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Wsop 2008 Final Table In November


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You obviously don't get it. They are going to cut and edit the show in less than 24 hours. The final table finishes Monday night, and it airs Tuesday night. The three months you are talking about is for the HORSE and the lead up to the main event to air weekly. They show day 1, day, 2, day 3, etc. one episode a week and then the ESPN broadcast shows who is at the final table two weeks prior to November 11th. November 4th is a preview episode, final table happens 9th/10th and airs on the 11th. The only reason they don't want to do it at the end of July is because then everything wouldn't be in a chronological order. You can't show the final table first, then go back and air the first few days of the ME.
Three years, and THIS is my first response from DN?God. Dammit. :club: On a serious note, DN, I'm not suggesting ESPN show the MAIN EVENT coverage out of order. The two weeks (versus three months) I proposed between the ME days and the Final Table would be for ESPN to cull together all the Main Event-only footage into 7 shows or whatever. Thus, ESPN uses the first week to edit these together, and the second week to run each of these Main Event episodes one day after the next for the second week, thus building to the climactic, live final seemlessly.By my understanding, ESPN is saying they need THREE MONTHS between because they're trying to edit ALL THE EVENTS before the ME FT. This is stupid. While we DO need to see the Main Event Day 1, Day 2 etc. shows before the ME Final Table, we DON'T need to see the other 50+ events before it. We have all of the rest of the year to be entertained over and over by those.Capiche?
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Well if the final ten don't like the format then they should just all agree to chop and push in all their money and BAM no FT at all and a big F U to Harrah's and ESPN. Now that would be comedy!
Or better yet, agree to chop, then fold to the big blind on every hand while getting extremely drunk and rowdy. Every time a player won the blinds, he would celebrate wildly.They'd still be playing/celebrating at air time.
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Three years, and THIS is my first response from DN?God. Dammit. :club: On a serious note, DN, I'm not suggesting ESPN show the MAIN EVENT coverage out of order. The two weeks (versus three months) I proposed between the ME days and the Final Table would be for ESPN to cull together all the Main Event-only footage into 7 shows or whatever. Thus, ESPN uses the first week to edit these together, and the second week to run each of these Main Event episodes one day after the next for the second week, thus building to the climactic, live final seemlessly.By my understanding, ESPN is saying they need THREE MONTHS between because they're trying to edit ALL THE EVENTS before the ME FT. This is stupid. While we DO need to see the Main Event Day 1, Day 2 etc. shows before the ME Final Table, we DON'T need to see the other 50+ events before it. We have all of the rest of the year to be entertained over and over by those.Capiche?
Or how about start airing prelim events before the WSOP is over. Event 1 ends, you take a week to edit and air it the next week or something, and so on. Space it out however is needed to fit the specific events they want to have aired into weekly spots.
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Or how about start airing prelim events before the WSOP is over. Event 1 ends, you take a week to edit and air it the next week or something, and so on. Space it out however is needed to fit the specific events they want to have aired into weekly spots.
Absolutely. This probably only gets 4-6 prelim events shown before the ME, but it hits to the core of my point. I've never understood (and I'm especially perplexed given this new twist) why ALL the events must be edited before they start showing ANY of them.
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I like you! I like you too, you know I like you!Come on guys we're playing poker!Just check Sammy! I have to call you!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRt_S0LxgZgJust put it on loop and play for 4 months. Done and done.Mark
That is most annoying thing to watch ever. Jamie gold is such a pussy, Sammy plays poker for a living so he's gonna take your chips.Its a shame Allen didn't win in 06 he was so close and he owned jamie almost every hand.
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As I've said elsewhere in Daniel's blog forum, while I see your points against this format, I also see a huge plus in that this will bring poker into the primetime, sweeps week spotlight in the U.S. What better opportunity do you want to try to promote bringing internet poker back to the U.S.? This would take poker out of the backrooms of TV so to speak (ie summer time) and into a positive light which is going to be essential if we're going to get the internet poker ban repealed. Think about the bigger picture people. You know, maybe just maybe that's what Daniel's thinking about too.

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As I've said elsewhere in Daniel's blog forum, while I see your points against this format, I also see a huge plus in that this will bring poker into the primetime, sweeps week spotlight in the U.S. What better opportunity do you want to try to promote bringing internet poker back to the U.S.? This would take poker out of the backrooms of TV so to speak (ie summer time) and into a positive light which is going to be essential if we're going to get the internet poker ban repealed. Think about the bigger picture people. You know, maybe just maybe that's what Daniel's thinking about too.
Poker is already everywhere on NBC, ESPN, Fox Sports Network, Bravo, GSN, etc.. How much more do we need? Primetime TV isn't going to put poker any more in a positive light than it already is. Repealing the internet poker ban is not about how popular the sport is. If you want to win that battle, it's got to be won on the rights/freedoms/not harming anyone angles, not popularity.And I'm not sure this massive change to the biggest event in poker even accomplishes what you suggest in the first place. I still think it will be worse. When you think about it, broadcasting the ME FT like this makes it pretty much like any other WPT event--just another final table on some random date.
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I think some big name pros like DN, Chan etc are in favor of this to help build their bankrolls. More than likely they will not make the final table in that huge field. Most of the players that will make the final table will be amateurs. Who will those amateurs go to to get help with their game? DN, Chan, Hellmuth, Lederer, Duke, etc. I am sure Gold had to give a chunk of $ to Chan for his support and mentoring. Just a thought.p.s. -Maybe not Duke! lol

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So will all the players get an equal share of the accrued interest or only interest on their eventual winnings. Not that it matters. Just curious.

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Or better yet, agree to chop, then fold to the big blind on every hand while getting extremely drunk and rowdy. Every time a player won the blinds, he would celebrate wildly.They'd still be playing/celebrating at air time.
I think you're on to something ...
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I'll benefit certainly, but don't kid yourself and think that this couldn't benefit online poker in a big way. Guy from Italy is at the final table... loads of exposure in Italy, loads of new Italian players... guy from Bulgaria is third in chips, he appears on all of the major stations in Bulgaria wearing a PokerStars hat= more fish from Bulgaria... Ben Affleck makes the final table, poker discussed on ET, Inside Edition, etc. much like they do with Dancing with the Stars... more potential to reach a wider demographic. Big picture guys, let's give this a shot one time and if it sucks, meh, no big deal, we change it back.
Don't you think all the hype leading up to and including the November election is going to put the damper on pretty much anything that happens around and in November though?I guess we have no choice but to give this a shot and see what happens. Of course I want more exposure for poker, but I'm not sure if I want this to work out though because then it'll be this way every year.I'm sure glad they don't have any BIG ideas for the NHL playoffs ;-)
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So will all the players get an equal share of the accrued interest or only interest on their eventual winnings. Not that it matters. Just curious.
I'd assume they'd put it into the main bankroll and then resplit the amounts based on the percentages they had determined beforehand.
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Absolutely. This probably only gets 4-6 prelim events shown before the ME, but it hits to the core of my point. I've never understood (and I'm especially perplexed given this new twist) why ALL the events must be edited before they start showing ANY of them.
Even with all of this delay, that's all they're showing anyway...
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Absolutely. This probably only gets 4-6 prelim events shown before the ME, but it hits to the core of my point. I've never understood (and I'm especially perplexed given this new twist) why ALL the events must be edited before they start showing ANY of them.
Potsie, I was gonna quote your post #97, glad I kept reading. Your idea makes perfect sense and still gives Harrahs/WSOP plenty of time to hype the hell out of the ME. I believe the target audience they are hoping to hit is only going to watch NLHE events and probably HORSE so they could/should air the other events in a 2 hour episode a day or so after the event finishes. I can't remember the exact dates but say event one is over on July 1. Edit the tapes and air the thing July 3. Continue doing so with each event and maybe take a one week break to get a really good promo going for the ME FT. PROS: If I FT event 1, I have two days to call every single person I have ever met and tell them to watch me on July 3!!! Now that's gonna get some good ratings. There is just no really good reason to delay the FT for 117 days.....none.New question.......say John Brownski from Poland has won a package from PS for his seat at the ME and by some miracle he FT's the thing. PS has already paid a good bit of money for him to stay in Vegas for the original tournament with the bonuses they have set up for making through certain days. So who's paying for his trip back? Will these changes effect the satellites that poker sites are already running for seats in the ME?
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Potsie, I was gonna quote your post #97, glad I kept reading. Your idea makes perfect sense and still gives Harrahs/WSOP plenty of time to hype the hell out of the ME. I believe the target audience they are hoping to hit is only going to watch NLHE events and probably HORSE so they could/should air the other events in a 2 hour episode a day or so after the event finishes. I can't remember the exact dates but say event one is over on July 1. Edit the tapes and air the thing July 3. Continue doing so with each event and maybe take a one week break to get a really good promo going for the ME FT. PROS: If I FT event 1, I have two days to call every single person I have ever met and tell them to watch me on July 3!!! Now that's gonna get some good ratings. There is just no really good reason to delay the FT for 117 days.....none.New question.......say John Brownski from Poland has won a package from PS for his seat at the ME and by some miracle he FT's the thing. PS has already paid a good bit of money for him to stay in Vegas for the original tournament with the bonuses they have set up for making through certain days. So who's paying for his trip back? Will these changes effect the satellites that poker sites are already running for seats in the ME?
I thought I read somewhere that they were paying out 9th place money to everybody. They can afford their own flight back. Im sure Harrahs will comp the RFB.
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Long thread :club: Here I go ...Harrahs owns the WSOP, granted, and are entitled to do whatever they want with it. It is in their best interest to address players wishes and to that end they not only have a player's committee, but have a pretty good track record of fixing hideous scheduling problems, card problems, and banning ideas that never should have seen the light of day (The damned tents at the RIO :D ).Harrahs have clearly identified a benefit by delaying the final table of the Main Event. The player's committee have uncomfortably given the idea a green light, if I had to guess, because it is a new idea. It is less crazy than putting the final table in the middle of Freemont Street in the Las Vegas Heat :D So this is officially a "new twist", a "brave new adventure", and a "bold step forward for the WSOP franchise". Nice. :qh It is possible to distort an event beyond recognition, and I think that is what has happened here.I think it is worth a try if only because the current owners want to do it. I mean, why not? Even if it sounds, and looks, totally retarded, sometimes it is worth the risk to roll the dice for a bigger score in both money and publicity.That said, this sword cuts both ways. There is a lot, and I mean a LOT, of money in play here. It is never a good idea to give a big money deal too much time twisting in the wind ( Just ask Yahoo :qh) so my argument against this change has to do with RISK and DOWNSIDE.I think that the temptation for players to make a deal will be irrisistable, and any soft-play at the Final Table will either be spotted instantly or debated endlessly on forums. Headlines of "$10 Million Dollar WSOP Poker Match fixed" is NOT what I want to see and the damage control on that scenerio is virtually nil.The theories about "hitmen" being hired to "whack final table players" :3h are entertaining but will not hurt poker. Crazier things have happened associated with the WSOP. That kind of negative publicity would probably help poker and the WSOP with good spin control from Harrahs :D Pardon the pun people ... but "kill pots" would take a whole new meaning :icon_clap::icon_clap: One overlooked side debate is how the WSOP form every player has to sign is going to change to accomodate all of the plans that Harrahs has for the 9 final table qualifiers. Harrahs is going to want access to these players, probably with cameras, maybe arranging coaches. This is pretty intrusive and not everyone is going to be game for this, so the form everyone has to sign will probably cover that by saying that if you make the final table, you are obligated to do this, and this, and this.Now a word for the Amateur players. For most of the amateur players (count me in that crowd!), the only way we will see the WSOP Main Event final table as a participants is to literally luckbox on an interstellar scale. Quite frankly, we would be so thankful to make the final table that even if Harrahs wanted to paint you pink, you would agree. :D I predict that the pros are going to react pretty strongly when the player's agreement for the Main Event comes out and yes, even Daniel is going to be doing a rethink. Supporting a change is one thing, but three months at the beck and call of Harrahs for the top pros is not going to fly IMHO :icon_clap: .A lot can happen in three months. You can get sick. Dying is less of a problem :ts If you die you do not care anymore and frankly, if one of the WSOP Final Table participants were to die before November, Harrahs could legitimately claim that "there has been a decline in unsatisfied customers". :icon_clap: They would roll out the bubble boy to great publicity, present a "dark horse", and tout "another chance" kind of fanfare.Personally, I think that the loss of playing momentum is a legit beef, but you stop tournaments all the time. The time is just a lot longer. Sure we will get some players whining after the Main Event that they could have won if it had been played right away ... well, we hear whining today for a hundred other reasons, so this line of argument is just another bad beat story. Rested players = better poker. :icon_clap: Endorsements for the players depends on what Harrahs will allow. Watch that argument unfold :icon_clap: Then there is the business side. The WSOP is a huge poker festival that, if managed properly, can become bigger. The Main Event is not a sacred cow that must remain static. Poker's popularity has forced the Main Event to mutate a lot, into a multiple day marathon. There is no debate today that the Main Event HAS TO be finished in one day, like it was in the past. :D There are just too many players.As a businessman, I see in this move by Harrahs a desire to get a better handle on the WSOP Main Event. They want the time to plan promotion and coordinate publicity. This is a normal desire and the idea of a fresh, rested final table a few months down the line, with experts, stats, and the programing lined up is - from a film production point of view - is a serious goal. There is no question the show will be better.Will they make more money? :5cWell, I hope so. The reason they are keen on the event is that they see the potential of poker to make a lot of money. I want them to make a fortune because that is the best incentive for Harrahs to treat the WSOP carefully.Harrahs knows the fable of the goose that lays the golden eggs and has no intention of killing the WSOP goose. Frankly, the WSOP is a zoo now and the Main Event has become an endurance test.The "good old days" was few people taking the escalator up into the smoke-choked confines of Binion's second floor, cardboard scorecards tacked to the wall, and a 'long tournament" meant 30 hours, not 6 days. Those days are toast. The WSOP has had to adapt to the times and the player numbers, and this change is part of the process.Personally, I suspect that there are very real risks to Harrah's plan to delay the final table of the Main Event, and the debate is not over. Instinctively I know that with that kind of money swingin in the wind, Harrahs is asking for trouble with this delay, but let's try it out and see. :4h

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Long thread :club: Here I go ...Harrahs owns the WSOP, granted, and are entitled to do whatever they want with it. It is in their best interest to address players wishes and to that end they not only have a player's committee, but have a pretty good track record of fixing hideous scheduling problems, card problems, and banning ideas that never should have seen the light of day (The damned tents at the RIO :D ).Harrahs have clearly identified a benefit by delaying the final table of the Main Event. The player's committee have uncomfortably given the idea a green light, if I had to guess, because it is a new idea. It is less crazy than putting the final table in the middle of Freemont Street in the Las Vegas Heat :D So this is officially a "new twist", a "brave new adventure", and a "bold step forward for the WSOP franchise". Nice. :qh It is possible to distort an event beyond recognition, and I think that is what has happened here.I think it is worth a try if only because the current owners want to do it. I mean, why not? Even if it sounds and looks totally retarded, sometimes it is worth the risk to roll the dice for a bigger score in both money and publicity.That said, this sword cuts both ways. There is a lot, and I mean a LOT, of money in play here. It is never a good idea to give a big money deal too much time twisting in the wind ( Just ask Yahoo :qh) so my arguement against this change has to do with RISK and DOWNSIDE.I think that the temptation for players to make a deal will be irrisistable, and any soft-play at the Final Table will either be spotted instantly or debated endlessly on forums. Headlines of "$10 Million Dollar WSOP Poker Match fixed" is NOT what I want to see and the damage control on that scenerio is virtually nil.The theories about "hitmen" being hired to "whack final table players" :3h are entertaining but will not hurt poker. Crazier things have happened associated with the WSOP. That kind of negative publicity would probably help poker and the WSOP with good spin control from Harrahs :D Pardon the pun people ... but "kill pots" would take a whole new meaning :icon_clap::icon_clap: One overlooked side debate is how the WSOP form every player has to sign is going to change to accomodate all of the plans that Harrahs has for the 9 final table qualifiers. Harrahs is going to want access to these players, probably with cameras, maybe arranging coaches. This is pretty intrusive and not everyone is going to be game for this, so the form everyone has to sign will probably cover that by saying that if you make the final table, you are obligated to do this, and this, and this.Now a word for the Amateur players. For most of the amateur players (count me in that crowd!), the only way we will see the WSOP Main Event final table as a participants is to literally luckbox on an interstellar scale. Quite frankly, we would be so thankful to make the final table that even if Harrahs wanted to paint you pink, you would agree. :D I predict that the pros are going to react pretty strongly when the player's agreement for the Main Event comes out and yes, even Daniel is going to be doing a rethink. Supporting a change is one thing, but three months at the beck and call of Harrahs for the top pros is not going to fly IMHO :icon_clap: .A lot can happen in three months. You can get sick. Dying is less of a problem :ts If you die you do not care anymore and frankly, if one of the WSOP Final Table participants were to die before November, Harrahs could legitimately claim that "there has been a decline in unsatisfied customers". :icon_clap: They would roll out the bubble boy to great publicity, present a "dark horse", and tout "another chance" kind of fanfare.Personally, I think that the loss of playing momentum is a legit beef, but you stop tournaments all the time. The time is just a lot longer. Sure we will get some players whining after the Main Event that they could have won if it had been played right away ... well, we hear whining today for a hundred other reasons, so this line of argument is just another bad beat story. Rested players = better poker. :icon_clap: Endorsements for the players depends on what Harrahs will allow. Watch that argument unfold :icon_clap: Then there is the business side. The WSOP is a huge poker festival that, if managed properly, can become bigger. The Main Event is not a sacred cow that must remain static. Poker's popularity has force the Main Event to mutate a lot, into a multiple day marathon. There is no debate today that the Main Event HAS TO be finished in one day, like it was in the past. :D There are too many players.As a businessman, I see in this move by Harrahs a desire to get a better handle on the WSOP Main Event. They want the time to plan promotion and coordinate publicity. This is a normal desire and the idea of a fresh, rested final table a few months down the line, with experts, stats, and the programing lined up is - from a film production point of view - is a serious goal. There is no question the show will be better.Will they make more money? :5cWell, I hope so. The reason they are keen on the event is that they see the potential of poker to make a lot of money. I want them to make a fortune because that is the best incentive for Harrahs to treat the WSOP carefully.Harrahs knows the fable of the goose that lays the golden eggs and has no intention of killing the WSOP goose. Frankly, the WSOP is a zoo now and the Main Event has become an endurance test.The "good old days" was few people taking the escalator up into the smoke-choked confines of Binion's second floor, cardboard scorecards tacked to the wall, and a 'long tournament" meant 30 hours, not 6 days. Those days are toast. The WSOP has had to adapt to the times and the player numbers, and this change is part of the process.Personally, I suspect that there are very real risks to Harrah's plan to delay the final table of the Main Event, and the debate is not over. Instinctively I know that with that kind of money swingin in the wind, Harrahs is asking for trouble with this delay, but let's try it out and see. :4h
I literally read this from the bottom to the top. I liked it.
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I literally read this from the bottom to the top. I liked it.
You wanna read it top to bottom, mate. It'll make more sense.Not read through the whole thread yet. Would be interesting to know what the veterans of the tournament think of this.Game's changing, though. No debating that :club:
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