Was Going To Try For The Blind Steal

[tj9422- 0]

PokerStars 0.02/0.04 Hold'em (8 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)Preflop: Hero is CO with 6, 5. 4 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls.Flop: (6 SB) 3, 7, 2(3 players)SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, SB folds, BB calls.Turn: (5 BB) 4(2 players)BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.River: (7 BB) K(2 players)Final Pot: 7 BB

[outsider13 0]

Obvious cooler. You couldn't play it any better.

[Zach6668 513]

fold preflop.

[tj9422- 0]

fold preflop.

I would most of the time but it seem like a good starting hand to try for a steal. It was from late position.

[Zach6668 513]

I noticed that.Fold preflop.65o is not a good hand to steal with.

[Poohdabear 0]

I thought the whole point of stealing is not to get caught. lolSeriously, you can't steal with 65o.I would only try to steal with this hand when I'm the CO poster and have already one SB in the pot and it's folded to me. Then I might try for a steal since it's one SB cheaper than under normal circumstances.

[Zach6668 513]

I would only try to steal with this hand when I'm the CO poster and have already one SB in the pot and it's folded to me. Then I might try for a steal since it's one SB cheaper than under normal circumstances.

If you post in the CO, and it folds to you, you should basically be raising any two cards.

[tj9422- 0]

I thought the whole point of stealing is not to get caught. lolSeriously, you can't steal with 65o.I would only try to steal with this hand when I'm the CO poster and have already one SB in the pot and it's folded to me. Then I might try for a steal since it's one SB cheaper than under normal circumstances.

If you post in the CO, and it folds to you, you should basically be raising any two cards.

I was the CO spot and it was with any 2 cards that I did raise with. Then I bet out the flop only for the draw. If the hand did not hit the turn I would have folded. This hand was only played for a steal. Not a good starting hand. The flop worked well for a draw , if it did not I would have folded. I was not going for a standard play.

[Zach6668 513]

I was the CO spot and it was with any 2 cards that I did raise with. Then I bet out the flop only for the draw. If the hand did not hit the turn I would have folded. This hand was only played for a steal. Not a good starting hand. The flop worked well for a draw , if it did not I would have folded. I was not going for a standard play.

Nope.I said if you are POSTING in the CO, you should open any two cards.This is correct because you've already got 1 bet in, so it's only 1 more bet to raise and steal. We're getting a much much better price to steal the blinds, AND that blind you posted is no longer yours, and you need to steal it back, so to speak.65o is not a blind stealing hand.If you really want to figure out which range to open with when folded to you in the CO, listen to me.This comes from 6-max theory, but blind steals are pretty similar in full ring, maybe tighten these up a little bit.The Attempt To Steal Blinds (ASB) stat in Pokertracker is useful for our purposes here. A number that is considered "ideal" is 40%. This means, from the CO, Button, and SB, when it's folded to us, we're opening 40%. In reality, that's not 40% at each position, but kinda weighted. We're going to open more hands on the button than the CO for obvious reasons. So say maybe 35% in the CO, 45% from the button, and like 40% from the SB. For our purposes, I'd probably roll those numbers back a bit, and try to end up with 35%, or so overall.So, what does that mean? What hands should we open with? Open up PokerStove (if you don't have it, get it, and don't tell me you're gonna do it later, or you're gonna download some useless product first instead of the program we suggest, or I'm done trying to help you).Within PokerStove, click "Player 1", then click the Preflop tab.Now, at the bottom, where you see the slider, on the right, type in 35, and tab out of that. Now, note the hands that turn purple. Those are the top 35% of the hands. Feel free to play with this, and see what the different ranges are for top 20%, top 30%, etc, as you'd like.Alternatively, you can click OK to get out of that screen, and now look at the Player One field, and it shows our range: "55+,A2s+,K3s+,Q6s+,J7s+,T7s+,97s+,87s,A4o+,K8o+,Q9o+,J9o+,T9o".Start by raising those hands in steal positions (CO, BTN, SB), when folded to.As you move away from these positions, you should be raising less and less, as we know. Your opening range in MP2 might be something more like 15% or 20%, and so, really tightening up by the time we get to UTG, where we should only be raising premiums, obviously.Moral of the story: Don't steal with trash. (Btw, play with that slider, until you see where 65o rates in terms of the top X% of hands... hint: it's in the top 71.6% of hands, meaning it's the 71.6th best hand, if we had 100 hands to start with. Clearly it's not a raise. If it was, we should also be raising hands like J5o, 73s, etc, which are all better starting hands, according to Stove.)

[RabidTortuga 0]

When they say, "if you post in the CO," they mean that you just sat down (or returned) to a game, the button just passed you, and you elect to post a big blind in the CO so that you will be dealt a hand, rather than waiting several hands for your actual BB. in that case, raising with any two cards is usually correct. When you have no money posted, such as this hand, you have to have some starting hand selection, and 65 offsuit definitely doesn't meet the criteria for stealing from the CO.I'm going to be harsh here, tj, because I believe you really want to learn the game.Why are you trying to make non-standard plays at .02/.04? Why are you trying to get fancy when you clearly haven't mastered, or even gotten a solid grasp of, the basic ABC strategy designed to beat loose passive low limit hold-em? Did you even read Small Stakes Hold-em yet? If so, do you understand it? Have you gone back and studied each chapter, and learned how and when to apply the concepts?Everything you need to beat .02/.04, .05/.10, .10/.20, .25/.50, and .50/1 is in the book. I can't speak for higher limits yet, but I know it holds true for these limits because I've used the knowledge in SSHE to beat the listed limits, and generally beat them well. All you have to do is follow the basic, ABC strategies listed there, including Starting Hand Selection, Pot-Odds and Implied Odds, Equity, and correct situational plays on each street, and you will crush the .02/.04 games. Crush them, seriously, to the tune of 4+ BB per 100 hands. I played over five-thousand hands at .02/.04 back when I deposited late last year, and ran at 9bb/100. I don't think I ever stole the blinds from the cutoff, unless I had a hand Small Stakes Hold-em recommended playing from late position. Not once, seriously, because I sat there with the book open in front of me, turned to the starting hand chart, and played ONLY those hands recommended, until I had a solid grasp of why the book makes those recommendations. Even now, having moved up to .50/1, I only rarely deviate from those charts, though I've studied several other books, made and read a bunch of posts, and thought long and hard about situations and hands I've played to understand when and why I should do so.You still focus on results, and therefore, you don't get any. Stop wasting your time and get to studying. Every time you play a session, go back into pokertracker and look at each hand youplayed. Compare it to the advice in SSHE, from starting hand selection to every decision on every street. Find out what's right, and what's wrong. Post questions about hands you can't figure out yourself, and LISTEN to the responses you are given. Learn what you are doing wrong, and think about why you continue to do it.Small Stakes Hold-em. Start thinking. Learn how to play ABC poker, and learn why ABC poker is generally correct. Don't even think about making non-standard plays until you've done that. How will you know? Well, for one, you won't be playing .02/.04 anymore.Why don't you analyze this hand for us, using poker concepts? It might teach you something. Heck, it might teach me something, and I'm always willing to learn more. It can only make me a better player.

[Zach6668 513]

^^ This is better advice than mine.Master the basics before you start expanding your stealing range. You need to be able to play postflop to steal with a wide range of hands.

[KoRnholio 2]

Blind steal should not even be in your vocabulary while playing microstakes.

[Frez 0]

Well done Rabid - taking the time to make a post like you did is what makes these forums so great.tj - take it to heart, he's right on all counts.

[tj9422- 0]

I'm going to be harsh here, tj, because I believe you really want to learn the game.

Rabidtortuga I want to thank you, You are right that i want to really learn the game. I do know this hand is a fold pre flop. but I played it as a steal and now I know that it was wrong. SSHE is the next book I am going to read. I put off reading SSHE because it was hard to give my full attention to it. (will let ever one know why soon)I just read:52 Great Poker Tips: At Home, Tournament and Online by Lou Krieger Which gave me a good mind set to basic poker. Quick read I just also got done with:Internet Texas Hold'em: Winning Strategies from an Internet Pro by Matthew Hilger Hilger works well for me easy reading. my .02/.04 stat are looking better since i read his book. looking foward to them sky rocketing after SSHE. Stats are:Total hands:11,265 VP$IP:33.27 BB/100:1.55 STARTED in NovNow after reading I was able to turn things around in FEBuary and march.Feb !,901 hands played 36.93 HR BB/hr 1.57 BB/100 3.05March 226 hands played 4.42 HR BB/hr 17.04 BB/100 33.30Now I know march is to short of a window to tell so far but It is an improvment. The point you are most wright with is that reading and studing will improve my game the most.Thanks again guys you all are going to but my game where it belongs.

[RabidTortuga 0]

VP$IP:33.27

Way too high. 20% is high in full ring, though acceptable, maybe even optimal, if you are very good postflop. Get down around 15% for starters.

[Zach6668 513]

SSHE is the next book I am going to read.

lol

[tj9422- 0]

SSHE is the next book I am going to read.

lol

Don't LOL Zach I started to read it but with everthing that was going on in my life I could not keep my mind on it. SSHE is a book i want to fully under stand and take in well. Now i have the time to do that . Again In a week or two I will post the reason why.

Way too high. 20% is high in full ring, though acceptable, maybe even optimal, if you are very good postflop. Get down around 15% for starters.

Rabidtortuga The VP$IP of 33.27 is from a lot of bad play. I started .02/.04 in Nov and still working out the bugs. VP$IP in Feb and March is more in the 15% to 20% range.

[Zach6668 513]

[opie 0]

I was the CO spot and it was with any 2 cards that I did raise with. Then I bet out the flop only for the draw. If the hand did not hit the turn I would have folded. This hand was only played for a steal. Not a good starting hand. The flop worked well for a draw , if it did not I would have folded. I was not going for a standard play.

Ignoring the preflop play which was covered by other posters, I do NOT think the flop worked well for a draw. You had an inside straight draw - only a 4 really helps you. Maybe a 5 or 6 too, but I think that unlikely.Simplifying things a bit: By the time the betting comes to you on the flop, there are 7 small bets in the pot (probably 6, since one goes to the rake). If you only call, you are getting 6-1 or 7-1 payout odds, but only 4 out of the 47 cards left in the deck help you, which is almost 12-1 odds. Getting paid 7-1 on a 12-1 longshot is NOT a good idea. But you raised. It can't be a bluff (do NOT bluff at microlimits - it just isn't worth it). Assuming your raise gets called, you put in 2 small bets hoping to win the other 8 bets in the pot - this is even worse. This is ignoring future bets you could win if you do hit, which helps some.It is a little more complicated. Best case, your opponent has 2 big cards and no pair yet, so a 5 or 6 also could help, meaning at MOST you have 10 outs that win for you (odds of 4.7 - 1 of hitting) The 4/5/6 diamonds may not help you - they could make a flush. Worst case you have 3 non-diamond 4's to win. Don't chase longshots without the proper odds in the pot to make it worthwhile.Peace,Opie

[tj9422- 0]

Ignoring the preflop play which was covered by other posters, I do NOT think the flop worked well for a draw. You had an inside straight draw - only a 4 really helps you. Maybe a 5 or 6 too, but I think that unlikely.Simplifying things a bit: By the time the betting comes to you on the flop, there are 7 small bets in the pot (probably 6, since one goes to the rake). If you only call, you are getting 6-1 or 7-1 payout odds, but only 4 out of the 47 cards left in the deck help you, which is almost 12-1 odds. Getting paid 7-1 on a 12-1 longshot is NOT a good idea. But you raised. It can't be a bluff (do NOT bluff at microlimits - it just isn't worth it). Assuming your raise gets called, you put in 2 small bets hoping to win the other 8 bets in the pot - this is even worse. This is ignoring future bets you could win if you do hit, which helps some.It is a little more complicated. Best case, your opponent has 2 big cards and no pair yet, so a 5 or 6 also could help, meaning at MOST you have 10 outs that win for you (odds of 4.7 - 1 of hitting) The 4/5/6 diamonds may not help you - they could make a flush. Worst case you have 3 non-diamond 4's to win. Don't chase longshots without the proper odds in the pot to make it worthwhile.Peace,Opie

I get your point. The bet on the flop was a follow up on the steal. Which was to try and push ever one to fold.The biggest thing that I see is wrong is that it was in micro limitsA new rule I made for myself is play ABC poker in micro limits and low limits.

[Zach6668 513]

This isn't a steal hand at higher limits either.People defend their blinds too liberally, and actually play reasonably well postflop at higher limits.This isn't a steal hand anywhere.

[tj9422- 0]

This isn't a steal hand at higher limits either.People defend their blinds too liberally, and actually play reasonably well postflop at higher limits.This isn't a steal hand anywhere. ,

After this post and some reading I can see the error of my ways

[longshottwelve 0]

The biggest thing that I see is wrong is that it was in micro limitsA new rule I made for myself is play ABC poker in micro limits and low limits.

Playing ABC poker is always "technically" correct. It's when you encounter certain individuals or scenarios where deviating from that becomes the most profitable option. Since most people playing at micro stakes are not aware of what's happening, not playing ABC poker is detrimental. But, it's not as if these type of players don't leak into higher limits.

[bigcoled 1]

basically no point in stealing blinds in 2/4 u're gonna get action...in this spot unwanted action for certain...

[Zach6668 513]

That's a stupid thing to say.Blind stealing is imperative in LHE.