Aa Question (tourny)

[HighwayStar 8]

still laughing at flatting??

:D

[theabyss 0]

But your best scenario against this guy is to have all your money in against him with the best possible hand. If you are saying you have some reason to think he is going to fold and are calling in order to entice a shove from him or something, seems kinda silly... what better time for him to call a shove then with all that money in the pot?

ya, thats kinda more along the lines of what im talking about.If you call you are pretty much making sure that the CO comes along for the ride. you are right that even if you shove he will PROBABLY call but if he doesnt then you lost a great opportunity to take advantage of AA against one opponent (in the side pot that is)thanks for your honest response and not just trying to be funny. at least you show that you've atleast read the question

[Poker Addict 0]

i cordially disagree

Does anyone in here have any tournament poker sense? Some one must.

Ummmmmmmmm GFYYou ask for opinions and then want to argue the answers you get. Don't ask for answers unless this was the entire point of your post. Nice way to join a forum where you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about or who you are talking to.I thought kafkapoe was banned from this site...EDIT: By the way, this post just struck me as incredibly rude - so I answered before reading anymore.

[Tehtoe 3]

[mase_gotsem 0]

before i read answers i probly call and shove any flop committing him in the pot so incase i lose to the other 2 i have a nice side pot to win but when i call and he hits his set on the flop and insta snap helmuth calls my shove i rip my shirt off and knock all the chips on the floor and kick and scream while crying as security carries me out.but thats just me .

[theabyss 0]

to break it down ........you want the 4th player (the cutoff) in the hand with you. if you dont agree with that then say so and we can discuss it further.if you do agree, here is how you do it:A) call. CO is priced in and responds by either calling himself, raising all in, or, if hes funny like some of you guys he folds (1/10000 chance he's that bad)B.) Raise all-in. He still probably calls but if you challenge him to lay it down and that is not to your advantage here.

[theabyss 0]

before i read answers i probly call and shove any flop committing him in the pot so incase i lose to the other 2 i have a nice side pot to win but when i call and he hits his set on the flop and insta snap helmuth calls my shove i rip my shirt off and knock all the chips on the floor and kick and scream while crying as security carries me out.but thats just me .

ya mase, thats what i was thinking too....but i think thats a risk you gotta be willing to take.if you think about it tho, if you could play that one guy heads up with AA (and pretend that side pot didnt exist) wouldnt you want the chips all in preflop? If you say yes to that then you sorta gotta think the same way here imo

[mase_gotsem 0]

ya mase, thats what i was thinking too....but i think thats a risk you gotta be willing to take.if you think about it tho, if you could play that one guy heads up with AA (and pretend that side pot didnt exist) wouldnt you want the chips all in preflop? If you say yes to that then you sorta gotta think the same way here imo

dont you dare agree with me . lol jk

[HighwayStar 8]

I hate flat calling here, it's just not the way I play in tournaments. I think you'll find yourself hard pressed to find many people who think it's good here.I could be wrong.The pot is about 10400 as you act after the shovesYou have 12.8kCO has 14.8kIf you flat call and he calls behind the pot is gonna be about 17k and you'll have 9k behind meaning you pretty much have to shove 100% of flops. So why not just do it preflop where you're guaranteed to get your money in good?IDK when I play I try to get as much in preflop with KK/AA as I can. Specially online with fast structures/small stack sizes.

[theabyss 0]

Ummmmmmmmm GFYYou ask for opinions and then want to argue the answers you get. Don't ask for answers unless this was the entire point of your post. Nice way to join a forum where you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about or who you are talking to.I thought kafkapoe was banned from this site...EDIT: By the way, this post just struck me as incredibly rude - so I answered before reading anymore.

I realize im new to the forum and i didnt start a thread to be confrontational. In fact, on the contrary, i came here to start an intelligent conversation with people who i thought would treat the topic with equal due diligence - as im sure you would expect too if you had an idea you wanted to share (in any place of discussion be it online or in person). Is it not a bit disappointing to get hasty sarcastic responses to something that you know holds some merit and u hoped to have more insighful banter about? I believe it is. I was hoping to get some solid responses - which i have from some people - and i respect them for that.

[HighwayStar 8]

Basically I hate the flat call here because you CANNOT fold.Any half decent CO will not flat call behind, they'll shove or fold. Given he's not reraised pre he's almost certainly folding anyway.If the CO is a complete moron he could call behind and stack off with his Jacks or whatever on a lot of flops.But for me it's not worth the risk. Why play tricky when all you have is 1 pair with 5 cards to come?This wasn't quite as silly as I first thought. Still a clear decision for me.

[PokerFan 0]

I realize im new to the forum and i didnt start a thread to be confrontational. In fact, on the contrary, i came here to start an intelligent conversation with people who i thought would treat the topic with equal due diligence - as im sure you would expect too if you had an idea you wanted to share (in any place of discussion be it online or in person). Is it not a bit disappointing to get hasty sarcastic responses to something that you know holds some merit and u hoped to have more insighful banter about? I believe it is. I was hoping to get some solid responses - which i have from some people - and i respect them for that.

To be a poker expert around here you need atleast 25 prior post...For me to take you serious, please capitalize "I"....oh yeah....The correct play is insta-shove...

[Loismustdie 0]

Hi guys, i've thrown this question around to friends and in other forums because I want to get different views on it. It's a hypothetical situation so the numbers are vague and don't need to be specific.Here is how it goes:_______________________________________________You are in a tourny.You have ~14,000 chips and are UTG with AA.The blinds are 200-400.You raise 3x the bb to 1200. The next few players fold and the cutoff just calls.The button folds.SB goes all in for 2900.BB also shoves all in for 4900.The next player to act is you with only one left behind (the cutoff who called your raise). He has you covered.What do you do?________________________________________________________________________Before i hit the "post topic" button, let me add something.It's not as simple as it may first seem to be. It's very situational.I think the best thing to do is call. Consider the options carefully.thoughts?

These threads get so old. Why even bother thinking if this is all that wheezes out? The only answer is push all in. Anyone who says anything else is ****ing with you. If you don't push all in you should not play poker. Well, you should, but not for the reasons you think.

[mase_gotsem 0]

you gotta give the forum the benifit of the doubt you dont relise how many newbs come on here posting qeustions and theorysand then berate others for voicing there opinion. so your gna get alot sarcastic and half asses remarkks becouse no one is taking your first post or so seriouse but once you stick around and ppl get a read on you they tend to give more respect .thick skin is needed at first on any forum online .

[theabyss 0]

I hate flat calling here, it's just not the way I play in tournaments. I think you'll find yourself hard pressed to find many people who think it's good here.I could be wrong.The pot is about 10400 as you act after the shovesYou have 12.8kCO has 14.8kIf you flat call and he calls behind the pot is gonna be about 17k and you'll have 9k behind meaning you pretty much have to shove 100% of flops. So why not just do it preflop where you're guaranteed to get your money in good?IDK when I play I try to get as much in preflop with KK/AA as I can. Specially online with fast structures/small stack sizes.

Yes, i fully agree. However i think this situation is different because if you discourage the CO from joining the hand you have a 3way pot with no betting and the cards face up. If that is all you want then that is fine - but i think it is not optimal.I think what is optimal is to establish in your mind that that mainpot is now out of your control. Leave it be and consider the fact that you have the chance to play an isolated hand with a guy with a stack slightly bigger than yours and you hold AA plus you know that since the situation is a bit unusual, he is probably going to want to stick around. I agree with you that your only move is to shove AFTER the flop. I am committing to that in my mind even before the flop comes. Essentally you know you are going to be all in if the CO comes along and you gotta be confident that is one time............ONE TIME!!!!! hahah..............your AA will hold against him. You may even lose the smaller main pot but if you beat that one guy its huge and you take out a monster stack in the process

[Vtlaxer09 4]

No, i did not "lose" because this never happened. Do you know what "hypothetical" means?Does anyone in here have any tournament poker sense? Some one must.______________You see, i asked this particular question for a reason.this is not really a "trick" question but it is close. It requires more than just basic thinking that goes with cut n dry poker decisions.This is the essence of situational tournament poker.You have two guys all in already who you will undoubtably be contesting when the board is complete because there is no way you are going to fold to either of their all in bets - simple.The thing here though is that you still have one player left to act behind you who, at this point, you are 100% in the lead or at worst tied (if he also has AA).Since the main pot is not going to have any betting from here on out you must think that now you are re-starting the hand against 1 opponent. You are encouraging anyone to participate in a hand against you when you hold AA and you are guaranteed no other competition.Lets say you do go all in and manage to get the Cutoff caller to fold. You now have the same scenario you are destined to have anyway -- a 3way battle for a stagnant pot with all cards face up. Thats not bad but its not your best option. If you lose this pot there is nothing u can do about it. Thats the way the cards were destined to fall.BUT.....if you bring in this 4th player into the mix, you have a chance to play basically a second hand heads up and AA is a monster heads up as we all know.So, do you guys wanna change your insta-shove opinion or do you see any fault in my analysis???

wow you're way off. I bolded the extemely idiotic things you said.I have a little tourney knowledge.. i think... anyway... if you dont shove your AA here then you're beyond retarded. plain and simple... good day sir.

[Loismustdie 0]

you gotta give the forum the benifit of the doubt you dont relise how many newbs come on here posting qeustions and theorysand then berate others for voicing there opinion. so your gna get alot sarcastic and half asses remarkks becouse no one is taking your first post or so seriouse but once you stick around and ppl get a read on you they tend to give more respect .thick skin is needed at first on any forum online .

Making newbs smile one at a time. Well said.

[wsox8 10]

Am I on a game show right now? I hate game shows.

[theabyss 0]

To be a poker expert around here you need atleast 25 prior post...For me to take you serious, please capitalize "I"....oh yeah....The correct play is insta-shove...

EDIT---- lol, by the time I'm done ("trying to") defending the merits of this post "I" should have well over 25 posts....lol

[fighter 4]

OMG fist pump insta shove!

[ThePhoenix88 0]

Am I on a game show right now? I hate game shows.

Door one, Door two, or Door three?

[Vtlaxer09 4]

ya mase, thats what i was thinking too....but i think thats a risk you gotta be willing to take.if you think about it tho, if you could play that one guy heads up with AA (and pretend that side pot didnt exist) wouldnt you want the chips all in preflop? If you say yes to that then you sorta gotta think the same way here imo

NO ITS NOT A RISK YOU HAVE TO BE WILLING TO TAKE.Tournament poker is about staying alive.. no matter what. Accumulating chips is important..but.. PROTECTING YOUR CHIPS IS 100x more important. We have a nice stack... over 30 bb's... if we shove and win the 3 way pot..then we are sitting with over 50 bb's. There is absolutely no reason to try and price another person in and take our hand 4 way to the flop.

[HighwayStar 8]

I have a little tourney knowledge

Lies!

[HighwayStar 8]

NO ITS NOT A RISK YOU HAVE TO BE WILLING TO TAKE.Tournament poker is about staying alive.. no matter what. Accumulating chips is important..but.. PROTECTING YOUR CHIPS IS 100x more important. We have a nice stack... over 30 bb's... if we shove and win the 3 way pot..then we are sitting with over 50 bb's. There is absolutely no reason to try and price another person in and take our hand 4 way to the flop.

This is way better than I put it.Nh

[theabyss 0]

wow you're way off. I bolded the extemely idiotic things you said.I have a little tourney knowledge.. i think... anyway... if you dont shove your AA here then you're beyond retarded. plain and simple... good day sir.

Okay, so clearly I am beyond retarded. But sir, tell me WHY. Explain it to me. Then I can perhaps take your expertise to heart. But back up your belittling comments please. I did not make fun of you. You can make fun of me but only if you prove it to me first.