timwakefield 68 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 For someone like me who for the most part believes in God, I can make the statement that I believe that the Big Bang was the start of our universe and the Big Bang was created by God. I can go along with this to a certain extent. I think this is very logical thinking.Regarding this and BG's last post - I don't see how this is "very logical" at all. All you're doing is allowing God to have the shadowy spaces that we can't yet (or quite possibly ever) definitively explain through scientific testing/reasoning. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 So what you are espousing is a Creator-less Creation.you're assuming "what exists" was created. Link to post Share on other sites
BaseJester 1 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 I think you guys think Christians give more thought to others than we really do.Granted... some sects actually do spend a lot of time on this but not all Christians.In a nut shell... the only way to heaven is by accepting Jesus Christ as your savior. Those who do not... will not get to heaven.At the church I go to ... we rarely if ever even speak of Hell or try to decide who may go there. We accept that we are all sinners and use the scriptures to remind us of how we should conduct ourselves.Perhaps Buddhist get to go to a different heaven.I think it's good to be humble about the possibilities, but this one really doesn't make sense. Jesus should know about this alternative path, being omniscient and all. He surely wasn't fibbing about there being only one way to know God. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Multiple feasable theories that explain what existed before time and space? Yea, I think the real genius is the guy that wrote the grant request to study that and got funding.That man is a genius.mocking stuff you know nothing about just makes you look like a dolt. Baically what crow is saying is: We don't know, but we know it wasn't God, because...no, i'm saying nobody knows including you. you're the one claiming to know what happened. Link to post Share on other sites
Loismustdie 0 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 mocking stuff you know nothing about just makes you look like a dolt. no, i'm saying nobody knows including you. you're the one claiming to know what happened. Except you don't know if he knows or not, you just think he doesn't based on your faith of choice. And the circle completes. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Except you don't know if he knows or notonly in the same sense that you don't know if people in insane asylums know something you don't. Link to post Share on other sites
Loismustdie 0 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 only in the same sense that you don't know if people in insane asylums know something you don't. Not really. If they were more evolved, and did have some sort of extra grasp, it stands to reason they would be out there and I would be in there. I find that I can often get a feel for who is king of the mountain by who is in a cage and who isn't. Cage people are rarely the winners. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Not really. If they were more evolved, and did have some sort of extra grasp, it stands to reason they would be out there and I would be in there. I find that I can often get a feel for who is king of the mountain by who is in a cage and who isn't. Cage people are rarely the winners.the cage is irrelevant. Link to post Share on other sites
LongLiveYorke 38 Posted July 18, 2008 Author Share Posted July 18, 2008 Also you have to give all your money away to the poor. Those are really the only two things that Christ wanted, and he repeated them both over and over. It's a pretty well documented fact that the thief on the cross had a large portfolio with diversification in seige weapons, and with the future Roman Jewish war on the hoizon you know that made him a pretty penny.and yet he was not asked to give any of it before he died. This isn't true.Well, maybe it's not necessary, but Jesus definitely smiled upon it. If I 100% believed there was a heaven and Jesus was the gate to paradise, I'd certainly sell all my belongings, give the money to the poor, and wonder the Earth preaching the word of God. You know, just to make extra sure. But I don't believe that, so I can still in good conscience use iPhones and such. Link to post Share on other sites
Loismustdie 0 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 the cage is irrelevant. The cage is everything. Freedom is everything. Link to post Share on other sites
timwakefield 68 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 But I don't believe that, so I can still in good conscience bang hookers and such.fizzle yo shizzleAlso, Lois whatever you're saying about people inside 'cages' is vague and weird. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Well, maybe it's not necessary, but Jesus definitely smiled upon it. If I 100% believed there was a heaven and Jesus was the gate to paradise, I'd certainly sell all my belongings, give the money to the poor, and wonder the Earth preaching the word of God. You know, just to make extra sure. But I don't believe that, so I can still in good conscience use iPhones and such.Works avail nothing. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 mocking stuff you know nothing about just makes you look like a dolt.Then I'm in the right place. Thanks for saving me a seat. no, i'm saying nobody knows including you. you're the one claiming to know what happened. No you are saying: The legitimate questions Christians bring up must have a vague pseudo-science based answer so we can pretend we are not ignoring the elephant in the room and admit that we are believing in total blind faith that something besides God gave a cause to the effect. Because if the cause is God, then 'they' might be right.And I only claim that I agree with what God said. You are the one saying God didn't say it. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 you're assuming "what exists" was created.So everything has always existed?Yea.. I'm the one using bad logic to make my case... Link to post Share on other sites
Loismustdie 0 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 fizzle yo shizzleAlso, Lois whatever you're saying about people inside 'cages' is vague and weird. It references a post Crow made about a page back, where he talks about mental patients. I debunk him rather quickly, he is merely flies in my soup. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 It references a post Crow made about a page back, where he talks about mental patients. I debunk him rather quickly, he is merely flies in my soup.the point went way over your head. the point was you and everyone else use objective science-like logic to judge other people's claims all the time. it's how you judge what the probability of truth for practical/useful purposes is in almost every aspect of your life every day (with the exception of your religious belief) because it consistently works. if scientific reasoning is faith you are as guilty of using it as i am (it's not faith). Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Then I'm in the right place. Thanks for saving me a seat.i not the one claiming to be more knowledgable and intuitive than the worlds entire scientific community, which is exactly what you're doing. No you are saying: The legitimate questions Christians bring up must have a vague pseudo-science based answerhow could something come from nothing is not a legitimate question. it's a simple-minded question based on ignorant egocentric assumptions. so we can pretend we are not ignoring the elephant in the room and admit that we are believing in total blind faith that something besides God gave a cause to the effect. Because if the cause is God, then 'they' might be rightscientists don't "believe" anything. they're doing what they can to try and learn, but they currently don't know what happened and don't claim to know. you're the one making pretentious claims.And I only claim that I agree with what God said. You are the one saying God didn't say it.entirely different subject. the origin of the bible is a simple anthropology and has nothing to do with the big bang or why/how we exist. Link to post Share on other sites
crowTrobot 2 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 So GOD has always existed?Yea.. I'm the one using bad logic to make my case... fyp Link to post Share on other sites
LongLiveYorke 38 Posted July 18, 2008 Author Share Posted July 18, 2008 Also, lol at the fact that a thread can be a total joke and completely void of any intentions or suggestions at actual discussion yet still within a page or two turn into the same religious bickering of every other thread. I mean, we only got one lousy lol cat from BalloonGuy. Jeez. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Also, lol at the fact that a thread can be a total joke and completely void of any intentions or suggestions at actual discussion yet still within a page or two turn into the same religious bickering of every other thread. I mean, we only got one lousy lol cat from BalloonGuy. Jeez.So wait...we were set up?It's like..unbelievable! Link to post Share on other sites
LongLiveYorke 38 Posted July 18, 2008 Author Share Posted July 18, 2008 So wait...we were set up?It's like..unbelievable!WILLIE: Mr. Costanza, I really don’t have time for this.GEORGE: Now, if this mechanic guy, was, in fact, eating a 5th Avenue bar, as he claimed, wouldn’t you agree he would have no problem picking one out from acandy line-up?WILLIE: "Candy line-up"?GEORGE: I’ve spent the last hour preparing ten candy bars with no wrappers of identification of any kind for him to select from.WILLIE: It took you an hour?GEORGE: Only I hold the answer key to their true candy identities. And so, without further ado, I give you.. the candy line-up. (Opens a door to a back room.Various dealership employees are munching on candy bars)SALESWOMAN: Hey, Willie, check it out! Free candy!GEORGE: That’s my candy line-up! Where are all my cards?! They’re - they’re all on the floor!(George starts picking up the numbered cards from off the floor. He sees the mechanic eating one of the candy bars)GEORGE: And you! How many Twix does that make for you, today?! Like, 8 Twix?!MECHANIC: No.MAN: Hey, this Clark bar is good.GEORGE: It’s a Twix! They’re all Twix! It was a setup! A setup, I tell ya! And you’ve robbed it! You’ve all screwed me again! Now, gimme one! Gimme a Twix!MECHANIC: They’re all gone.GEORGE: (Yelling out, frustrated. The camera spins from a top angle) Ttttttwwwwiiiiiixxxxx! ...ELAINE: So, George, I still don’t understand - how was that a setup?JERRY: And who were you tryin’ to set up, anyway? The mechanic or the manager?GEORGE: I don’t know. All of ‘em. They’re all crooks! Link to post Share on other sites
Zealous Donkey 0 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Some of the areas that are silent in the Bible are often attempted to be answered with similar problems and how they were dealt with.It is largely held that the 3 days Christ was in the tomb were spent in the place between heaven and hell where the Jewish faithful were waiting for their Messiah. This would have only applied to the Jews who held to the faith. This comes from parables Christ spoke about and other references. I believe this to be true.Catholics got purgatory from this. Something not supported because the Bible says :"Man is allotted once to die, then judgement" But it's not hard to see how they made the connection. It is pretty much discredited in the protestant camps because the whole point of Christ's blood was to cover your sins, not cover 'some' of your sins and you need to be punished for other ones.I have heard Lois' explanation before, and like I said I don't see where it is outside of Biblical possiblities, in other words it doesn't contridict what the Bible says, but it would be extra-Biblical in that the Bible is silent on the subject. Given that I wouldn't bet the farm, but if it turns out to be true,it won't change my faith either way. Kind of like UFOs.Your wrong about purgatory. Catholics do believe Christs blood cleanses all sins. Purgatory is where the scrubbing takes place. Also, I am not completely sure about this but putgatory and Abraham's bosom are two different places. Link to post Share on other sites
Randy Reed 0 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 You suspected I'd pull some quote out of the Bible to define...what the Bible says? I guess I again don't follow how you are satisfied with this, but we're working off the Rush connection.and we're both from OhioI'm from Newark, oh and we both love Ice CreamAnd we're both rich, don't forget that we're RICH! Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 And we're both rich, don't forget that we're RICH!High fiveWe should totally hire people to argue for us and just go fishing at some really exclusive fishing place Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 High fiveWe should totally hire people to argue for us and just go golfing at some really exclusive golf courseFYP I am in. Link to post Share on other sites
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