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4/8 Live Hand At The Bike


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Want to post this hand from the other player's perspective and see what your thoughts on his line are, I thought it was interesting. I am in SB, have a huge stack in front and have only showndown top pair, good kicker or better hands. Not sure if CO realizes this though, doesn't seem to be paying much attention.Preflop:Dealt to CO (9c 9h)Action: EP 1 thru CO+1 all fold, CO raises, Button folds, SB calls, BB foldsFlop: 10s 9s 2dAction: SB Checks, CO bets, SB CallsTurn: KcAction: SB Checks, CO bets, SB raises, CO callsRiver: 7hAction: SB Bets, CO Raises, SB reraises, CO callsThoughts on the line?

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why is the CO raising on the river and not on the turn unless he was afraid of the spade draw?
this kind of goes along with what i was saying. ive seen people do some dastardly weird things with sets in live lhe. its like they get this combination of fear and excitement and they can't figure how to balance the two out.
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What % of spade draws are raising that turn? In my live low limit experience I'd say not many. Could be a good play against a tight passive habitual c-bettor, but not too profitable otherwise. I could be wrong, I'm just trying to learn here.What range do you put SB on? Is a 3-bet turn simply to punish draws, or strictly value. Would you 3-bet the same board if it was rainbow?

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What % of spade draws are raising that turn? In my live low limit experience I'd say not many. Could be a good play against a tight passive habitual c-bettor, but not too profitable otherwise. I could be wrong, I'm just trying to learn here.What range do you put SB on? Is a 3-bet turn simply to punish draws, or strictly value. Would you 3-bet the same board if it was rainbow?
strictly value. i dont expect a draw to ever do that live oop.
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I think I'm with Anti...I think CO should be 3-betting the turn. That said, if I'm him I'm probably shutting down on the river if the turn is capped. I hate the way he played his hand on both the turn and the river. Too passive on the turn, too aggro on the river. I guess you had something like QJ or KT?

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I think I'm with Anti...I think CO should be 3-betting the turn. That said, if I'm him I'm probably shutting down on the river if the turn is capped. I hate the way he played his hand on both the turn and the river. Too passive on the turn, too aggro on the river. I guess you had something like QJ or KT?
Yes QJs.My thoughts were in line with you guys, though he ends up losing the same no matter what. He 3-bets turn I c/r river, though I suppose he could lose 4 bets on turn? Doubtful. Also, calling QJs OOP in SB against loose CO raise? Too light?
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Yes QJs.My thoughts were in line with you guys, though he ends up losing the same no matter what. He 3-bets turn I c/r river, though I suppose he could lose 4 bets on turn? Doubtful. Also, calling QJs OOP in SB against loose CO raise? Too light?
This is pretty player dependent IMO. 3-betting has it's merits b/c it shuts out the BB (most of the time) and gets you HU against a player that could be coming in light trying to steal the blinds. However, this is a live 4/8 game so the majority of villains at this level have a better hand than you, and you're OOP. Absent a read that makes me think I can win the pot UI (most of the time this would be by avoiding a showdown), I think I'm either calling or folding. If the villain is really tight/passive I'd probably reluctantly fold because his range looks something like TT+, AK and maybe AQ or AJ; QJs doesn't play well against that range. If we give him a wider range like 77+, JTs, QTs+, KTs+ and A8+ (which I think is probably fairly standard, but maybe a bit wide at this level), I think we can safely call and see a flop. I've played a lot of live low limit LHE and the table folding around to the CO is pretty rare, but it's still going to be different from online where an average villain will raise the CO here with a very wide range, the vast majority of players in a live 4/8 game are going to want to have a decent hand to make this raise.*edit* one more quick thing. FWIW, if your hand was QsJs and not some other QJs, you should be check/raising this flop all day long (or at least trying to get more money in somehow) you have huge pot equity on the flop with QsJs.
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