The Goose Is In

[digitalmonkey 929]

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/news_story/?ID=226764&hubname=

[eYank 0]

:D

[Tactical Bear 3]

I don't know if I like the trend of relievers getting into the Hall (Bruce Sutter?), but Gossage is the best choice of the bunch. He threw a ton of innings, so I can get on board.Good: No Jim RiceBad: No BlylevenNot sure of the #s on Raines, but I hope he gets a good chunk so he gains momentum

[aadams_22 3]

glad he got in he definitely deserves itbut so do:Jim RiceBert BlylevenTommy JohnAndre DawsonTim RainesHarold Bainesand a few others I'm probably forgettingalso it's becoming more and more apparent that some of these writers need their votes stripped from themaround 40-50 didn't even bother to turn in their ballots...also how the hell do Travis Fryman and Rod Beck recieve votesthe entire system needs to be revamped

[MDXS 0]

I don't know if I like the trend of relievers getting into the Hall (Bruce Sutter?), but Gossage is the best choice of the bunch. He threw a ton of innings, so I can get on board.Good: No Jim RiceBad: No BlylevenNot sure of the #s on Raines, but I hope he gets a good chunk so he gains momentum

Agreed on relievers.Agreed on Rice (out of late 70's Red Sox outfielders, he'd probably be my fourth choice for HOF)Blyleven not in is of course, ridiculous, but he's gaining quickly and I expect him to make it.Raines only got 24.3%. Retarded. He's as good as Tony Gwynn and miles better than Lou Brock (A similar-type player who I'm sure many of those voting against Raines would say is a clear-cut HOFer). When Henderson comes on the ballot, I expect Raines' numbers won't improve much at all, since as deserving as he is, he's no Rickey.Here's a question: if Dennis Martinez pitched a World Series Game 7 shutout, would he be knocking on the Hall's door? Cause that's what the voters are telling me.

[MDXS 0]

glad he got in he definitely deserves itbut so do:Jim RiceBert BlylevenTommy JohnAndre DawsonTim RainesHarold Bainesand a few others I'm probably forgettingalso it's becoming more and more apparent that some of these writers need their votes stripped from themaround 40-50 didn't even bother to turn in their ballots...also how the hell do Travis Fryman and Rod Beck recieve votesthe entire system needs to be revamped

Hey, we mostly agree! Nice.

[aadams_22 3]

Hey, we mostly agree! Nice.

doesn't happen often...enjoy it

[TMoneyBags 0]

sadly this means that Jim Rice will be elected next year with Ricky, along with Bert being snubbed for the 12th year.

[Solodell 0]

glad he got in he definitely deserves itbut so do:Jim RiceBert BlylevenTommy JohnAndre DawsonTim RainesHarold Bainesand a few others I'm probably forgettingalso it's becoming more and more apparent that some of these writers need their votes stripped from themaround 40-50 didn't even bother to turn in their ballots...also how the hell do Travis Fryman and Rod Beck recieve votesthe entire system needs to be revamped

hmm....pretty much agree, just not sure about Harold Baines. Maybe I just don't really remember his prime.

[7s7c 0]

Sutter had 5- top 10 MVP finishes I believe, that's pretty impressive for a reliever.I don't think Trevor Hoffman should ever get in the HOF. He's Armando Benitez only with better regular season numbers. Who didn't think he wasn't blowing that save in the one game playoff vs Colorado?

[eYank 0]

Whats your opinions on Mattingly? I dont think he will ever get in, he had some great years but back problems ended his career early

[TMoneyBags 0]

Sure Hoffman's numbers aren't that different than Armando's if you're looking at a couple of numbers (ERA?). Hoffman's numbers aren't that much worse, or better, than Rivera's if you look further. With relief pitcher with over 500 career innings, Hoffman ranks third in WHIP with a 1.049 behind Wagner and Rivera, third in SO/BB behind Wagner and Foulke, and second in allowing inherited runners score, behind only Eric Gagne (which to me makes up for his disappointing ERA, ERA+)According to the B-R player similarity scores, Hoffman's top comp is Rivera, with tenth being Armando.And Mattingly does not have a chance. Nor should he.

[7s7c 0]

Sure Hoffman's numbers aren't that different than Armando's if you're looking at a couple of numbers (ERA?). Hoffman's numbers aren't that much worse, or better, than Rivera's if you look further. With relief pitcher with over 500 career innings, Hoffman ranks third in WHIP with a 1.049 behind Wagner and Rivera, third in SO/BB behind Wagner and Foulke, and second in allowing inherited runners score, behind only Eric Gagne (which to me makes up for his disappointing ERA, ERA+)

He's a closer. Would you want him closing a game 7?

[TMoneyBags 0]

No doubt. Well perhaps I will take me some Joe Nathan now.

[timwakefield 68]

No doubt. Well perhaps I will take me some Papelbon now.

[MDXS 0]

Whats your opinions on Mattingly? I dont think he will ever get in, he had some great years but back problems ended his career early

Joe Sheehan from BP had a good (and free!) article today, talking about Jim Rice. He brought up Mattingly as a player with a similar career shape. He feels Rice has the stronger case, but neither are qualified for the Hall.

[Shimmering Wang 1]

Sure Hoffman's numbers aren't that different than Armando's if you're looking at a couple of numbers (ERA?). Hoffman's numbers aren't that much worse, or better, than Rivera's if you look further. With relief pitcher with over 500 career innings, Hoffman ranks third in WHIP with a 1.049 behind Wagner and Rivera, third in SO/BB behind Wagner and Foulke, and second in allowing inherited runners score, behind only Eric Gagne (which to me makes up for his disappointing ERA, ERA+)According to the B-R player similarity scores, Hoffman's top comp is Rivera, with tenth being Armando.And Mattingly does not have a chance. Nor should he.

I've never heard anybody say/write this before, but comparing ERA+ for relievers (especially CLOSERS) in the NL to pitchers in the AL is misleading. The LgERA in the NL is always going to be lower, obviously, because there's no DH, and the pitcher hits in the 9-hole 2 or 3 times a game. Except, duh, there's no way Hoffman's going to be throwing his retarded changeup to Chris Carpenter or something. He is ONLY going to face real hitters, and therefore the adjustment made will punish NL relievers (again, ESPECIALLY CLOSERS, who throw almost all of their innings when their team is ahead late).I could probably figure out how much Hoffman has suffered compared to Rivera, but I don't want to. Has anyone read an article on this before? Or does anybody see some kind of horribly obvious flaw in my logic here?

He's a closer. Would you want him closing a game 7?

Kind of a loaded question. I'd rather have Pedro closing a Game 7 than anybody, but I assume that's not a fair answer.If we're going to allow closers into the HoF, and if we're going to use Saves as some kind of benchmark (even though it's arbitrary and silly), then the career saves leader should get in, especially since he was, like, significantly better than Lee Smith. (ERA+ about 15 points better, WHIP 2 tenths of a point lower) Hoffman's numbers compare very favorably with other relievers in the hall (Sutter, Gossage), and he and Rivera were definitely the closers that defined a generation. Wagner might have an argument (no more numbers for me, fingers hurt, too much Nyquil and may be hallucinating), too, if he keeps it up.Wang

[TMoneyBags 0]

ERA is so flawed for relievers, I hardly even pay any attention to it anyway. It's a little bit nicer for today's closers since they many times start an inning rather than coming into a difficult situation.But I do see your logic. I like logic.

[eYank 0]

Joe Sheehan from BP had a good (and free!) article today, talking about Jim Rice. He brought up Mattingly as a player with a similar career shape. He feels Rice has the stronger case, but neither are qualified for the Hall.

I agree, I think that if Donnie had a few more years hed be in, but back problems killed the latter years of his career

[phlegm 6]

Is eddie Gaedel in ??