gobears 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Only other hand with villain, I raised from MP with 88 and he called from the BB with KQs. Villain lead weakly on flop of Js5s5d and called a raise by me. We then checked it down after Jack on turn and Queen on River.PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t2500 (9 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)Hero (t37980)BB (t56850)UTG (t54850)UTG+1 (t22018)MP1 (t66031)MP2 (t110839)MP3 (t50449)CO (t106271)Button (t71177)Preflop: Hero is SB with 6, 6. 3 folds, MP2 raises to t10000, 3 folds, Hero?My image is fairly tight as I've been mostly card dead at this table - only hand I showed down was the 88 hand in about four orbits. I was snapped off once and I also snapped someone else off. Villain has opened quite a few pots but this was the first time he opened up 4xBB.What's your play? Link to post Share on other sites
Cappy37 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 He's not likely to fold PF if you put him all-in, considering stack sizes, and there isn't a whole bunch he turns over that isn't a coin flip.I'd be willing to bet dollars to donuts you flat-called him, and used FE and Position (i.e. being first into the pot) to stop-and-go the flop, since that's the only time he's even thinking of folding here.Of course, he could potentially fold to your push PF if he's got far less of a hand than we should give him credit for, so I'd love to hear your (and other's) thoughts on this. It's a shame you didn't have more chips, because this is the kind of villain I'm guessing you would love to play post flop with. Link to post Share on other sites
HangukMiguk 8 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 obv he plays AK AQ and AJs this way, but does he play other overs this way?If not, fold, there's not too much you're playing against that you're in a coin flip with.If he does/possibly does. Call pre-flop, push a safe flop, c/f otherwise.Trying to push him out PF is just so -ev it makes the baby jesus cry.Very likely in mid position that he could be raising suited overs, though. Link to post Share on other sites
BeaverStyle 1 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Stop-n-go FTW.... I don't mind folding preflop... his 4x raise to me signifies a hand he's not looking to fold.Stop-n-go, or wait for a better spot. Link to post Share on other sites
simo_8ball 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 I fold this pretty quickly. I'm not sure what his range is, but I'm pretty certain it's a range you're reasonably behind. Link to post Share on other sites
gobears 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Author Share Posted January 21, 2008 I took out AA-QQ out of his range since I figured he would have fired his normal 3xBB raise or less if he had a monster. Pot odds if I shoved were 1.9-1 for villain but I thought that I had some FE since I hadn't seem him go all-in preflop yet.I considered the stop-n-go but it's not a move that I like anymore - just seems transparent these days.I shoved, he insta-called with AJs (at least take a few seconds to think about it...), there was an ace on the flop and I was done. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Fold-o.I think the Stop n Go is really, really dumb unless you are putting the OTHER guy at risk, rather than yourself66 OOP is a horrible hand to call with. Way too many flops screw you over and you have no clue what the villain has. It's either AIPF or fold, with fold being the clearest and bestest choice, partly due to your read that he's going to cal you down with almost anything. This close to the money, I think you can afford to let go of your SB and move along. Link to post Share on other sites
throwemaway 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Fold-o.I think the Stop n Go is really, really dumb unless you are putting the OTHER guy at risk, rather than yourself66 OOP is a horrible hand to call with. Way too many flops screw you over and you have no clue what the villain has. It's either AIPF or fold, with fold being the clearest and bestest choice, partly due to your read that he's going to cal you down with almost anything. This close to the money, I think you can afford to let go of your SB and move along.lol wow Link to post Share on other sites
Sheiky 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Meh, i thought this was a pretty standard fold, not sure why everyone's talking about stop and go's and such. Link to post Share on other sites
Cappy37 0 Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 Meh, i thought this was a pretty standard fold, not sure why everyone's talking about stop and go's and such.Post flop is the only time he's going to lay down at all in this spot. Still makes it a horrible play, but that's the only reason to even consider it.Mercury and Simo pretty much hit the nail on the head with their view of the AIPF line. It's a billion times easier to just let go of the small blind this close to the money. We don't fare too well against MP2's range here. Link to post Share on other sites
NEtwowilldo 0 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Fold.Also stop n go's in general are stupid. If you get him to fold a better hand like 88 on an AK 9 flop, then you turned your hand into a bluff, so you might as well do it with any two. It's pretty obvious when you're doing it, and I don't fold to them as much as others. I make a lot of hero calls in obvious stop n go spots. In the case where you think he has AK, and you want to see a non AK flop, you're giving up equity in the hand. (which by the way is not the case here) So in general I just dont use that play in my arsenal.There is pretty much no hand we're beating here. His range is 88-QQ IMO, he's not folding to a shove.Also, check out my new blog below. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 lol wowjokaments lawl...surely you could be pointing out some of the more flagrant abusers of the English language :-) Link to post Share on other sites
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