Merby 3 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 This is within the first 10 hands and I don't have any reads yet. I was *very* surprised to see so many callers as these tournaments are very tight to start with a lot of players playing small ball strategies and jockeying for chips before the blinds and antes come into play.How much do we bet here and what is our plan if we face opposition? Would anyone prefer to check-raise or check-call?PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20 (9 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)Button (t3138)SB (t3040)BB (t2950)UTG (t3060)Hero (t3020)MP1 (t3020)MP2 (t2882)MP3 (t2920)CO (t2970)Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with A, A. 1 fold, Hero raises to t69, MP1 calls t69, MP2 calls t69, 1 fold, CO calls t69, Button calls t69, 1 fold, BB calls t49.Flop: (t424) 4, 4, 3(6 players)BB checks, Hero...? Link to post Share on other sites
TravisG 0 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 bets 3/4 pot and goes from there. Link to post Share on other sites
WhatArunAA 0 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 I'd bet half pot.. if I get more then 1 caller I shut down.maybe just ceck call.. 1 caller Im betting blank turn/ river for value.. if spade comes on turn or river im betting half pot and foldign to a raise. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 I think I would lead out with a 2/3 to pot sized bet and see what occurs. That amount should chase away a bunch of people and leave those who have str8 and flush draws wondering if they can afford to stay in for the price. I might even bet a little more than the pot to screw the odds up (500 inot a 400 pot, for example). Of course, if you get flatted or raised, you're going to have to figure out where you are. As it stands, you are beating everything except for trips/flopped boat.Hate these spots with AA, but strong early flop play should work. Link to post Share on other sites
Merby 3 Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 Flop: (t424) 4, 4, 3(6 players)BB checks, Hero bets 333, MP1 calls, 2 folds, Button raises to 999, 1 fold, Hero...?Obviously there are only two choices: pump or dump. We're crushed against a 4 or [33], we're crushing any pocket pair and we're in good shape against a naked flush draw. Link to post Share on other sites
cdipierr 0 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Flop: (t424) 4, 4, 3(6 players)BB checks, Hero bets 333, MP1 calls, 2 folds, Button raises to 999, 1 fold, Hero...?Obviously there are only two choices: pump or dump. We're crushed against a 4 or [33], we're crushing any pocket pair and we're in good shape against a naked flush draw.So sick. I guess if you feel you're better than the competition, you fold here since it's early. Might be up against something like 5s6s which would be icky. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Sparco 2 Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 I find it hard to put the button on KK or QQ - wouldn't he raise that preflop after so many callers?If he is on a naked straight or flush draw (would he play that in this way, though?) and you push, you are giving him about 2.4:1 odds (if I did that correctly...), so he is likely to call. A better draw and he will certainly call.Combined, I think we have little value from being way ahead against a smaller pair, and little fold equity, so we are probably way behind far too often to make a shove profitable. Finally, though I think it is unlikely, we could still run into concealed monster hand of MP1.Since I'm also a nit, I would fold here. Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Pushing forces him to play correctly with his most likely hands, flush draws and monster draws. Call, push a safe turn, fold to a bet after an ugly turn. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Pushing forces him to play correctly with his most likely hands, flush draws and monster draws. Call, push a safe turn, fold to a bet after an ugly turn.So check behind on the flop? Don't get me wrong, I think it's a pretty valid line, but doesn't that allow any hand that drawing, esp the strong draws, to catch up and overtake you? Would my (perhaps less than optimal) line (two thirds pot) force the issue more constructively? I think if the guy hits his monster on the turn, he's checking again anyway, to draw you out. His check on the flop may very well be a c/r set up anyway, if he's already made or has 12+ outs. Link to post Share on other sites
Merby 3 Posted August 1, 2008 Author Share Posted August 1, 2008 Pushing forces him to play correctly with his most likely hands, flush draws and monster draws. Call, push a safe turn, fold to a bet after an ugly turn.But since we're OOP, this is letting him win the pot whenever a scare card comes down. He has the advantage of calling my turn all in *only* when he can already beat my AA and also wins it when *any* scare card falls and I check to him (even if he only has a small PP and also missed). I think a call here is giving up too much since we're OOP. In position, I am much happier to slow down and let another card peel off.So check behind on the flop? Don't get me wrong, I think it's a pretty valid line, but doesn't that allow any hand that drawing, esp the strong draws, to catch up and overtake you? Would my (perhaps less than optimal) line (two thirds pot) force the issue more constructively? I think if the guy hits his monster on the turn, he's checking again anyway, to draw you out. His check on the flop may very well be a c/r set up anyway, if he's already made or has 12+ outs.Copernicus is commenting on my line I took (see post #5 of this thread). He is trying to answer the new question, now that I am facing one caller and a button raiser. Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Copernicus is commenting on my line I took (see post #5 of this thread). He is trying to answer the new question, now that I am facing one caller and a button raiser.correctaments Link to post Share on other sites
MovingIn 0 Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Pushing forces him to play correctly with his most likely hands, flush draws and monster draws. Call, push a safe turn, fold to a bet after an ugly turn.Do we see a safe turn often enough to risk losing a 3rd of our stack on this hand? Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 Do we see a safe turn often enough to risk losing a 3rd of our stack on this hand?Imo, yes. Im only really worried about the flush draw. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted August 2, 2008 Share Posted August 2, 2008 I see :-) Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites
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