bceagles2010 0 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 I would like people's opinions on my play in this hand. Mostly, I am interested in the 6th street call and river bet. Please read my logic at all streets and respond accordingly.Scenario: 7 handed $8/$16 HORSE at Foxwoods. Razz round. Almost every razz hand has been taken down without a showdown. Villain is the tightest/most knowledgeable player at table besides me, and I have shown him the best hand many times throughout the night, never calling or betting with the worst of it to a showdown.3rd street: Bring in comes with a Jack, P1 calls with 6, Villain calls with 2, P3 calls with 5, I complete to 8 with 7 showing 65 in the hole. The general play all night for everyone except myself and Villian has been to raise any 8 or better 3rd street hand, thus I assume I am ahead with the 7 and complete. I get 4 callers.4th street: Villain gets an 8 and bets out. Everyone else gets high cards and fold. I have J for 765J and call his 28 board. THE REASON I CALL HERE is because I am almost 100% sure the Villain paired his 8. He would have completed preflop with anything else, and I feel he is just trying to take down the pot with everyone else receiving high cards. 5th street: Villain gets 7 for 287. I get 9 for [56]7J9. Villain bets, I call. Again, I assume he has paired his 8.6th street: Villain gets 9 for 2879. I get 10 for [56]7J910. Villain bets, I call. Here, I know that I'm beat but also know I have plenty of outs. I am putting him on a 98...7th street: Villian checks, I bet with a 10 on the river. Villain thinks for about 5 minutes, talking about how he knows I must have him beat, as all the other players at the table laugh at my bet with my board. Villain eventually calls. He shows [AA8]2879I want to know if this bet on the river was a good one. I am assuming that he paired on the river when he checked, and know that he is playing a 98... I know that he thinks I am a very tight player that only bets the goods. The pot was a decent size and I felt the shot at the river was worth it.Please discuss 6th and 7th play.. Link to post Share on other sites
king_tanner 84 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 DANIEL! ANSWER HIM!I don't think you are going to make a lot of money making hero calls with high cards in Razz. I think you got lucky this one time which is why you are posting. If you are 100% he paired on 4th then you should raise. On 5th if you are still sure you are ahead then raise again. At some point in this hand you need to see where your at. Calling people all the way down in razz with high cards usually doesn't end up well. Also you are running the risk of having him catch a hand when he started out with junk. If he is still there in 6th you need to fold. The way you played it just calling, I'm definitely folding here.Also if you have him pegged for being tight why are you calling him all the way to 7th? Just gut feeling or did you have some other read? Link to post Share on other sites
blakheart 3 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 3rd street: Bring in comes with a Jack, P1 calls with 6, Villain calls with 2, P3 calls with 5, I complete to 8 with 7 showing 65 in the hole. The general play all night for everyone except myself and Villian has been to raise any 8 or better 3rd street hand, thus I assume I am ahead with the 7 and complete. I get 4 callers.I think this is fine- aggressive play is ok. Your hand is certainly worthy of completing.4th street: Villain gets an 8 and bets out. Everyone else gets high cards and fold. I have J for 765J and call his 28 board. THE REASON I CALL HERE is because I am almost 100% sure the Villain paired his 8. He would have completed preflop with anything else, and I feel he is just trying to take down the pot with everyone else receiving high cards. I like the call- but I do not think you can narrow villian down to exactly a paired 8. However you are at worse one card behind on 4th, and possibly ahead. It is worth seeing 5th5th street: Villain gets 7 for 287. I get 9 for [56]7J9. Villain bets, I call. Again, I assume he has paired his 8.Bad call-too much expectation that he has paired. He could be way ahead- and if not he has odds to outdraw you6th street: Villain gets 9 for 2879. I get 10 for [56]7J910. Villain bets, I call. Here, I know that I'm beat but also know I have plenty of outs. I am putting him on a 98...Terrible call. you will be forced to put in another bet on 7th, and he might have you crushed.7th street: Villian checks, I bet with a 10 on the river. Villain thinks for about 5 minutes, talking about how he knows I must have him beat, as all the other players at the table laugh at my bet with my board. Villain eventually calls. He shows [AA8]2879It is only one bet to call- if villian is really as solid as you say he can not fold here.I want to know if this bet on the river was a good one. I am assuming that he paired on the river when he checked, and know that he is playing a 98... I know that he thinks I am a very tight player that only bets the goods. The pot was a decent size and I felt the shot at the river was worth it.Please discuss 6th and 7th play.. Link to post Share on other sites
bceagles2010 0 Posted November 3, 2009 Author Share Posted November 3, 2009 DANIEL! ANSWER HIM!I don't think you are going to make a lot of money making hero calls with high cards in Razz. I think you got lucky this one time which is why you are posting. If you are 100% he paired on 4th then you should raise. On 5th if you are still sure you are ahead then raise again. At some point in this hand you need to see where your at. Calling people all the way down in razz with high cards usually doesn't end up well. Also you are running the risk of having him catch a hand when he started out with junk. If he is still there in 6th you need to fold. The way you played it just calling, I'm definitely folding here.Also if you have him pegged for being tight why are you calling him all the way to 7th? Just gut feeling or did you have some other read?Good point about the raises, I should have raised on 4th and 5th. I had him 90% on pairing the 8 and pairing the river, which is why i bet. Link to post Share on other sites
Ko8e34 0 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 raise 3rd call 4th fold 5, 6, 7 Link to post Share on other sites
Vtlaxer09 4 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 matt ryan can suck my balls. Link to post Share on other sites
KingJames 11 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 raise 3rd call 4th fold 5, 6, 7THISmatt ryan can suck my balls.Excellent point Link to post Share on other sites
MaxStPolish 4 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 This is too read specific to give any sort of advice other than fold this thing on 5th street onward.That said even with your "read" he's still drawing to an 87 low. You are still DRAWING to a 97 low. Even if he's giving you credit for A2 buried, there's only so much story you can make up in razz.As far as how things were played, at 7th street, I feel like it's tossing money into the shredder as villain knows, even with his relative bricks on board that he was ahead of you going into the river. Pretty sure most the time a check here indicates "MF razz, how can i brick so many times....but based on this board I'm showing down here"....in a pot control 7th street, as villain knows you'd only call 7th if you improved anyways.Essentially, IMO, you get credit on 4th street for making the right read and going with it....but on 5th street onward, you are so blinded by this read that you are calling behind street after street, and then just refusing to give up on the river. Link to post Share on other sites
cdipierr 0 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 raise 3rd call 4th fold 5, 6, 7This, 100 times this, especially fold on 5th. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 matt damon can suck my balls. Link to post Share on other sites
lurbz 2 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 chief hawk can suck my balls. Link to post Share on other sites
Ko8e34 0 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Also, why are you betting 7th? What are you trying to get value from? The only time you should be betting there is if you make better than his 98 low. Link to post Share on other sites
MaxStPolish 4 Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Also, why are you betting 7th? What are you trying to get value from? The only time you should be betting there is if you make better than his 98 low.His 7th street bet was a bluff i think.... Link to post Share on other sites
bceagles2010 0 Posted November 4, 2009 Author Share Posted November 4, 2009 Also, why are you betting 7th? What are you trying to get value from? The only time you should be betting there is if you make better than his 98 low. His 7th street bet was a bluff i think....Only betting 7th because he showed weakness and I want to take the pot down with a bluff. Link to post Share on other sites
blakheart 3 Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 Only betting 7th because he showed weakness and I want to take the pot down with a bluff.If you forget about the antes the villian needed to call 1 big bet to win 12? Did I count that correctly? He has too call unless you have him board locked.He only has to be lucky or right once every 10 times to make the call profitable. You say he is a good player. No good player can fold to one bet against your board. Link to post Share on other sites
KingJames 11 Posted November 4, 2009 Share Posted November 4, 2009 If you forget about the antes the villian needed to call 1 big bet to win 12? Did I count that correctly? He has too call unless you have him board locked.He only has to be lucky or right once every 10 times to make the call profitable. You say he is a good player. No good player can fold to one bet against your board.Bink... Link to post Share on other sites
Viper_13 0 Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 Sucks to BU there. Link to post Share on other sites
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