Fire Carl Peterson: A Kc Chiefs Thread

[brvheart 1,752]

All I am saying is this. Alex Smith's YPA is bad, which makes me think it is unlikely he is good.

 

He doesn't pass the sniff test?

[brvheart 1,752]

I am unattractive, so hitting on me would be weird. Also you are not doing that. EVEN MORE WEIRD

 

I've seen you in that Elf costume. You're quite attractive.

[NickCave 194]

I give Alex credit. He was a complete bust for 5 seasons (partly due to the 49ers organization being a wreck) but he has developed into Chad Pennington. Could be worse.

 

Pennington was awesome, though. Noodle arm, noodle (injury resistance)

[NickCave 194]

He doesn't pass the sniff test?

 

No. The opposite.

[CaneBrain 95]

He doesn't pass the sniff test?

 

Or the playoff wins test or the "did he spend much of his career sucking" test. In addition to the YPA test.

 

Pennington was awesome, though. Noodle arm, noodle (injury resistance)

 

You watch, the parallels between the 2013 Chiefs and the 2009 Dolphins are striking.....right down to the hilariously easy schedule and the eventual severe beatdown in the playoffs at the hands of a good team.

[NickCave 194]

Or the playoff wins test or the "did he spend much of his career sucking" test. In addition to the YPA test.

 

 

 

You watch, the parallels between the 2013 Chiefs and the 2009 Dolphins are striking.....right down to the hilariously easy schedule and the eventual severe beatdown in the playoffs at the hands of a good team.

 

My gut says Pennington was an uber-accurate QB that couldn't stay healthy. That's all I was saying. (Also that my gut was right)

[NickCave 194]

Dammit, Alex Smith is no Chad Pennington.

[Dubey 1,035]

Yards per attempt is a great place to start. It shows that Romo has a lot of game. You also have to look at TDs, TD/INT ratio, playoff wins. That's where Romo starts to fall apart. Very talented headcase.

 

 

I know this is rich coming from a Romo fan/apologist and a Cowboys fan, but you can't talk about YPA and playoff wins in the same sentence when evaluating a QB.

 

 

That's like praising a pitcher's xFIP and then following it up with "If only his W/L record was better".

[CaneBrain 95]

Wholeheartedly disagree. Wins generally is a statistic that fluctuates based on team strength, luck and plenty of other factors. However, that doesn't mean how you play against top competition in pressurized situations is irrelevant. I like Romo but his penchant for gagging in December and January isn't made up. He makes way way too many big mistakes against the better teams when it counts. Advanced stats are a great tool but they aren't everything.

[Cha! Cha! 628]

But you shouldn't say playoff wins, you should say performance in playoff games.

[Dubey 1,035]

The 'Romo is a choker' dialogue is tired, played out, and factually incorrect. You are making a broad generalization based on what, like a 5 game sample size?

 

I can think of 2 games and situations where you could reasonably argue that he actually choked, and one was as a freaking place holder.

 

 

here, this guy says it better than I ever could:

 

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/nfl-myth-busting-tony-romo-and-the-dallas-cowboys-are-americas-chokers/23434/

[CaneBrain 95]

But you shouldn't say playoff wins, you should say performance in playoff games.

 

Fair enough.

[Cha! Cha! 628]

The 'Romo is a choker' dialogue is tired, played out, and factually incorrect. You are making a broad generalization based on what, like a 5 game sample size?

 

I'm with you on Romo. (Side note: one of the guys I follow on Twitter for basketball related stuff is always railing against narrative-based evaluation in basketball, but he also can't stop making Romo as Choker tweets. It's like when he steps outside his area of expertise he throws all his rules out the window.)

 

Anyway, I think it would be ok to deduct QB points for playing poorly in a very small sample of playoff games. You just don't want to say that he will therefore always perform poorly in playoff games. (I don't know Romo's actual playoff performance (I didn't read that article you linked)).

[CaneBrain 95]

Lol that article makes my point. Romo is generally underrated and underappreciated but you can't ignore that his worst performances seem to happen when it really matters. Even that author admits it. Football isn't a sport where you are going to get a ton of sample size like other sports so it is what it is. You can't ignore that romo disintegrating in week 17 is "like clockwork".

 

 

As an aside, I don't think the author is correct that Rivers gets a pass anymore.

 

I agree with Cha Cha that I won't generally assume Romo will blow his next big game. But I can't possibly put him on the Brady/Peyton/Rodgers level until he doesn't melt down in a big game. I can't see how that's unfair. Remember, I didn't say romo is a choker. I said that he melts down in December and January, which to date, is accurate.

[Dubey 1,035]

Nah I'm not putting him on the same level as Brady/Peyton/Rodgers.

 

 

I guess I just don't see the "melting down" aspect of it. His career record in December is mostly a result of Quality of competition, rather than him "melting down". For the most part, in his career, Tony Romo has been a good to very good quarterback working with an average to sometimes atrocious O-line and limited running game.

 

 

For the most part, Romo's cowboys have been pretty terrible teams, overall, bouyed to mediocrity by Romo's heroics. The only reason he has even gotten to those "big games" in week 17 is by carrying a crappy team to an 8-7 or 9-5 record. Looking back, you should expect his teams to lose most of those games.

 

 

Look at last year for an example. The offensive line was systematically terrible. His recievers were good, but prone to making rookie mistakes. By most accounts, they were a terrible team. They scraped and clawed their way to an 8-7 record, mostly by completing "clutch" 4th quarter comebacks (5 of them, I believe) in games they probably didn't deserve to win. Then they find themselves in a win or go home game in week 17 against a superior Redskins team. They should lose that game, and they did. Same old narratives about Romo get replayed a million times over and everything that he did to even get them there is forgotten.

[CaneBrain 95]

I'm not disagreeing with all of that but he has been terrible in those big games. You can't just wash it away. Aaron Rodgers offensive line has been a train wreck at times. Ditto Big Ben. Elite QBs seem to find a way, whereas romo, as you said, has merely vacillated between good and very good with some epic meltdowns.

 

I also don't think the cowboys have been terrible either. Mediocre is a far better description. Great at the glamour spots, weak in the trenches.

 

Sure, it's understandable they lose that skins game. But romo was abysmal, too.

[Dubey 1,035]

I agree with everything you wrote, except for "Epic Meltdowns". I don't think he has done anything in his career, as a quarterback (not counting the place holder fumble) that I owuld consider an "epic meltdown".

[Dubey 1,035]

also, I really need to follow this guy's advice

 

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/74592/do-yourself-a-favor-learn-how-to-stop-talking-about-tony-romo

 

 

(even though the article is just a thinly veiled excuse to talk about Tony Romo)

[Cha! Cha! 628]

Jared Dubin is a really good basketball writer and also a Cowboys fan.

[Dubey 1,035]

And he now holds a special place in my heart. Anyone that will risk his professional reputation to publicly go to bat for Tony Romo is awesome in my books.

[CaneBrain 95]

I don't even hold the place-holder thing against him. That's classic "bad timing, could have happened to anyone" stuff. Not to mention, who has their QB hold on kick attempts?

[SuperJon 175]

The Dolphins had Marino hold for Finkel.

[Essay21 2,385]

You mean Einhorn.

[Cha! Cha! 628]

[brvheart 1,752]

That has to at least be in the conversation for funniest scene ever, right? I rember laughin so hard at that entire sequence from the moment the dogs hair covers the picture to when he drives away muttering 'you gun is digging into my hip'.