Loose Passive Players. How Do You Play Them?

[TheRegime 0]

By loose passive I mean they limp preflop, call any raise with pretty much any 2 cards. Call with any draw, any pair or anything on the flop. Gutshots or runner runners they dont care.My style is pretty aggressive and this doesnt work at all against them. Because you raise preflop with a wider range of hands. But when a flop misses and you C-bet they call. They keep calling to the river and will call a bluff with a pair of 4s or something.If I play tight the blinds eat up my stack because only like 1/10th of the time do you get a good hand when playing tight. What do I do if I miss the flop and they keep calling big bets? What if I miss the turn after a C bet do I fire again into them?Reason I bring this up is because tonight I got taken out 3rd when I had a huge chip lead 3 handed.Chips roughlyHero 8000Villain 1 - good solid player 2500Villain 2 - loose passive player, calling station 3500Blinds 50/100 so pretty deep.I play my normal aggressive 3 handed strat. Raising like 3 or 4xBB preflop and c betting when missed and betting when hit as well.So I lose a bunch of chips cuz I hit nothing. I switch gears to tighter stance.Chips 5500Villain 1 3000Villain 2 4500I tighten up but the blinds eat my stack away and when I raise with big hands he calls and the flop comes nothing. Or when I hit he calls on a gutshot and hits or hits low 2 pair so I lose a bunch. He just seemed to hit everything. he only really paid me off about 4 times when I had a hand. Bad beat me the other 100 hands.I got frustrated and tried to pull a semi bluff with an open ender. he calls with 23off pair of 2s and rivers trip 2s. Obvs I fire the riv and he calls.So i get low and just get chipped away. 2 times I had both stacks down to 20 or less BB. Villain 1 bad beat villain 2 though at 15BB to stay in the game.Blinds finnally went up to 100/200 but I only had 2000 left and was in push mode. Got blinded down to 1000 and big stack loose passive calls my Ak all in with 54. And 54 busts me. board came 356Q3Can someone please tell me how to play against these players. I can get a big stack but always get beat by them 3 handed.

[jmbreslin 0]

I know this is going to sound really obvious but if your laggy raise and CB style isn't working against the opposition, then you need to cut back on it. Start throwing in some PF limps to see some cheap flops. Or try larger PF raises to steal without necessarily committing yourself to a CB. Mix it up. Don't give them what they want, which is to let you keep doing the betting while they call. Pull them out of their comfort zone.

[kkot 0]

Value bet relentlessly and don't bluff.Pretty simple, eh?

[antistuff 0]

you bet when you have the best hand and fold when you don't.

[mtdesmoines 3]

I know this is going to sound really obvious but if your laggy raise and CB style isn't working against the opposition, then you need to cut back on it. Start throwing in some PF limps to see some cheap flops. Or try larger PF raises to steal without necessarily committing yourself to a CB. Mix it up. Don't give them what they want, which is to let you keep doing the betting while they call. Pull them out of their comfort zone.

No limps OOP. You still need to value bet the snot out of them.

Value bet relentlessly and don't bluff.Pretty simple, eh?

this. info on avatar?

you bet when you have the best hand and fold when you don't.

more good advice.

[kkot 0]

info on avatar?

I wish.

[AimHigher 0]

Value bet, value bet, value bet. If they are very floaty postflop value bet them thinner but c-bet less frequently.If they play fit or fold post flop c-bet them more but don't value bet as thinly. Give them respect if they bet in an unusually aggressive way.Keep your bluffing to a minimum.

[SGFULTON83 0]

Value bet made hands and don't bluff calling stations as previously stated. Good Luck

[ThatPkrGuy 0]

You could try C bet the flop and push the turn....should work evertime but the last

[litlebullet 0]

hah calling stations are easy to slice apart when blinds are low like at op's situation but when the blinds get high in sngs that's when they absolutely suck ass imo they really make you tighten up your shove range. You like have no choice but to jam over their limps and pray they can fold or you get lucky against them.

[Pdiddydog 0]

One of the easiest players to exploit in any variation of poker, in fact I find those with only one style easy to exploit. Calling stations are easy to play, you make no big bluffs, continuation bet the flop little to no times, and value bet much lighter. If you are following these guide lines you will win in the long run against calling stations. Looks like you failed to switch gears in time.

[mtdesmoines 3]

One of the easiest players to exploit in any variation of poker, in fact I find those with only one style easy to exploit. Calling stations are easy to play, you make no big bluffs, continuation bet the flop little to no times, and value bet much lighter. If you are following these guide lines you will win in the long run against calling stations. Looks like you failed to switch gears in time.

I look for two types of players as soon as I sit down. Calling stations and people who waaaay overplay their hands.

[antistuff 0]

I look for two types of players as soon as I sit down. Calling stations and people who waaaay overplay their hands.

maybe it depends on the game, but my favorite people to play against are people who make bad folds. these used to be rare, but as online poker has gotten "tougher" they are more common.

[mtdesmoines 3]

maybe it depends on the game, but my favorite people to play against are people who make bad folds. these used to be rare, but as online poker has gotten "tougher" they are more common.

Interesting.When someone SHOWS a fold, I bet ATC into them at every opportunity. They take pride in folds, so let them fold and be proud.

[TrueFX 0]

I too have been analyzing this situation a lot lately. I play cash games so I don't know how relevant what I have to say is to your game.If you have position on the player, tighten up a little and raise your premium hands as usual.Do not C-Bet unless you have a pair! You already know the odds of them calling are huge. And without a pair, you will be put in a tough position on the turn if you fail to pair up.Do not C-Bet without top pair. Again, you do not want to have to make a decision on the turn.The turn is where I often times shut down completely against this type of player. If I raised, and C-Bet with TP TK, I will shut down if the turn brings flush and straight draws. You will never know what the Loose Passive called with. He may have called with middle pair and turned a flush draw. Or he may have called with a flush draw and turned a straight with an Ace. No matter what, you are not getting this player out of the pot with a medium to pot sized bet. I almost always check in this situation to control the pot size and make it easier for me to call down a reasonable river bet.The only time I continuation bet the turn against this player is if I have 2 pair plus a straight / flush draw or better. Too many cards can come on this river making the villains hand. Even if it is only bottom two pair!I have been called and snapped off by this type of player far too many times and realised that I was never getting him off the hand and could have won or lost the minimum had I tightened up a little bit. I know I am cutting myself short on some potential profit when they miss, but the times that they do hit seem to cost me just as much.In short, only C-Bet the flop if you have TOP PAIR. You know full well you are getting called with just about anything, and anything but top pair will have you wondering if you are good or not.Do not bet the turn with less than two pair if the board pairs, there are two flush draws, or if you can spot 2 diferent straight draws. You just don't know what this player is calling you with.And lastly (the lesson that has cost me the most money), do not try to bluff this player. If you do not have a pair on the flop, don't waste your bet. If you still don't have a pair on the turn, don't bother betting at all. Check it down or fold. You will almost never get this type of player out of the hand.

[SCS 0]

I too have been analyzing this situation a lot lately. I play cash games so I don't know how relevant what I have to say is to your game.If you have position on the player, tighten up a little and raise your premium hands as usual.Do not C-Bet unless you have a pair! You already know the odds of them calling are huge. And without a pair, you will be put in a tough position on the turn if you fail to pair up.Do not C-Bet without top pair. Again, you do not want to have to make a decision on the turn.The turn is where I often times shut down completely against this type of player. If I raised, and C-Bet with TP TK, I will shut down if the turn brings flush and straight draws. You will never know what the Loose Passive called with. He may have called with middle pair and turned a flush draw. Or he may have called with a flush draw and turned a straight with an Ace. No matter what, you are not getting this player out of the pot with a medium to pot sized bet. I almost always check in this situation to control the pot size and make it easier for me to call down a reasonable river bet.The only time I continuation bet the turn against this player is if I have 2 pair plus a straight / flush draw or better. Too many cards can come on this river making the villains hand. Even if it is only bottom two pair!I have been called and snapped off by this type of player far too many times and realised that I was never getting him off the hand and could have won or lost the minimum had I tightened up a little bit. I know I am cutting myself short on some potential profit when they miss, but the times that they do hit seem to cost me just as much.In short, only C-Bet the flop if you have TOP PAIR. You know full well you are getting called with just about anything, and anything but top pair will have you wondering if you are good or not.Do not bet the turn with less than two pair if the board pairs, there are two flush draws, or if you can spot 2 diferent straight draws. You just don't know what this player is calling you with.And lastly (the lesson that has cost me the most money), do not try to bluff this player. If you do not have a pair on the flop, don't waste your bet. If you still don't have a pair on the turn, don't bother betting at all. Check it down or fold. You will almost never get this type of player out of the hand.

There is a lot of flawed thinking in this post.For starters, when you have position on someone, you should be loosening your range, not tightening up.Also, you shouldn't not cbet a flop because you don't have a pair. You should be thinking about getting value for your hand. For example, say we have AhKh and the flop comes QhTs3h, we should be betting this every single time. Even if the flop was QsTs3h we should be betting here, because we have a ton of equity against villain's range.Don't automatically shut down against a loose-passive fish on the turn if you have less than TPTK. For example, lets say we have KsQs and the flop comes Kh8s7c. We bet and get called by a loose-passive fish. Turn card is the 3c. We should bet again. The loose-passive fish will call here with worse Ks, like KJ, KT, K9, T9, 65 and a club flush draw. A lot of players will even call down with QQ-99 or even A8 or A7. That is a ton of hands that you are missing value from by checking the turn.Don't worry about betting someone off of a hand. Worry about getting value.

[TrueFX 0]

There is a lot of flawed thinking in this post.For starters, when you have position on someone, you should be loosening your range, not tightening up.Also, you shouldn't not cbet a flop because you don't have a pair. You should be thinking about getting value for your hand. For example, say we have AhKh and the flop comes QhTs3h, we should be betting this every single time. Even if the flop was QsTs3h we should be betting here, because we have a ton of equity against villain's range.Don't automatically shut down against a loose-passive fish on the turn if you have less than TPTK. For example, lets say we have KsQs and the flop comes Kh8s7c. We bet and get called by a loose-passive fish. Turn card is the 3c. We should bet again. The loose-passive fish will call here with worse Ks, like KJ, KT, K9, T9, 65 and a club flush draw. A lot of players will even call down with QQ-99 or even A8 or A7. That is a ton of hands that you are missing value from by checking the turn.Don't worry about betting someone off of a hand. Worry about getting value.

I may have misrepresented my stance somewhat... of course I will be c-betting a flush draw, straight draw, and two overs on the flop. If I don't have as many cards to improve and I KNOW for a fact that my opponent is calling my C-Bet no matter what... where is the value in C-Betting? Ace-High rarely wins and my odds of hitting a pair after the flop have diminished significantly. Betting for value is great when your opponent calls and you suck out. No sense in raising a pot in which there is a high percent chance that you won't improve.As for loosening my range? I disagree. I can't very well C-Bet a player with bottom pair or when 3 overs hit on the flop. Why? Because what do I do on the turn? The loose passive is calling no matter what, and now I have gained no more information on him before the flop and will most likely wind up checking it down on the turn if I don't hit two pair or turn a big draw. Loosen up against the player and raise 10-8o preflop, have the board come 3-10-A... I'm c-betting that and wondering where I am all the way. Far too many unknowns against this player to play weak hands. Remember, I don't play this way vs every player, just the ones that have proven they will limp / call with any 2 pre-flop and call to the river with any pair / draw. Too much money to lose if I myself am playing with any 2 cards as well. And on the flip side, I am betting all the way with my big hands. But how big a hand could I have if I start raising / C-betting with 10-7o ?

[SCS 0]

As for loosening my range? I disagree. I can't very well C-Bet a player with bottom pair or when 3 overs hit on the flop. Why? Because what do I do on the turn? The loose passive is calling no matter what, and now I have gained no more information on him before the flop and will most likely wind up checking it down on the turn if I don't hit two pair or turn a big draw. Loosen up against the player and raise 10-8o preflop, have the board come 3-10-A... I'm c-betting that and wondering where I am all the way. Far too many unknowns against this player to play weak hands.

You loosen your range because villain will call you down with worse hands and you have a positional advantage.

[trystero 0]

Just listen to SCS. When you're in position you're at a license to play more hands because you can control the pot size. When you turn top pair you can bet it. When you river the gutshot you can raise him. When you don't hit anything you can just check behind. Etc etcIn position, you should feel comfortable playing middle pair weak kicker on an ace high board. You're usually ahead, and if you are not then you can get off the hand cheaply. If you do manage to improve your hand you can truly punish villain if he does in fact have top pair.

[BellaireDrew 2]

As for loosening my range? I disagree. I can't very well C-Bet a player with bottom pair or when 3 overs hit on the flop. Why? Because what do I do on the turn? The loose passive is calling no matter what, and now I have gained no more information on him before the flop and will most likely wind up checking it down on the turn if I don't hit two pair or turn a big draw. Loosen up against the player and raise 10-8o preflop, have the board come 3-10-A... I'm c-betting that and wondering where I am all the way. Far too many unknowns against this player to play weak hands.

with T8 on this board against a passive calling station you can bet the flop and turn for value and then check the river behind or if you improve bet the river again.its all about getting in thin value bets against calling stations.

[MovingIn 0]

I look for two types of players as soon as I sit down. Calling stations and people who waaaay overplay their hands.

This. These are the people who pay you off huge when you make big hands.

[kkot 0]

with T8 on this board against a passive calling station you can bet the flop and turn for value and then check the river behind or if you improve bet the river again.its all about getting in thin value bets against calling stations.

Yup. Some people will tell you to wait for a better spot to put bets in, but against this type of player this is your spot. This is exactly how you crush loose/passive calling stations.

[Solar 0]

Anyone else think that raising 3-4 times the BB 3 handed at the end of a tournament? At this stage I usually keep it close to 2.5 or even minraises, depending what the other players are calling.Also you're almost certainly c-betting too much. and not just too much, but the wrong flops. Against this type of player you can't go betting at a flop like KT9 with air, because it hits him in some way about 80% of the time.Also get dealt better cards. The great thing about these opponents is you can smack them around with a few good cards. If you keep picking up crap and/or missing flops theres not a lot you can do.

[MovingIn 0]

Though it's been beaten to death, I'm frankly shocked this is even an issue.- See lots of cheap flops with strong pairs and good drawing hands.- Raise PF rarely. Dump hands on flop unless you spike the nuts or a big draw.- Draw cheaply.- Catch big hand or hit big draw.- Clean people out.Basically, if a table's going to play a NLHE tourney like it's low limit O8, then just play it like you play low limit O8.

[kkot 0]

Though it's been beaten to death, I'm frankly shocked this is even an issue.- See lots of cheap flops with strong pairs and good drawing hands.- Raise PF rarely. Dump hands on flop unless you spike the nuts or a big draw.- Draw cheaply.- Catch big hand or hit big draw.- Clean people out.Basically, if a table's going to play a NLHE tourney like it's low limit O8, then just play it like you play low limit O8.

You want to play weak-tight against the loose passives?