Poppy Hillis 0 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 at the old rake thats less than 1/10th a buyin a game. small sample though and you just ate a 7 game losing streak. when first i saw these i was thinking if i could win $2 on average from the $10s four tabling them and opening one as soon as one closed would probably be around $20ish an hour. im starting to feel a little skeptical. whats does a winning player normally make on average per game playing $10 sngs?4-tabling the $10's I think it would be tough to make any more than $10/hr. That's winning at a 60% rate. I think that's the most realistic mark that's consistently attainable. Meanwhile, I think I'm close to a definite conclusion on the best strategy for these. I can't believe I'm spending so much time playing these. Link to post Share on other sites
BigDMcGee 3,355 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 This is the worst play I've ever seen. The man in the small blind is sitting out, and his stack is being lbinded off. Because of this, I folded AA in the small blind to the button's raise. Then these two idiots keep it real, when we all could have just mucked into the money...PokerStars Game #21043708076: Tournament #113030819, $10.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2008/10/08 23:07:19 ETTable '113030819 1' 10-max Seat #4 is the buttonSeat 3: RFEXP1503 (3995 in chips) Seat 4: BigDMcGee (1285 in chips) Seat 6: sethnis (850 in chips) is sitting outSeat 7: prof808 (3430 in chips) Seat 8: scolyoopitup (2440 in chips) Seat 10: propain12 (3000 in chips) RFEXP1503: posts the ante 15BigDMcGee: posts the ante 15sethnis: posts the ante 15prof808: posts the ante 15scolyoopitup: posts the ante 15propain12: posts the ante 15sethnis: posts small blind 75prof808: posts big blind 150*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to BigDMcGee [Qc 5d]scolyoopitup: raises 300 to 450propain12: folds RFEXP1503: folds BigDMcGee: folds sethnis: folds prof808: raises 2965 to 3415 and is all-inscolyoopitup: calls 1975 and is all-inUncalled bet (990) returned to prof808*** FLOP *** [8h 3d Qd]*** TURN *** [8h 3d Qd] [2c]*** RIVER *** [8h 3d Qd 2c] [8s]*** SHOW DOWN ***prof808: shows [8d 4h] (three of a kind, Eights)scolyoopitup: shows [Jh Jc] (two pair, Jacks and Eights)prof808 collected 5015 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 5015 | Rake 0 Board [8h 3d Qd 2c 8s]Seat 3: RFEXP1503 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 4: BigDMcGee (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 6: sethnis (small blind) folded before FlopSeat 7: prof808 (big blind) showed [8d 4h] and won (5015) with three of a kind, EightsSeat 8: scolyoopitup showed [Jh Jc] and lost with two pair, Jacks and EightsSeat 10: propain12 folded before Flop (didn't bet) Link to post Share on other sites
antistuff 0 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 4-tabling the $10's I think it would be tough to make any more than $10/hr. That's winning at a 60% rate. I think that's the most realistic mark that's consistently attainable. Meanwhile, I think I'm close to a definite conclusion on the best strategy for these. I can't believe I'm spending so much time playing these.how many games do you figure an hour 4 tabling? Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 This is the worst play I've ever seen. The man in the small blind is sitting out, and his stack is being lbinded off. Because of this, I folded AA in the small blind to the button's raise. Then these two idiots keep it real, when we all could have just mucked into the money...PokerStars Game #21043708076: Tournament #113030819, $10.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2008/10/08 23:07:19 ETTable '113030819 1' 10-max Seat #4 is the buttonSeat 3: RFEXP1503 (3995 in chips) Seat 4: BigDMcGee (1285 in chips) Seat 6: sethnis (850 in chips) is sitting outSeat 7: prof808 (3430 in chips) Seat 8: scolyoopitup (2440 in chips) Seat 10: propain12 (3000 in chips) RFEXP1503: posts the ante 15BigDMcGee: posts the ante 15sethnis: posts the ante 15prof808: posts the ante 15scolyoopitup: posts the ante 15propain12: posts the ante 15sethnis: posts small blind 75prof808: posts big blind 150*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to BigDMcGee [Qc 5d]scolyoopitup: raises 300 to 450propain12: folds RFEXP1503: folds BigDMcGee: folds sethnis: folds prof808: raises 2965 to 3415 and is all-inscolyoopitup: calls 1975 and is all-inUncalled bet (990) returned to prof808*** FLOP *** [8h 3d Qd]*** TURN *** [8h 3d Qd] [2c]*** RIVER *** [8h 3d Qd 2c] [8s]*** SHOW DOWN ***prof808: shows [8d 4h] (three of a kind, Eights)scolyoopitup: shows [Jh Jc] (two pair, Jacks and Eights)prof808 collected 5015 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 5015 | Rake 0 Board [8h 3d Qd 2c 8s]Seat 3: RFEXP1503 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 4: BigDMcGee (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 6: sethnis (small blind) folded before FlopSeat 7: prof808 (big blind) showed [8d 4h] and won (5015) with three of a kind, EightsSeat 8: scolyoopitup showed [Jh Jc] and lost with two pair, Jacks and EightsSeat 10: propain12 folded before Flop (didn't bet)My lord there are some really stupid people out there. The guy goes for a push-resteal (of a UTG raise, no less) with 84o on the bubble when the SB is on his way to being blinded out? Unbelievable. Link to post Share on other sites
BigDMcGee 3,355 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 My lord there are some really stupid people out there. The guy goes for a push-resteal (of a UTG raise, no less) with 84o on the bubble when the SB is on his way to being blinded out? Unbelievable.the edge in this game comes the way people put themselves at unnessisary risk. Eventually, the games will tighten up, and will become crap shoots, when the blinds get like 300/600 and higher.. but I've yet to see a tournament get to that level Link to post Share on other sites
Dirtydutch 8 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I want to berate these people so bad, but my edge is so slim and I don't want to do anything to nudge these things into the unbeatable nit-fests they'll soon be regardless. Seven remain, some guy w/ an M of at least 10 just open-limped his SB, I shoved in the BB, he called with Q9. Link to post Share on other sites
Dirtydutch 8 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 the edge in this game comes the way people put themselves at unnessisary risk. Eventually, the games will tighten up, and will become crap shoots, when the blinds get like 300/600 and higher.. but I've yet to see a tournament get to that levelI think I'm playing a level above you, and I'm yet to see 2/4. Link to post Share on other sites
Poppy Hillis 0 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 how many games do you figure an hour 4 tabling?My math was based on 3-tabling, sorry. At 60% you should make atleast $13/hr. I figure 4-tabling you will see roughly 8 games/hr.Edit: 12-2 today. 3-tabled for like 2 hours. Saw somebody 36-tabling. Link to post Share on other sites
Chet Chetterson 0 Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Just played my 2nd 1.10 Double or Nothing and this situation came up. Is my check on the river acceptable given the situation? My read was that I had the best hand, although Villain my play this differently in a normal SnG.PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00+$0.10 Tournament, 50/100 Blinds 10 Ante (7 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comsaw flop | saw showdownMP2 (t1680)CO (t1850)Button (t1170)SB (t2440)Hero (BB) (t3010)UTG (t2830)MP1 (t2020)Preflop: Hero is BB with 9, 101 fold, MP1 calls t100, 3 folds, SB calls t50, Hero checksFlop: (t370) 10, 10, 8(3 players)SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 checksTurn: (t370) K(3 players)SB checks, Hero bets t200, 1 fold, SB calls t200River: (t770) 2(2 players)SB checks, Hero checksTotal pot: t770 Link to post Share on other sites
Stretchy 0 Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 So in general are these profitable if you play them right or are they starting to become crapshoots now that people are starting to figure out how to play them? Good way to built BR? How many is a reasonable amount to mulit-table? Better than regular SnGs to build roll? Link to post Share on other sites
Poppy_Hillis 11 Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 So in general are these profitable if you play them right or are they starting to become crapshoots now that people are starting to figure out how to play them? Good way to built BR? How many is a reasonable amount to mulit-table? Better than regular SnGs to build roll?I think these are extremely profitable, and I'm not sure if they ever won't be because the correct strategy at least from what I've found goes against everything you already know about poker. It just doesn't make sense to people.Earlier I said that 60% is attainable, but now I think that 70% can be consistently attainable. Link to post Share on other sites
Chet Chetterson 0 Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 I think these are extremely profitable, and I'm not sure if they ever won't be because the correct strategy at least from what I've found goes against everything you already know about poker. It just doesn't make sense to people.Earlier I said that 60% is attainable, but now I think that 70% can be consistently attainable.You need about 60% win rate to make a profit, and after play 10-15 of them it seem certainly doable, especially at the lower limits. However you can still hit bad runs because you'll still have late game shove fest a lot of the time Link to post Share on other sites
Poppy_Hillis 11 Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 You need about 60% win rate to make a profit, and after play 10-15 of them it seem certainly doable, especially at the lower limits. However you can still hit bad runs because you'll still have late game shove fest a lot of the time52% is break even, but yea 60% is necessary to make a substantial profit. You really only need to make one shove most of the time when you're in it late w/ 6 or 7 people left. Link to post Share on other sites
antistuff 0 Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 52% is break even, but yea 60% is necessary to make a substantial profit. You really only need to make one shove most of the time when you're in it late w/ 6 or 7 people left. whoa. bing. lightbulbs going off. ty. Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Making it look easy...This one lasted a total of 4 hands.Poker StarsPot Limit Omaha TournamentBlinds: t10/t207 playersConverterPre-flop: (7 players) Hero is Button with UTG calls t20 (pot was t30), UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls t20 (pot was t50), CO calls t20 (pot was t70), Hero calls t20 (pot was t90), SB calls t10 (pot was t110), BB checks.Flop: :D (t120, 6 players)SB checks, BB bets t40, 2 folds, CO calls t40 (pot was t160), Hero calls t40 (pot was t200), SB calls t40 (pot was t240).Turn: (t280, 4 players)SB checks, BB checks, CO bets t100, Hero calls t100 (pot was t380), SB raises to t400, BB calls t400 (pot was t880), CO calls t300 (pot was t1280), Hero calls t300 (pot was t1580).River: (t1880, 4 players)SB is all-in t960, BB calls all-in t900, CO folds, Hero calls t960 (pot was t3740).Results:Final pot: t4700 Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 LOL at this fold...PokerStars Game #21148532728: Tournament #113830864, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2008/10/12 21:37:09 ETTable '113830864 1' 10-max Seat #8 is the buttonSeat 2: HOASTY (2755 in chips) Seat 3: from_fresno (3175 in chips) Seat 4: Bent Nail52 (320 in chips) Seat 5: MacLucky (2323 in chips) Seat 8: jbreslin (2357 in chips) Seat 9: watup745 (4070 in chips) HOASTY: posts the ante 25from_fresno: posts the ante 25Bent Nail52: posts the ante 25MacLucky: posts the ante 25jbreslin: posts the ante 25watup745: posts the ante 25watup745: posts small blind 125HOASTY: posts big blind 250*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to jbreslin [6d 9h]from_fresno: folds Bent Nail52: raises 45 to 295 and is all-inMacLucky: calls 295jbreslin: folds watup745: calls 170HOASTY: folds Pot odds of about, oh, 30:1 and a chance to knockout the shortie to end it. Link to post Share on other sites
wakiki 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 LOL that's fantastic, jm. Link to post Share on other sites
thelivewire 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Yes, it's low limit but you've got to love the way it ended.PokerStars Game #21149981344: Tournament #113840913, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (150/300) - 2008/10/12 22:43:27 ETTable '113840913 1' 10-max Seat #6 is the buttonSeat 1: thelivewire (2700 in chips) Seat 2: Imperialismo (1405 in chips) Seat 4: wbgcampm (6500 in chips) Seat 6: ZZoMa (1355 in chips) Seat 9: mac8deer (2060 in chips) Seat 10: alanchiras (980 in chips) thelivewire: posts the ante 30Imperialismo: posts the ante 30wbgcampm: posts the ante 30ZZoMa: posts the ante 30mac8deer: posts the ante 30alanchiras: posts the ante 30mac8deer: posts small blind 150alanchiras: posts big blind 300*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to thelivewire [Th 9d]thelivewire: folds Imperialismo: folds wbgcampm: folds ZZoMa: folds mac8deer: calls 150alanchiras: raises 650 to 950 and is all-inmac8deer: calls 650*** FLOP *** [Qd Ac Qc]*** TURN *** [Qd Ac Qc] [Kh]*** RIVER *** [Qd Ac Qc Kh] [As]*** SHOW DOWN ***mac8deer: shows [Ah 3d] (a full house, Aces full of Queens)alanchiras: shows [Qh Js] (a full house, Queens full of Aces)mac8deer collected 2080 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 2080 | Rake 0 Board [Qd Ac Qc Kh As]Seat 1: thelivewire folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 2: Imperialismo folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 4: wbgcampm folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 6: ZZoMa (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: mac8deer (small blind) showed [Ah 3d] and won (2080) with a full house, Aces full of QueensSeat 10: alanchiras (big blind) showed [Qh Js] and lost with a full house, Queens full of Aces Link to post Share on other sites
thelivewire 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 and then, what could only be described as the worst bet on the flop ever...down to six..two very short stacks all in and moron bets the flop with NOTHING. I'm almost glad they turn the chat off because I was floored at the bet.PokerStars Game #21150031429: Tournament #113840902, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (150/300) - 2008/10/12 22:45:48 ETTable '113840902 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the buttonSeat 2: thelivewire (1983 in chips) Seat 4: Payme1sucker (2747 in chips) Seat 5: Mav145 (55 in chips) Seat 7: TigreMiky (9880 in chips) Seat 8: Imperialismo (280 in chips) Seat 9: scottwayne (55 in chips) thelivewire: posts the ante 30Payme1sucker: posts the ante 30Mav145: posts the ante 30TigreMiky: posts the ante 30Imperialismo: posts the ante 30scottwayne: posts the ante 30thelivewire: posts small blind 150Payme1sucker: posts big blind 300*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to thelivewire [9d 8s]Mav145: calls 25 and is all-inTigreMiky: folds Imperialismo: folds scottwayne: calls 25 and is all-inthelivewire: calls 150Payme1sucker: checks *** FLOP *** [2h Ad Ac]thelivewire: checks Payme1sucker: bets 600<---------------------------------------- WHAT THE F@$# is that??????????thelivewire: folds Uncalled bet (600) returned to Payme1sucker*** TURN *** [2h Ad Ac] [4d]*** RIVER *** [2h Ad Ac 4d] [8c]*** SHOW DOWN ***Payme1sucker: shows [7d 2s] (two pair, Aces and Deuces)Payme1sucker collected 550 from side potMav145: shows [Qh 7s] (a pair of Aces)scottwayne: shows [Kd Ks] (two pair, Aces and Kings)scottwayne collected 280 from main pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 830 Main pot 280. Side pot 550. | Rake 0 Board [2h Ad Ac 4d 8c]Seat 2: thelivewire (small blind) folded on the FlopSeat 4: Payme1sucker (big blind) showed [7d 2s] and won (550) with two pair, Aces and DeucesSeat 5: Mav145 showed [Qh 7s] and lost with a pair of AcesSeat 7: TigreMiky folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 8: Imperialismo folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: scottwayne (button) showed [Kd Ks] and won (280) with two pair, Aces and Kings Link to post Share on other sites
Chet Chetterson 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 and then, what could only be described as the worst bet on the flop ever...down to six..two very short stacks all in and moron bets the flop with NOTHING. I'm almost glad they turn the chat off because I was floored at the bet.PokerStars Game #21150031429: Tournament #113840902, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (150/300) - 2008/10/12 22:45:48 ETTable '113840902 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the buttonSeat 2: thelivewire (1983 in chips) Seat 4: Payme1sucker (2747 in chips) Seat 5: Mav145 (55 in chips) Seat 7: TigreMiky (9880 in chips) Seat 8: Imperialismo (280 in chips) Seat 9: scottwayne (55 in chips) thelivewire: posts the ante 30Payme1sucker: posts the ante 30Mav145: posts the ante 30TigreMiky: posts the ante 30Imperialismo: posts the ante 30scottwayne: posts the ante 30thelivewire: posts small blind 150Payme1sucker: posts big blind 300*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to thelivewire [9d 8s]Mav145: calls 25 and is all-inTigreMiky: folds Imperialismo: folds scottwayne: calls 25 and is all-inthelivewire: calls 150Payme1sucker: checks *** FLOP *** [2h Ad Ac]thelivewire: checks Payme1sucker: bets 600<---------------------------------------- WHAT THE F@$# is that??????????thelivewire: folds Uncalled bet (600) returned to Payme1sucker*** TURN *** [2h Ad Ac] [4d]*** RIVER *** [2h Ad Ac 4d] [8c]*** SHOW DOWN ***Payme1sucker: shows [7d 2s] (two pair, Aces and Deuces)Payme1sucker collected 550 from side potMav145: shows [Qh 7s] (a pair of Aces)scottwayne: shows [Kd Ks] (two pair, Aces and Kings)scottwayne collected 280 from main pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 830 Main pot 280. Side pot 550. | Rake 0 Board [2h Ad Ac 4d 8c]Seat 2: thelivewire (small blind) folded on the FlopSeat 4: Payme1sucker (big blind) showed [7d 2s] and won (550) with two pair, Aces and DeucesSeat 5: Mav145 showed [Qh 7s] and lost with a pair of AcesSeat 7: TigreMiky folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 8: Imperialismo folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: scottwayne (button) showed [Kd Ks] and won (280) with two pair, Aces and Kings+1 Link to post Share on other sites
Lrgetrout 1 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 and then, what could only be described as the worst bet on the flop ever...down to six..two very short stacks all in and moron bets the flop with NOTHING. I'm almost glad they turn the chat off because I was floored at the bet.PokerStars Game #21150031429: Tournament #113840902, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level VIII (150/300) - 2008/10/12 22:45:48 ETTable '113840902 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the buttonSeat 2: thelivewire (1983 in chips) Seat 4: Payme1sucker (2747 in chips) Seat 5: Mav145 (55 in chips) Seat 7: TigreMiky (9880 in chips) Seat 8: Imperialismo (280 in chips) Seat 9: scottwayne (55 in chips) thelivewire: posts the ante 30Payme1sucker: posts the ante 30Mav145: posts the ante 30TigreMiky: posts the ante 30Imperialismo: posts the ante 30scottwayne: posts the ante 30thelivewire: posts small blind 150Payme1sucker: posts big blind 300*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to thelivewire [9d 8s]Mav145: calls 25 and is all-inTigreMiky: folds Imperialismo: folds scottwayne: calls 25 and is all-inthelivewire: calls 150Payme1sucker: checks *** FLOP *** [2h Ad Ac]thelivewire: checks Payme1sucker: bets 600<---------------------------------------- WHAT THE F@$# is that??????????thelivewire: folds Uncalled bet (600) returned to Payme1sucker*** TURN *** [2h Ad Ac] [4d]*** RIVER *** [2h Ad Ac 4d] [8c]*** SHOW DOWN ***Payme1sucker: shows [7d 2s] (two pair, Aces and Deuces)Payme1sucker collected 550 from side potMav145: shows [Qh 7s] (a pair of Aces)scottwayne: shows [Kd Ks] (two pair, Aces and Kings)scottwayne collected 280 from main pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 830 Main pot 280. Side pot 550. | Rake 0 Board [2h Ad Ac 4d 8c]Seat 2: thelivewire (small blind) folded on the FlopSeat 4: Payme1sucker (big blind) showed [7d 2s] and won (550) with two pair, Aces and DeucesSeat 5: Mav145 showed [Qh 7s] and lost with a pair of AcesSeat 7: TigreMiky folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 8: Imperialismo folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: scottwayne (button) showed [Kd Ks] and won (280) with two pair, Aces and KingsNot 100% horrible. It's about 98-99% horrible, but not 100%. Note that both short stacks are equally all in for the main. For the tournament to continue, the two all-ins have to split the main pot.If you were at a higher level than the $1.10's, it might be a good image play. Link to post Share on other sites
jmbreslin 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 LOL that's fantastic, jm.The amazing thing about that hand is that the shortie tripled through on that hand and built his 295 chips into a stack of 2000+, resulting in a lengthy and close bubble battle. I almost ended up going out when I pushed KQs in the SB and ran into BB's AT, but turned a K to stay alive. I doubt that player even realizes in hindsight how bad his fold was. Link to post Share on other sites
BigDMcGee 3,355 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 The amazing thing about that hand is that the shortie tripled through on that hand and built his 295 chips into a stack of 2000+, resulting in a lengthy and close bubble battle. I almost ended up going out when I pushed KQs in the SB and ran into BB's AT, but turned a K to stay alive. I doubt that player even realizes in hindsight how bad his fold was.He probably just auto posted check/fold before the betting started. Which is dumb. But perhaps not as dumb as actually thinking folding for 47 more is a good idea. Link to post Share on other sites
Poppy_Hillis 11 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Forget everything I said. These are not beatable. I'm getting slaughtered now. Link to post Share on other sites
rcooj_7 0 Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 Ok, just played my first 2..... went 2/0they were small limits but one thing i learned is that it is a MUST that you play the turbo's, the reg SNG take way to long.... Link to post Share on other sites
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