted his game and exploited his tendencies...But, then I thought some more and if its against the terms of service, and was part of what cost me $4 million I would be pissed too. I'm sure this happens a bunch at those stakes. I'm sure that those 3 players have done this exact thing b4. But, its its against the rules...and it seems that it is...punishment should be given. But I dont know how to correct this. Lets say you give Iso back 4 mill. Now what? If these three players play Iso again they technically still have the advantage because they have seen and discussed 30k extra hands that they didnt play. Because of this I think no money will end up switching hands. I think they will just send Iso a Full Tilt Jersey and make him a silver iron man for the month of December

[Mercury69 3]

Jariso eat my butt (had to be done, sry...)

[king_tanner 84]

I don't see how this is any different from posting hands in a strategy forum and asking for advice.

[StrippersNBlow 0]

I guess we'll see how much cheating is acceptable. Is it ok if you swap a database of 20,000 hands but 1,000,000 is too much? We'll see if they have the balls to enforce the rule they put in place, or if Townsend just gets another slap on the wrist.

[Suited_Up 2]

At first I was like alright who cares its poker and Isodur could have easily readjusted his game and exploited his tendencies...But, then I thought some more and if its against the terms of service, and was part of what cost me $4 million I would be pissed too. I'm sure this happens a bunch at those stakes. I'm sure that those 3 players have done this exact thing b4. But, its its against the rules...and it seems that it is...punishment should be given. But I dont know how to correct this. Lets say you give Iso back 4 mill. Now what? If these three players play Iso again they technically still have the advantage because they have seen and discussed 30k extra hands that they didnt play. Because of this I think no money will end up switching hands. I think they will just send Iso a Full Tilt Jersey and make him a silver iron man for the month of December

This goes on at every level. It probably shouldn't be against the TOS, and up until like a year ago maybe, it wasn't. (On FTP)

[MaxStPolish 4]

Townsend wins foot in mouth of the year award with a last second entry.That said Online poker T&C's are a joke anyways. I get they have the impossible task of policing an ever-evolving game, and trying to make conditions that they have no access to the information for. It's just a joke. The first step to this is for them to block all HUD/PT software. Sure, players can still track this information, but at least it prevents the seamless overlay to their gaming tables.This is going to be a never-ending grey area. The more sites allow for non-human conditions to be implemented into the game, the more you are going to have grey area issues.That said I'm sure since the days of sole B&M play, to this current day, people have always talked about a common opponent, and shared information available.

[HighwayStar 8]

This is just an extreme version of something that happens between pretty much anyone who talks privately about poker and as a whole these kind of rules are impossible to enforce fairly.

[keith crime 8]

I think they will just send Iso a Full Tilt Jersey and make him a silver iron man for the month of December

this is pretty genius

[Lrgetrout 1]

A prime example of why you don't make unenforceable rules. (At least if Townsend has kept his mouth shut, it would have been unenforceable.)

[Tehtoe 3]

Isildur isn't getting any money back, FTP already made their decision.

[Biff Goods 0]

I don't see how this is any different from posting hands in a strategy forum and asking for advice.

thisAlso...can't you go to Pokertableratings.com and look up any session anyone played anyway? I watched a session a buddy of mine played the other day cause he was asking me advice.....

[Big Jono 0]

I think this makes the Cardrunners crew look like a bunch of scumbags.Lets looks at the timeline:1. In the days leading up to the match it is now public record that these three shared hand histories 'reports' and info on Isildur2 The day before the Isildur match Hastings publicly drops all his backers in a post on 2+23 Wins 4+mirrion from Isildur4. Day after the win Hastings states in his blog that he didnt have 100% of himself in this match, wont name backers. and that Toensend did 'a lot of the work' regarding the study of Isildur.It doesnt take a rocket scientist to work out that these guys worked together to prepare Hastings for the match, dropped his other backers and gave their own money to back him. Its team play plain and simple.

[Suited_Up 2]

I think this makes the Cardrunners crew look like a bunch of scumbags.Lets looks at the timeline:1. In the days leading up to the match it is now public record that these three shared hand histories 'reports' and info on Isildur2 The day before the Isildur match Hastings publicly drops all his backers in a post on 2+23 Wins 4+mirrion from Isildur4. Day after the win Hastings states in his blog that he didnt have 100% of himself in this match, wont name backers. and that Toensend did 'a lot of the work' regarding the study of Isildur.It doesnt take a rocket scientist to work out that these guys worked together to prepare Hastings for the match, dropped his other backers and gave their own money to back him. Its team play plain and simple.

Sounds like the Corporation vs Andy Beal a bit huh?