Yahkin 0 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 About 900 left. Average stack is just under 100k. I've been getting 1 steal per orbit and have maintained my chips for the last 3 orbits. Payouts don't start increasing until 270, so nowhere near a money bubble.About 99% sure MP2 has a mid pocket in this spot. She has only played pockets since the bubble 1.5 hours ago...shoves mids and 3bets Top 3.CO's range is a lot wider, he's been all over the place shoving random suited cards and any K / A. He had just reraised into QQ the hand previous with J9 and 2pr'd up.PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10+$1 Tournament, 2500/5000 Blinds 500 Ante (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comCO (t103903)Button (t68500)Hero (SB) (t65090)BB (t45898)UTG (t44842)UTG+1 (t169329)MP1 (t198039)MP2 (t69376)MP3 (t263438)Hero's M: 5.42Preflop: Hero is SB with Q, A3 folds, MP2 bets t68876 (All-In), 1 fold, CO calls t68876, 1 fold, Hero ???Seems straight forward, but I don't play that many MTT's yet, so I'd love to hear the thought process of the pros. Link to post Share on other sites
mk 11 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 ppl who refer to pairs as "pockets" make us lol Link to post Share on other sites
DonkSlayer 1 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 I snap. Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Fold. If your read is right, you're flipping against MP2 (which is fine) but you have CO in the hand who could be counterfeiting some of your outs. You're done with the blinds for this round and will be in prime stealing position for the next few hands.Now I'll just wait for VTlaxer to tell me I'm a stupid nit and this is a snapcall. Link to post Share on other sites
SpatsJ 0 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 i agree this is a fold. i hate coin flips at this level. Link to post Share on other sites
outsider13 0 Posted March 16, 2009 Share Posted March 16, 2009 Fold. If your read is right, you're flipping against MP2 (which is fine) but you have CO in the hand who could be counterfeiting some of your outs. You're done with the blinds for this round and will be in prime stealing position for the next few hands.Now I'll just wait for VTlaxer to tell me I'm a stupid nit and this is a snapcall.I agree. Link to post Share on other sites
Shark527 0 Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 I don't think you HAVE to call here. You get button next hand and there are only 3 stacks with over 20 BB's at your table. I think you could start pushing in position and start chipping up from smaller stacks probably unwilling to gamble.I can also see a call here too since your still 600 places from the next money jump. Link to post Share on other sites
MovingIn 0 Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 Fold. If your read is right, you're flipping against MP2 (which is fine) but you have CO in the hand who could be counterfeiting some of your outs. You're done with the blinds for this round and will be in prime stealing position for the next few hands.Now I'll just wait for VTlaxer to tell me I'm a stupid nit and this is a snapcall.Not until I post so he can respond 'this is vry flawed'This was an instacall if the CO hadn't called in front of us. Still, as short as we're getting, I think we may have to get it in. A triple up is a distinct possibility and rockets us into serious contention.Key word there is MAY. Some questions: Do we see AK/AA/KK/QQ here often enough not to play? Why would CO just call 60% of his stack? Pretty weak play to make with any hand that crushes us. Wouldn't he want the initial shover heads up either way? Wouldn't he just overshove? Is CO leveling us here with a hand that crushes us, hoping he can coax another caller?I don't know, but I know we're short and AQs here with two others may be our best chance to catch a big stack, as our current strategy of stealing only has us treading water. Link to post Share on other sites
Yahkin 0 Posted March 17, 2009 Author Share Posted March 17, 2009 I called and CO woke up with AK. I was right about MP2, she had 99. Flop brought the K and we were both out.I think a hand earlier at this table came into my decision a bit more than it should have. It was a similiar situation, but I had AK. UTG shoved, MP2 called, and MP3 (lagtard) called. I decided to fold convincing myself that one of those two callers had to be sitting on AA or KK. They flipped up 66, AT, KQ. I was really beating myself up about that decision when this hand came up.I'm feeling a little better as responses seem to indicate a call in this spot isn't horrible. Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 Key word there is MAY. Some questions: Do we see AK/AA/KK/QQ here often enough not to play?I'm not as worried about the big hands as I am about the other hands in his range that take some of our outs away. If we put MP2 on a mid-PP, we need all our outs to be live or else we're not flipping. If CO is holding any hand with an Ace or Queen, we lose an out (more if he's holding AQ, or an A/Q with a club). We're not worried about beating CO here, we're worried about having live outs to beat MP2 (assuming our read on her is accurate).The other possibility is that our read on her is wrong and she's on something like AJ but CO calls along with 99/TT and now MP2 has outs we need to beat CO. Either way the presence of both makes this a bad spot for Hero. Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted March 17, 2009 Share Posted March 17, 2009 I think a hand earlier at this table came into my decision a bit more than it should have. It was a similiar situation, but I had AK. UTG shoved, MP2 called, and MP3 (lagtard) called. I decided to fold convincing myself that one of those two callers had to be sitting on AA or KK. They flipped up 66, AT, KQ. I was really beating myself up about that decision when this hand came up.Again, you don't have to be worried about AA/KK there. If you had called in that spot, the three of you would be counterfeiting each other against the 66. In a spot like that there is a good chance someone has a mid-high PP and callers have outs you need. Link to post Share on other sites
BeaverStyle 1 Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 VTLAX WHY HASN'T YOU RESPOND SOON?!I prolly call here cuz the 200k is an loldonkament and tripling up here is grrrrrrrrrrrrrrreat. Since the pay-outs are so top-heavy, I'm playing to go deep here. Folding isn't bad though, imo. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Fold like a bitch. Link to post Share on other sites
SuperJon 175 Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Not until I post so he can respond 'this is vry flawed'This was an instacall if the CO hadn't called in front of us. Still, as short as we're getting, I think we may have to get it in. A triple up is a distinct possibility and rockets us into serious contention.Key word there is MAY. Some questions: Do we see AK/AA/KK/QQ here often enough not to play? Why would CO just call 60% of his stack? Pretty weak play to make with any hand that crushes us. Wouldn't he want the initial shover heads up either way? Wouldn't he just overshove? Is CO leveling us here with a hand that crushes us, hoping he can coax another caller?I don't know, but I know we're short and AQs here with two others may be our best chance to catch a big stack, as our current strategy of stealing only has us treading water.I see this play a lot, and most of the time it's with a strong hand. Link to post Share on other sites
no not baxter 0 Posted April 7, 2009 Share Posted April 7, 2009 fold...13.5bbs is pretty deep for micro players and def are not shoving optimally, and if he is shoving optimally co def isnt calling optimally...id be very suprised if the CO got it in light enough t get in AQ here Link to post Share on other sites
fjl2nd 0 Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 I would fold. I wouldn't want a coin flip against one player, let alone two. Find a better spot where you can shove yourself. Link to post Share on other sites
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