Here's The Situation

[mase_gotsem 0]

in all honesty here if im your room mate and we as good a friends as you say i fold .. "softplay" in this spot but thats just me .i put friends/family b4 ethics might make me look bad but its the truth w/e ...BUTif i am in your situation i in no way mind his call especially after the fact i said we play str8 up . i say gg gl and move on 1k is just not enough money to get mad at a friend over especially after you say hes your "best" friend . id be disapointed to lose the race but id also be happy to the fact at least you lost it to a friend and not some donk you dont know .if he folds or softplays for you then yes it is collusion no matter how you look at it . soft playing is not the worst thing in the world but its def wrong and not a good thing to do .

[Vtlaxer09 4]

Promise this is the last post in here. I was upset when I started the thread. Alot of what you guys have said has made me take a much different perspective on the matter. Im a young player and I was put into a situation that noone wants to be in Im sure. I would never intentionally put myself into a position where I can potentially "collude" with a friend or any other player. I didnt ask for this and I realize that I was upset that he did not "soft play" me. I thought we approached the situation very maturely though my reaction to a standard play was somewhat less. I am over it. Im ready to move on. I've been on a great run and am really improving my game with a little bit of help and am thankful for the support I've had from this forum over the last few months. I will not be playing the daily doubles tonight. That is all.

[terradawg 0]

Promise this is the last post in here. I was upset when I started the thread. Alot of what you guys have said has made me take a much different perspective on the matter. Im a young player and I was put into a situation that noone wants to be in Im sure. I would never intentionally put myself into a position where I can potentially "collude" with a friend or any other player. I didnt ask for this and I realize that I was upset that he did not "soft play" me. I thought we approached the situation very maturely though my reaction to a standard play was somewhat less. I am over it. Im ready to move on. I've been on a great run and am really improving my game with a little bit of help and am thankful for the support I've had from this forum over the last few months. I will not be playing the daily doubles tonight. That is all.

well thought out, mature post. end thread.

[mase_gotsem 0]

any one think less of me for saying i wld slow play my best friend ?

[PokerKing 0]

First, if anyone says "collusion" I will punch them. I played the daily doubles last night. I finished 42nd in A and final tabled B. Another guy finished 28th in A and I busted him in 19th in B. Therefore his avg. best finish was 23.5. I needed to get top 4 to win the roughly 1050$ best finish jackpot, 5th to tie. My roommate also made the final table in B. This was actually the first time we were seated at the same table in the tournament. The avg. coming in was about 350k. I had roughly 450k and he had 210k, therefore we had not discussed trading a piece of ourselves yet etc. I was not at my house with him during this time.. I was over at a friend's but we had been chatting on aim and rooting each other on etc. When the bubble burst, he called me up... we wished each other luck, and I told him... "hey I wanna make sure we play this straight up... but obviously remember that I need top 4 to make another 1050 and we should probably just stay out of each other's way." FINAL TABLE BEGINS: He chips up quickly to 1.1 million chips and I had been blinded down to about 350,000 when this hand comes up. We are playing 6 handed.Full Tilt Poker Game #5392035336: Daily Double - B (40288685), Table 96 - 15000/30000 Ante 4000 - No Limit Hold'em - 2:46:49 ET - 2008/02/25Seat 1: fairhero (411,402)Seat 2: ROOMMATE (1,086,189)Seat 3: Gentle Assasain (833,176)Seat 6: ME (340,631)Seat 7: Realbigfsh (324,478)Seat 9: Topcheese (172,124)Topcheese posts the small blind of 15,000fairhero posts the big blind of 30,000The button is in seat #7*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to vtlaxer09 [Ad 9s]Roommate raises to 60,000Gentle Assasain foldsvtlaxer09 raises to 336,631, and is all inRealbigfsh foldsTopcheese foldsfairhero foldsRoommate has 15 seconds left to actRoommate has requested TIMEarfin (Observer): lolRoommate calls 276,631vtlaxer09 shows [Ad 9s]Roommate shows [Kh Qd]*** FLOP *** [6h 3c Qh]*** TURN *** [6h 3c Qh] [4d]*** RIVER *** [6h 3c Qh 4d] [Ks]LivesWithMommy (Observer): ggvtlaxer09 shows Ace King highRoommate shows two pair, Kings and QueensRoommate wins the pot (742,262) with two pair, Kings and Queensvtlaxer09 stands up*** SUMMARY ***Total pot 742,262 | Rake 0Board: [6h 3c Qh 4d Ks]Seat 1: fairhero (big blind) folded before the FlopSeat 2: Roommate showed [Kh Qd] and won (742,262) with two pair, Kings and QueensSeat 3: Gentle Assasain folded before the FlopSeat 6: vtlaxer09 showed [Ad 9s] and lost with Ace King highSeat 7: Realbigfsh (button) folded before the FlopSeat 9: Topcheese (small blind) folded before the FlopI bust in 6th... making 500$ and change... cool... Put yourself in this situation and tell me your thoughts. Im insanely pissed at him. He told me after that if i simply wrote in aim... "fold" that he would have... I thought it was just common sense that if you dont have AK AA or KK (along with a few other hands) that this should be an instant muck.If this was any other player he should have made the call. He's getting a decent price... but in this situation i find it to be completely unnessecary to call another 260k+ when you are never ever ahead and you have a very good stack. Please leave your thoughts... thank you.EDIT: Im going to add this to the OP I wrote the above very quickly while still very pissed about it all.(this is posted later in the thread)I've been a part of these forums for quite a while now and alot of you know me to be a very decent person and someone who loves poker. For those of you who dont know me too well... please dont be so quick to judge me and call me a cheater... because I am the oppositeI see all of your points as valid but let me clear up a few things. We did NOT share cards. I did NOT change the way i played. I did NOT expect him to change the way he would play other than.... In an iffy situation.... such as having KQ with 60k in.... a fold is not a terrible thing to do. Im never asking him to fold AK there or 1010... etc. etc. etc. IMO if you approach this issue with a clear cut "this is cheating and this isnt" attitude.. then you're taking the wrong approach. This isnt an online poker forum buddy of mine... this is my best friend and roommate who is always wanting me to do well... and likewise I want him to do well. Like i said.. i fold 100% of the time if I were him.Im pretty much over it... I understand where alot of you are coming from... and I really hope you can put yourselves in my shoes and try to understand. I understand his call and Im a little upset about the hand (moreso that I cant ever win a 60/40) but more or less i just felt like he should have folded. (I understand this is the poker table... but seriously people try and see things from my side) I didnt have to post this situation here but I thought it would make for a good thread seeing as how general has been slightly lacking as of late. I wanted your honest opinions... not snide remarks. I got a few of each and I thank those of you that contributed something.It was a very very very unusual circumstance.. one that I had never been in before. In my opinion I handled it fine. I played exactly how I would have played it. I really dont think that expecting a fold out of my roommate constitutes me being a cheater. Thank you,AG

If u can't handel the game leave. Oh ya KQ is the the Nut Diggities.Since you only had an Ace, King and Queen high are a 72%-5% Favorite to hold up.

[Sportsmack 0]

well thought out, mature post. end thread.

This thread is not over until Mercury and Roomie go HU for all the marbles.

[antistuff 0]

any one think less of me for saying i wld slow play my best friend ?

not me. but, for the love of god, admit that its cheating like you did.

[RDog 0]

L O L. I have only read a few responses but I love the backtrack in even the original post after Looshious hit the nail on the head.

[Sportsmack 0]

any one think less of me for saying i wld tea bag my best friend ?

[nockerts 0]

If he wins the 60/40, this thread doesn't even exist. Not only is he not pissed off at his roommate, but owes him head.

[WhatArunAA 0]

L O L. I have only read a few responses but I love the backtrack in even the original post after Looshious hit the nail on the head.

I guess I dont see why a post like this is necessary...hes admitting he made a mistake.. and even though he didn't realize it then he does now...but im glad you are contributing to the general welfare of the forum.

[RDog 0]

him(2:24:47 AM): yeh but we need to play the final table str8 uphim (2:24:50 AM): just avoid each otherme (2:25:03 AM): thats finem (2:25:07 AM): your not telling me any hands?m (2:25:13 AM): orm (2:25:21 AM): what ?h (2:25:45 AM): yeh i meanh (2:25:46 AM): thats cheatingh(2:25:49 AM): i dont wanna get ****edm (2:25:50 AM): okm (2:25:52 AM): fine by meh (2:25:58 AM): just obvisouly avoid each otherh (2:26:04 AM): if u wanna say AA!h (2:26:05 AM): gtfoh (2:26:08 AM): go aheadh (2:26:13 AM): but no chip dumping at allLOL. I bolded the parts that very clearly show your moral compass is off. The only shit you were worried about is playing straight up just enough that you didn't get CAUGHT. Plain and simple. Because in about 3 instances there you make decisions to collude........but just not enough to get caught. Then you want him to fold to you while saying that he should be calling everyone else at the table. Meh.......this thread pretty much confirms what I already knew.

[ah2388 0]

im gay

[James D 0]

Meh.......this thread pretty much confirms what I already knew.

What... that ah2388 is gay?

[antistuff 0]

im gay

me too. lets bang.

[RDog 0]

I guess I dont see why a post like this is necessary...hes admitting he made a mistake.. and even though he didn't realize it then he does now...but im glad you are contributing to the general welfare of the forum.

LOL, the only reason he admitted he made a mistake is because of the way everyone came down on him. I seriously doubt he thinks any of what he did was wrong.But next time I will make sure I run my posts by you to make sure I am contributing to the welfare of the forum first.

[mase_gotsem 0]

id tea bag in a heart beat @@@

[king_tanner 84]

I skipped pages 3-6 so I might be repeating what someone else is saying.At a final table of a tournament there is no way I would have someone I know (even if it was a family member) avoid me, because I could possibly be cheating him out of money just to make more money for myself... that's wrong in my opinion. I have been guilty though of avoiding friends in cash games before, I would just not pull ridiculous bluffs on them like I would to someone else at the table. I think DN wrote or talked about this a while ago, how he pulled a bluff on Evelyn Ng a long time ago and she got super pissed at him (don't remember the exact details). But the more experience myself and my friends have gained playing, we actually enjoy bluffing each other so this situation doesn't come up anymore.

[TB17 0]

RDog you've been cutting up everyone for like a month now, is everything cool?Serious q, you seem angry at the world lately lol

[WhatArunAA 0]

LOL, the only reason he admitted he made a mistake is because of the way everyone came down on him. I seriously doubt he thinks any of what he did was wrong.But next time I will make sure I run my posts by you to make sure I am contributing to the welfare of the forum first.

k good

[PokerKing 0]

I skipped pages 3-6 so I might be repeating what someone else is saying.At a final table of a tournament there is no way I would have someone I know (even if it was a family member) avoid me, because I could possibly be cheating him out of money just to make more money for myself... that's wrong in my opinion. I have been guilty though of avoiding friends in cash games before, I would just not pull ridiculous bluffs on them like I would to someone else at the table. I think DN wrote or talked about this a while ago, how he pulled a bluff on Evelyn Ng a long time ago and she got super pissed at him (don't remember the exact details). But the more experience myself and my friends have gained playing, we actually enjoy bluffing each other so this situation doesn't come up anymore.

I think she is right.

[antistuff 0]

I think she is right.

its official. the kings are in agreement. lets gather the whole court together in celebration.

[GrinderMJ 0]

I didn't read all of pages 3-4 but holy cow. How did nobody comment on the fact that dude posted an aim discussion where he asks if they are going to share hole cards? I mean forget the other side of this (Vtlaxer way in the wrong, despite being a nice guy) this fbonacci character is completely willing to card share with his friends at a FT any time.

[GWCGWC 83]

Rdog/Whatarunna HU for 5K! gogogogogogogogogogo

any one think less of me for saying i wld slow play my best friend ?

Raises hand but I'll forget who said it tomorrow. If you don't verbalize/communicate/premeditate the soft play then it's not REALLY soft playing.

[GWCGWC 83]

I didn't read all of pages 3-4 but holy cow. How did nobody comment on the fact that dude posted an aim discussion where he asks if they are going to share hole cards? I mean forget the other side of this (Vtlaxer way in the wrong, despite being a nice guy) this fbonacci character is completely willing to card share with his friends at a FT any time.

He readily admits his ethics are questionable at best in his first post.This shouldn't surprise anyone and I doubt FTP would notice even if another player asked them to review the HH's.