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Ak Suited Vs Unknown Aggressor


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PokerStars Game #30329292755: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2009/07/11 2:56:27 ETTable 'Alkaid IX' 9-max Seat #5 is the buttonSeat 4: Nashtak ($4.84 in chips) Seat 5: TTBS ($4.37 in chips) Seat 6: rebecca85 ($1.92 in chips) Seat 7: Koreanlover ($2.43 in chips) Seat 8: The PU ($6.32 in chips) Seat 9: wilsy1 ($2.32 in chips) rebecca85: posts small blind $0.01Koreanlover: posts big blind $0.02*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to Nashtak [Kc Ac]The PU: calls $0.02wilsy1: calls $0.02Nashtak: raises $0.10 to $0.12TTBS: raises $0.26 to $0.38rebecca85: folds Koreanlover: folds The PU: foldswilsy1: folds Nashtak: calls $0.26*** FLOP *** [2c Tc 8s]Nashtak: checks TTBS: bet $0.68Nashtak: ?-----------------I'm not sure what i do here. It seems obvious villain has a really strong hand. I don't have anything on him, he had just joined the table. Calling seems weak. If i don't hit my flush on the turn, he will surely bet at it again and i won't have the pot odds nor the implied odds to see the river. But would it still be half-decent if i can get him to commit all of his chips if i hit?Check-raising seems like viable option but it would probably commit me to the pot and do i want to stick in a pot i'm only second best? Should i even call preflop if i am not ready to go all the way on this flop?Should i simply fold and limit my loss? I'm not comfortable playing a big pot even if i hit a ace or a king. I also have no reads on villain.

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I'm not sure what i do here. It seems obvious villain has a really strong hand. I don't have anything on him, he had just joined the table. Calling seems weak. If i don't hit my flush on the turn, he will surely bet at it again and i won't have the pot odds nor the implied odds to see the river. But would it still be half-decent if i can get him to commit all of his chips if i hit?Check-raising seems like viable option but it would probably commit me to the pot and do i want to stick in a pot i'm only second best? Should i even call preflop if i am not ready to go all the way on this flop?Should i simply fold and limit my loss? I'm not comfortable playing a big pot even if i hit a ace or a king. I also have no reads on villain.You do know what to do here you just don't want to do it. With where you are at I would release it, you have a little more information on the villian now, and you are not going to be able to recover your buy-in from him if you call and he has the set of Ts. Things you could do differently if you are going to release these types of hands are not raise pre-flop early in a session while you are gathering informaion (learn to live with the fact that poker is a game of patience and until you have a feel for the table you just assume everyone is Doyle Brunson and give them the respect their bets deserve) or buyin for the minimum while you are getting a feel for the table. If you only had .80 in front of you with 4 more buyin's back, this is an easy call/shove. You are getting pretty fair odds on anything, but a pair of Ks or better and his range on that play is much wider than that if he is playing .01 .02. but beyond odds the price for calling relative to your bankroll and the amount you can take from this table is make more sense with a smaller stake as you are getting to know who the fish are.

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I'm raising to at least $2 and calling it off. We have a ton of equity against anything that gets it in with us and we have a bunch of fold equity. Folding here is pretty bad.

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If you are going to play deepstack NL you need to be able to lay some hands down. Sure if you are 50-100bb you should be willing to get it all in here, but if you have no reads, the better move is to gather information and look for a spot when you are sure you have the best of it. Our Hero has over 200BBs you don't want to stack that off in your first orbit just because you have a reasonable draw. Sure the villiam may be overplaying his hand, but do you still need help to beat 33. Yeah you are a slight favorite to any hand, but why risk getting all in the middle on this hand? Wait for him to make a move when your 78s hits 77A, then push back and get ready to stack YOUR chips.

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Folding here would be lol bad.This deep, calling on the flop is perfectly fine. Raising and calling a shove is fine too (players at this level will get it in with a wide range). I think calling is the best play.As long as you don't fold, you should be ok.

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folding here is terrible......folding here is so bad that i cant even explain how bad it is.......doesnt matter what you think the other player has folding is just so wrong in this situation........c/r the flop and if he wants to get it in on the flop then do it......calling is ok but i wanna see both of the next cards with this hand and i think calling doesnt give us that chance enough

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this is why i dont like the .01/.02 tables cause this is all i find they do is just raise . but i am not sure what to do here

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I'm raising to at least $2 and calling it off. We have a ton of equity against anything that gets it in with us and we have a bunch of fold equity. Folding here is pretty bad.
Yep.......
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Yeah i see what you are all getting at. Aces or Tens are the only hands i really don't want to get involved against. But still i'm not too confident about putting my stack at risk on this.Here i am facing someone i have no reads on (he is new to the table, not me BTW) but we are playing the microest of tables. What does that mean?1. We are deep stacked like mad. If i had like 30bb, the shove would be easy but since i'm not a favourite to win this (well probably not), should i risk 300bb on this? I could fold and lose like $0,36 or go all the way with this and risk like $4 in a pot i'm no favourites.2. My fold equity is most likely terrible if we assume that villain is your typical 2nl player. If they show interest in the hand, they are most likely going all the way.3. 2nl players are usually really passive. Almost everytime someone re-raised proflop and the players commited on the flop, one of them had aces.4. If i actually have a pretty decent fold equity; enough to make me a favourite. Do i want to get involved anyway? Those stakes are soft and full of fishes. Wouldn't it be more viable to wait for a better opportunity to stack off?BTW i actually called the flop but folded to $2 bet on the turn [6d]. I find this was probably the worst i could play it(?).

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This is exactly the flop you want. If you are really going to narrow his range to only AA (and I don't see how you could do this) then how you do play it if the A hits the flop? Why call preflop then? You don't even need much fold equity to be ahead on that board. The only hand you're really behind is AA so if his 3-bet range is any wider than AA you have enough raw equity to get it all in on this flop. I don't have pokerstove handy but I'm pretty sure any reasonable range we ascribe to villain here is going to give you the advantage.

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both of you started with 200+ bb each 4-bet Ak suited preflop is my idea you are plenty deep enough to make a big pot preflop and you are OOP so now the flop play is hard. As for the flop, the only things we are screwed by is AK, AA, KK, and 10's at .01-.02 bet 2/3 the pot (maybe more) and be willing to push. He could have a high pocket pair or AK, AQ at this limit it is hard to play an unknown because you don't know how silly they may be to this board with just an over pair like JJ so push hard like earlier post said you have a ton of folding equity on this flop. A raise is probably not going to happen because the hands that are pounding us into the ground are just flatting because they have nothing to protect against. If turn peels another broadway card the numbers start to look bad for us unless you hit an A or a K. hard spot to be in against unknowns hope they simply fold out flop and you don't have to worry.

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Yeah i see what you are all getting at. Aces or Tens are the only hands i really don't want to get involved against. But still i'm not too confident about putting my stack at risk on this.Here i am facing someone i have no reads on (he is new to the table, not me BTW) but we are playing the microest of tables. What does that mean?1. We are deep stacked like mad. If i had like 30bb, the shove would be easy but since i'm not a favourite to win this (well probably not), should i risk 300bb on this? I could fold and lose like $0,36 or go all the way with this and risk like $4 in a pot i'm no favourites.2. My fold equity is most likely terrible if we assume that villain is your typical 2nl player. If they show interest in the hand, they are most likely going all the way.3. 2nl players are usually really passive. Almost everytime someone re-raised proflop and the players commited on the flop, one of them had aces.4. If i actually have a pretty decent fold equity; enough to make me a favourite. Do i want to get involved anyway? Those stakes are soft and full of fishes. Wouldn't it be more viable to wait for a better opportunity to stack off?BTW i actually called the flop but folded to $2 bet on the turn [6d]. I find this was probably the worst i could play it(?).
part 2 i disagree with and part 3 is semi true but as i said an unknown .01-.02 fish is probably overplaying a lot of hands, JJ,99,QQ into this pot and we have at worst 6 outs, but also he could be a total fish and have 3-bet AJ or 88. As is said before i like a 4-bet preflop but regardless betting here should show a positive EV because he could be a total station and pay us off when we hit our top pair.
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this is why i like the .01/.02 tables cause this is all i find they do is just raise with a wide range. but i am sure what to do here
fyp
both of you started with 200+ bb each 4-bet Ak suited preflop is my idea you are plenty deep enough to make a big pot preflop
The deeper you are the less likely you should be to 4bet this hand.
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I'm not one to disagree....(which is funny because I AM one to disagree...) but considering the stakes, I really don't think the conventional thought process can be put into this.Considering the stakes 99,JJ,QQ all wouldn't surprise me..neither would a flush draw...neither would a flat out bluff..If he has any of the pocket pairs, he will probably call anything. Assuming you didn't hit the board and even if you did he has a pair over any you could have made.Personally, I would raise and see if he calls, (which he probably will). More than likely you are going to win the pot with any Ace, King, or Club.Asssuming he has a pair... equity win tie pots won pots tied Hand 0: 54.444% 54.44% 00.00% 539 0.00 { AcKc }Hand 1: 45.556% 45.56% 00.00% 451 0.00 { JdJh }You are still the favorite to win the handAssuming he has the flush drawYou are still the favorite to win the handAssuming he has A QYou are still the favorite to win the handonly situation that REALLY puts you in trouble is if he flopped a set (unlikely considering the pre-flop raise.) Which would put you at 25% to win.Even if he has KK equity win tie pots won pots tied Hand 0: 46.970% 46.97% 00.00% 465 0.00 { AcKc }Hand 1: 53.030% 53.03% 00.00% 525 0.00 { KdKh }Not TOO bad of a flip.Really no reason to fold this IMO. Perhaps my logic is horrendously flawed though. Just my 2 cents.

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I'm not one to disagree....(which is funny because I AM one to disagree...) but considering the stakes, I really don't think the conventional thought process can be put into this.Considering the stakes 99,JJ,QQ all wouldn't surprise me..neither would a flush draw...neither would a flat out bluff..If he has any of the pocket pairs, he will probably call anything. Assuming you didn't hit the board and even if you did he has a pair over any you could have made.Personally, I would raise and see if he calls, (which he probably will). More than likely you are going to win the pot with any Ace, King, or Club.Asssuming he has a pair... equity win tie pots won pots tied Hand 0: 54.444% 54.44% 00.00% 539 0.00 { AcKc }Hand 1: 45.556% 45.56% 00.00% 451 0.00 { JdJh }You are still the favorite to win the handAssuming he has the flush drawYou are still the favorite to win the handAssuming he has A QYou are still the favorite to win the handonly situation that REALLY puts you in trouble is if he flopped a set (unlikely considering the pre-flop raise.) Which would put you at 25% to win.Even if he has KK equity win tie pots won pots tied Hand 0: 46.970% 46.97% 00.00% 465 0.00 { AcKc }Hand 1: 53.030% 53.03% 00.00% 525 0.00 { KdKh }Not TOO bad of a flip.Really no reason to fold this IMO. Perhaps my logic is horrendously flawed though. Just my 2 cents.
you said everything and i think he's on JJ or QQ (aces or kings is less likely(but not impossible) since hero have one of each)
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Im not the best deep stack play in the world but my understanding was the deeper you are the more you wanna 4-bet due to your ability to fold out plenty if the hand goes south. Why would you wanna be shorter here to 4-bet?

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Im not the best deep stack play in the world but my understanding was the deeper you are the more you wanna 4-bet due to your ability to fold out plenty if the hand goes south. Why would you wanna be shorter here to 4-bet?
I don't know. I thought the deeper you were, the better your hand needed to be to commit. I should be happy to shove here if i had $2, but $4 made me reluctant.
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Fish might be stacking off AQ for 100bbs, but for 200bbs even fish get cold feet.
This is an argument for 4 bet bluffing more when 200bbs deep.
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Fish might be stacking off AQ for 100bbs, but for 200bbs even fish get cold feet.
Do they even count their BBs anyway? Most of them would just look at their stack and see a little $3 to gamble IMO.
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