mr_english 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Guess Harrahs has figured out what most of us dont do (at least regulary) make money.http://my.pokernews.com/LoneRhino/this-jus...lace-at-wso.htm Link to post Share on other sites
aucu 3 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 StandardThere is nothing wrong with making a buck, they are not hurting the game. Link to post Share on other sites
NoSup4U 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 StandardThere is nothing wrong with making a buck, they are not hurting the game.Well, I dunno about that I'm not sure what the price should be that they should take out, but I know if I was a tourney player I'd be crying because it seems like its getting more and more ridic between taxes and the money pulled from the prize pool and the skill level of the players, to make a buck anymore.Mark Link to post Share on other sites
aucu 3 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Well, I dunno about that I'm not sure what the price should be that they should take out, but I know if I was a tourney player I'd be crying because it seems like its getting more and more ridic between taxes and the money pulled from the prize pool and the skill level of the players, to make a buck anymore.MarkOK but we could go back to the way it was pre-Moneymaker where most casinos calculated that closing the pokerrooms and putting in more slots was the way to go, and they were right the slots pull in more $ per square foot that any poker room even if it's full a most of the time. Tournaments are worse yet.If you add up the sponsorship deals that the november 9 got it should pass the vig, easy.The thing that would make a real difference is the $s coming out of the beer companies and such that goes only to the house and/or ESPN Link to post Share on other sites
Whatever 1 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Yea isn't the money that Harrah's gets from ESPN and the beer companies public info? That's the big bucks - not to mention all of the WSOP licensed stuff they sell. Link to post Share on other sites
Jeepster80125 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Just watch. Casinos and Vegas companies will be beneficiaries of the bail-out. Just one more reason people will rail against online poker. Obama has lots of debts to repay. Link to post Share on other sites
psujohn 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Yea isn't the money that Harrah's gets from ESPN and the beer companies public info? That's the big bucks - not to mention all of the WSOP licensed stuff they sell.I doubt Harrah's gets much if anything from ESPN. Networks just don't pay big bucks for poker programs and it's really vital to Harrahs that it gets TV coverage. Link to post Share on other sites
Sparkywins 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 This is just capitalism at it's finest. No one can say how much they deserve to make, that's for supply and demand to decide. If people get fed up with it, then they have the choice not to buy in. If the number of participants decreases, then the income will decrease, as well as the sponsorship. Maybe then they'll lower the entry fee. But for now it looks like a great business and they have no reason to lower the entry fee.One more thing, if i did the math right, a 585 entry fee for a live 10k buy in tournament is very low already. Link to post Share on other sites
NoSup4U 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I doubt Harrah's gets much if anything from ESPN. Networks just don't pay big bucks for poker programs and it's really vital to Harrahs that it gets TV coverage.They definitely paid something because I know last year they negotiated rights through 2010 for it.Mark Link to post Share on other sites
psujohn 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 They definitely paid something because I know last year they negotiated rights through 2010 for it.MarkWell it's possible to have a deal in place that doesn't require ESPN to pay a dime but yeah I think it's likely that Harrahs gets something out of it. Look at the WPT though. They talked about what they get from the network and it's not even enough to cover the production costs apparently. Now the WSOP deal is a bit different since ESPN both produces and airs the show.But this also brings up the most important part of the equation that everyone seems to miss. Revenue != profit. Sure Harrahs took in better than 3rd place money in revenue but they spent quite a bit more than 10K to put on the tourney. From some of the stuff I've seen Harrahs really makes very little if any profit on the series and views it almost entirely as marketing expense. Link to post Share on other sites
quadaces 0 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 $4.1M is just the rake on the main event too.They made much more than that with all the other tournys Link to post Share on other sites
chgocubs99 0 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 This is just capitalism at it's finest. No one can say how much they deserve to make, that's for supply and demand to decide. If people get fed up with it, then they have the choice not to buy in. If the number of participants decreases, then the income will decrease, as well as the sponsorship. Maybe then they'll lower the entry fee. But for now it looks like a great business and they have no reason to lower the entry fee.I agree with all of this. Link to post Share on other sites
grocery_mony 8 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 This time next year Harrahs will be bankrupt. They are 26 Billion in debt and alot of there assets are vacant lots and rundown apartment buildings close to the strip from when they thought it was a good idea to buy up real estate in Vegas when prices where at there highest. LOL at a bailout for Harrahs. The last thing they are gonna bail out is caino's when there is so many others with there hands out right now. Link to post Share on other sites
godoffrisbee 0 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 If you read the blog, the guy says that Harrah's "has profits of $3-4B per quarter, and most of this is apparently WSOP related in nature." Uh, yeah right. I'd be mega-surprised if even 3% of Harrah's profits were WSOP-derived. This is just a person that hates rake, but I'm sure wouldn't mind if he held a home game then raked it. Link to post Share on other sites
Fluffdog87 2 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 http://www.bluffmagazine.com/poker-news/Ra...r-2007-1658.htmMore people watching poker is definately a good thing! Ratings Are In: WSOP Ratings Up Huge Over 2007The November Nine experiment appears to have worked some magic on the television ratings. After seeing a down year in 2007 it appears that the decision to delay the World Series of Poker final table has paid dividends with increased viewership.ESPN announced Thursday that the Tuesday night broadcast earned a 1.9 rating which is an increase of 46% over the 2007 final table rating of 1.3. The 1.9 rating indicates that the two-hour broadcast had 1.905 million homes tuned in and 2.364 million viewers in an average minute.The viewers that tuned in were treated to same day coverage of poker biggest event for the first time in poker history. The final episode featured footage shot on November 9, as the final nine players played down to two players, and November 10, as the final two played to a winner. Peter Eastgate outdueled Ivan Demidov to win the $9.1 million first place prize.The entire schedule of 32 shows averaged a 0.9 rating, meaning 919,000 homes and 1.126 million people were tuned in. These numbers represent a 13% and 15% ratings increase respectively. Link to post Share on other sites
Governator 54 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 Lets do some basic math here.Harrahs got about $4.1 million from a $64.3 million prize pool. Rake is approx 6.5%.Last weekends Sunday Million: $1.542 million in prize money, $15 rake x 7711 entries = $115,665 in rake. Rake is approx. 7.5%.Keep in mind the live main event runs for a couple of weeks, once a year compared to a day of bandwidth, once every week. The main event also promotes poker through tv coverage, online doesn't. The bottom line is, they deserve $4mil to the company for putting on such a successful event imo. Link to post Share on other sites
Sheiky 0 Posted November 14, 2008 Share Posted November 14, 2008 It's interesting to see precise(ish) numbers on how much harrahs makes, but really the article has no argument. Harrahs are a profit making company, they aren't there to help budding poker pros or degenerate gamblers, as Sparky pointed out they seem to have a pretty tight business model as it is. Link to post Share on other sites
MJINK3 0 Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 Lets do some basic math here.Harrahs got about $4.1 million from a $64.3 million prize pool. Rake is approx 6.5%.Last weekends Sunday Million: $1.542 million in prize money, $15 rake x 7711 entries = $115,665 in rake. Rake is approx. 7.5%.Keep in mind the live main event runs for a couple of weeks, once a year compared to a day of bandwidth, once every week. The main event also promotes poker through tv coverage, online doesn't. The bottom line is, they deserve $4mil to the company for putting on such a successful event imo.Agreed Link to post Share on other sites
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