Wsop Step 5

[gobears 0]

Everyone has been playing tight - I've been snapped off twice. First time that MP1 has limped in. Do we raise which commits us or fold here with an OESD. Blinds about to move up to 75/150 on next hand.PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (8 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)MP2 (t1610)CO (t1305)Button (t1695)SB (t1670)Hero (t1150)UTG (t3220)UTG+1 (t1155)MP1 (t1695)Preflop: Hero is BB with , . 2 folds, MP1 calls t100, 2 folds, Button calls t100, 1 fold, Hero checks.Flop: (t350) , , (3 players)Hero checks, MP1 checks, Button bets t200, Hero?

[copernicus 0]

flat it, bet the straight or an A or K on the turn

[WhatArunAA 0]

Shoving all day here.

[jmbreslin 0]

What's the argument against shoving? Neither player has given us reason to believe that he's sitting with a hand of any value. Button probably has TP or MP with a mediocre kicker, and I'd put MP1 on something like a small PP or perhaps a weak suited Ace.

[copernicus 0]

What's the argument against shoving? Neither player has given us reason to believe that he's sitting with a hand of any value. Button probably has TP or MP with a mediocre kicker, and I'd put MP1 on something like a small PP or perhaps a weak suited Ace.

Its a step 5. The key to making the Steps +EV is to survive until you get to a ticket back to the current level and then step up your all in game (if you havent built a stack playing super tight). If you are really short and have reached a ticket to the level below then you might have to start making moves earlier. Shoving a 33% hand this early against two players is a clear mistake imo. Yes, you have some fold equity, but not enough. If you limp youve got 14 outs to a straight or a scare card that gives you even more fold equity assuming MP folds. I wouldnt bluff the scare card against 2 players.

[jmbreslin 0]

I'm just not crazy about calling off 200 of my ~1200 chips when I'm only slightly better than 50% to get a turn card worth betting (and it may still end up 3-way).

[copernicus 0]

I'm just not crazy about calling off 200 of my ~1200 chips when I'm only slightly better than 50% to get a turn card worth betting (and it may still end up 3-way).

I agree, 20% of your stack here is not great to spew off. Its a tough balance between hitting the monster and more than doubling up and being well stacked at least down to the final 5 or folding and preserving your stack. If it were a blind level lower Id be much more comfortable calling. At this level folding isnt a bad option. But no way am I pushing it, thats awful in the higher Steps imo.this would be a good one for coding in Poker EV and determining cash EV, not chipEV.

[gobears 0]

Well I raised to 700 leaving 350 behind, MP1 folds and the button insta-shoves so I of course have to call. He has QJ and I whiff as turn was a 9 and river a 3.These steps are somewhat addictive as I've been playing them for fun. Four step ones and I started at step two this time and it's the first time I made it to step 5.

[jmbreslin 0]

What was your rationale for the raise to 700? Were you hoping it would make you look stronger? "I'm obviously not afraid to commit all my chips so don't mess with me..."

[Poker Addict 0]

I agree with Coper on this. In a typical SNG we need to get to third so I think shoving is correct, but in Step 5 is a much different set up. Because there is value in finishing as high as 6th.5-6 get a Step 4 - $215 value3-4 get another Step 5 - $700 value1-2 get Step 6 - $2100 valueAnd we really are not completely crippled in these if we do brick the turn and check/fold. We are desperately short but in no way out. I came back in a Step 4 this morning to win after being 7 handed and 500 chips.Sure my Step 5 ended in two hands when KK<AK and he shoved my three bet. But meh... w/e. They are addictive and I have some major FPPs now.

[gobears 0]

What was your rationale for the raise to 700? Were you hoping it would make you look stronger? "I'm obviously not afraid to commit all my chips so don't mess with me..."

Basically - actually thought about min-raising. The turn card was interesting as it paired the board. If I had flatted then bet out, I wonder if the second 9 was a potential scare card to semi-bluff with along with my OESD.

[copernicus 0]

Basically - actually thought about min-raising. The turn card was interesting as it paired the board. If I had flatted then bet out, I wonder if the second 9 was a potential scare card to semi-bluff with along with my OESD.

Yeah...I mentioned semi-bluffing the turn if a scare card came calling them A or K, but clearly pairing the board is another few "fold equity outs". That makes it an easier to decision to flat even at this blind level. I dont like the 700 raise leaving 350 behind. It can just as easily be interpreted as weakness "I dont want to push because if my 700 raise is called I can fold and still have some chips to try and back into 6th". If youre going to make a pot committing raise just go ahead and push and not leave it to villain to interpret what a less than all in raise means.

[Kid DynOmite 0]

typical sng shove. This one call, and fold if you miss... you still have a stick worth shoving with at 75-150. The 200 makes me nervous... obv i still insta shove in a normal sng.