Ohio State Buckeyes

[Jadaki 0]

That's what happens when you have to play more than one decent opponent all season.

You're an idiot.Oregon State (you know the team that beat USC) got owned 45-14 by PSU, speaking of which isn't the SEC only 1-1 against the Pac-10 this year and they haven't had anyone play USC.Ohio State on the roadIllinois (another top 20 team, was #9 when they played) and they beat them by more than one of those all powerful Big-12 schools did.And they still have...Iowa on the roadMichigan State (top20)It's not PSU's fault that Michigan and Wisconsin are having bad years while MN and NW are having good years and they don't play them this year. But yea, one "tough game" all year.

[SGFULTON83 0]

You can't hold PSU accountable for OSU's last two title game appearances just because they are in the same conference which is what all you SEC/Big-12 fanboys keep trying to do.SOS is overrated because it's not like schedules are made up at the beginning of the season, they are done years in advance and you can't predict how good or bad an opponent is going to be in 4 years. TT jumping PSU in the BCS is a joke when 2 of the 3 polls have PSU ahead of them. Not to mention TT won on a last second play at home. That tells me on a neutral field or at Texas, they probably lose. If they would have blown Texas out that's one thing, but they didn't. The worst part is they had the chance to but couldn't finish it off. Of course this is the same TT team that had to go to OT to beat a shitty Nebraska team earlier this year at home.I'm not worried about your senario, Alabama (@ LSU, Auburn & Florida in SEC title game left) and TT (OSU and @ Oklahoma the next two weeks + a title game) are probably both going to lose. What I'm waiting for is if PSU finishes the year undefeated you guys are going to be crying that two 1 loss teams should be in the title game over them.

If Penn State goes undefeated I think they should play in the national title game. I'm not one of "those guys" you are talking about here, as I think if you go undefeated in a major conference you should play for the national title. Just deciding the 1-loss team that is going to play Penn State is where the biggest complication is going to come in. I also think whoever plays Penn State will be favored heavily for the above stated reasons. Big 10 needs a championship game to make the conference more interesting on a national level IMO. I'm not saying Big 10 sucks, as they have some of the best games week in and week out, but currently they are at a disadvantage for not having a title game whether its fair or not.

[Jadaki 0]

If Penn State goes undefeated I think they should play in the national title game. I'm not one of "those guys" you are talking about here, as I think if you go undefeated in a major conference you should play for the national title. Just deciding the 1-loss team that is going to play Penn State is where the biggest complication is going to come in. I also think whoever plays Penn State will be favored heavily for the above stated reasons. Big 10 needs a championship game to make the conference more interesting on a national level IMO. I'm not saying Big 10 sucks, as they have some of the best games week in and week out, but currently they are at a disadvantage for not having a title game whether its fair or not.

The PAC-10 doesn't have one either.The conferences that do have them added them because they wanted to make more money. The side effect to this was that now that the BCS is in play that game has either been a SOS booster with a quality win, or they are submitted to double jeopardy where they can play a team that they already beat, lose and have it cost them dearly in bowl seeding.I can see why conferences that have them want everyone else too, I can also see why conferences that don't have them don't want to add them. Don't expect the Big-10 to add one unless they get a 12th team, and the only teams I've heard they are interested in are ND, Pitt and WVU. Since it would be hard to get Pitt or WVU because of current conference affiliations, that leaves ND who isn't likely to want to give up all the money they get from NBC or the nice little agreement they have with the BCS. That and do you really think ND would give up games against the service academies to have to play the rest of a major conference every year. Unlikely.And yea, if it's PSU and a bunch of 1 loss teams, thats going to be an interested debate that I think Florida is leading right now.

[KowboyKoop 0]

You're an idiot.Oregon State (you know the team that beat USC) got owned 45-14 by PSU, speaking of which isn't the SEC only 1-1 against the Pac-10 this year and they haven't had anyone play USC.Ohio State on the roadIllinois (another top 20 team, was #9 when they played) and they beat them by more than one of those all powerful Big-12 schools did.And they still have...Iowa on the roadMichigan State (top20)It's not PSU's fault that Michigan and Wisconsin are having bad years while MN and NW are having good years and they don't play them this year. But yea, one "tough game" all year.

I like how you call me an idiot, and then use a two game sample size to try to compare conferences. Yeah, noone in the SEC has played USC. No one in the Pac-10 has played Alabama or Florida. Guess I win.Oregon St. is not good. Illinois is not good. Iowa is definitely not good. Michigan St., maybe. Penn St. only plays one good team this year. SEC and Big 12 teams clearly play way tougher schedules.If Penn St. is the only undefeated team, no, I won't be saying two one-loss teams should be in the NC game, but I will be expecting them to get beat...b/c they simply aren't as good as the top SEC and Big 12 teams. It's not PSU's fault..nobody said it is. The conference is just very mediocre this year.

[BigDMcGee 3,352]

If Tech runs the table, beating Okla, Ok State, then ( presumably) missouri in the Big 12 championship, they will 100 percent jump penn state. As they should

[KowboyKoop 0]

You can't hold PSU accountable for OSU's last two title game appearances just because they are in the same conference which is what all you SEC/Big-12 fanboys keep trying to do.SOS is overrated because it's not like schedules are made up at the beginning of the season, they are done years in advance and you can't predict how good or bad an opponent is going to be in 4 years. TT jumping PSU in the BCS is a joke when 2 of the 3 polls have PSU ahead of them. Not to mention TT won on a last second play at home. That tells me on a neutral field or at Texas, they probably lose. If they would have blown Texas out that's one thing, but they didn't. The worst part is they had the chance to but couldn't finish it off. Of course this is the same TT team that had to go to OT to beat a shitty Nebraska team earlier this year at home.I'm not worried about your senario, Alabama (@ LSU, Auburn & Florida in SEC title game left) and TT (OSU and @ Oklahoma the next two weeks + a title game) are probably both going to lose. What I'm waiting for is if PSU finishes the year undefeated you guys are going to be crying that two 1 loss teams should be in the title game over them.

SOS is overrated, huh? Yeah, that's what I'd expect to hear from a Big 10 fan. Yeah, running up the score against weak teams is just as impressive as having to actually play good or at least decent teams on a regular basis. Yeah, okay. Nobody is saying it's the school's fault entirely...but it's clearly a factor. TT jumping PSU isn't a joke, it's exactly what should've happened.

[BigDMcGee 3,352]

TT jumping PSU isn't a joke, it's exactly what should've happened.

To play devil's advocate, Tech has only had one really tough opponent this season also. The difference is they have 3 more on their schedule.

[Jadaki 0]

SOS is overrated, huh? Yeah, that's what I'd expect to hear from a Big 10 fan. Yeah, running up the score against weak teams is just as impressive as having to actually play good or at least decent teams on a regular basis. Yeah, okay. Nobody is saying it's the school's fault entirely...but it's clearly a factor. TT jumping PSU isn't a joke, it's exactly what should've happened.

Remember a couple years ago when Michigan lost the game at OSU by a couple points at the end of the season and they were ranked 1/2, and was still ranked number 2 but eventually got leapfrogged by Urban "the whiner" Meyer, wanna guess who had a stronger SOS that year. Michigan did.Funny how SEC wants to use SOS this year, but when it works against them they ignore it.

[KowboyKoop 0]

To play devil's advocate, Tech has only had one really tough opponent this season also. The difference is they have 3 more on their schedule.

That's fair, I can agree with that. If TT had been #3 in the BCS this week, I don't think that would've been that unfair.

[KowboyKoop 0]

Remember a couple years ago when Michigan lost the game at OSU by a couple points at the end of the season and they were ranked 1/2, and was still ranked number 2 but eventually got leapfrogged by Urban "the whiner" Meyer, wanna guess who had a stronger SOS that year. Michigan did.Funny how SEC wants to use SOS this year, but when it works against them they ignore it.

Oh, you mean the coach of Florida was trying to argue that his team should get a national title shot in that situation? Oh man..guess you got me there.What is he supposed to say? "Oh, no, we don't deserve it, please..don't vote for us, we don't want to play for the national title." WEAK.

[Jadaki 0]

Oh, you mean the coach of Florida was trying to argue that his team should get a national title shot in that situation? Oh man..guess you got me there.What is he supposed to say? "Oh, no, we don't deserve it, please..don't vote for us, we don't want to play for the national title." WEAK.

Way to ignore the SOS part of the post, thanks for proving my point.

[CindyLou 11]

Regarding the rankings and all that...With equal records, do you put more emphasis on the wins or on the losses? What I mean is this: Team A is 10-1. They beat three top 15 teams, including one top 5 team. They lost to an unranked, under .500 opponent.Team B is also 10-1. They only have one win against a top 15 team and none against a top 5, but their only loss was to a the #1 team in the country. Let's assume the balance of their schedules are equal.Which team would you rank higher?

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Regarding the rankings and all that...With equal records, do you put more emphasis on the wins or on the losses? What I mean is this: Team A is 10-1. They beat three top 15 teams, including one top 5 team. They lost to an unranked, under .500 opponent.Team B is also 10-1. They only have one win against a top 15 team and none against a top 5, but their only loss was to a the #1 team in the country. Let's assume the balance of their schedules are equal.Which team would you rank higher?

Whichever one's in the SEC. -Koop

[KowboyKoop 0]

Way to ignore the SOS part of the post, thanks for proving my point.

Great, Michigan had the better SOS. Okay great. You talked about Urban Meyer whining about it...and I said what else is he supposed to say?? Of course he's gonna talk about why his team deserves the berth. Your post had no point. Unless you can find ME saying that SOS doesn't matter in that situation but it does matter now..then you have no point. I don't represent all SEC fans. There are stupid SEC fans and stupid Big 10 fans and the one guy who is a Big Sky fan, he's probably stupid too.Contrary to what you may think, I don't just automatically say the SEC is the best all the time. I am talking about this season and the Big 10 being weak. You are the only trying to talk about the past ten years and using two game sample sizes to compare conferences...while pointing out that the SEC didn't play USC..and not mentioning that the Pac-10 teams haven't played 'Bama or Florida, the top two SEC teams.

[Jadaki 0]

Contrary to what you may think, I don't just automatically say the SEC is the best all the time. I am talking about this season and the Big 10 being weak. You are the only trying to talk about the past ten years and using two game sample sizes to compare conferences...while pointing out that the SEC didn't play USC..and not mentioning that the Pac-10 teams haven't played 'Bama or Florida, the top two SEC teams.

Your the one arguing using a 2 game sample size (last two bcs title games) when in the bigger picture, the SEC has not been clearly better than everyone the entire time they claim to have been. The SEC has 1 more team in the title hunt right now than the Big-10, the rest of the conference is mediocre to average. Georgia can't get up for a big game to save it's life and LSU needs a QB before they will do anything significant and those are the two other teams that are currently rounding out the top 4 of the SEC.No one is stopping Bama or FL from making a trip to USC. At least GA knows what a road trip to another BCS school looks like. FL hasn't played a OOC road game since like 91. And Bama hasn't been relevant since 92, so I'm not going to look it up but I'm willing to bet I can count their OOC road games since then on 1 hand.

[KowboyKoop 0]

Your the one arguing using a 2 game sample size (last two bcs title games) when in the bigger picture, the SEC has not been clearly better than everyone the entire time they claim to have been. The SEC has 1 more team in the title hunt right now than the Big-10, the rest of the conference is mediocre to average. Georgia can't get up for a big game to save it's life and LSU needs a QB before they will do anything significant and those are the two other teams that are currently rounding out the top 4 of the SEC.No one is stopping Bama or FL from making a trip to USC. At least GA knows what a road trip to another BCS school looks like. FL hasn't played a OOC road game since like 91. And Bama hasn't been relevant since 92, so I'm not going to look it up but I'm willing to bet I can count their OOC road games since then on 1 hand.

Find where I said that the SEC is better than the Big 10 only because Ohio St. lost two games over the last two seasons. Please show me that. It's a point I can use to criticize the Big 10, but it has nothing to do with the Big 10 vs. SEC this year. This entire time, I've been talking about 2008. You are the one bringing up past seasons.Just because some SEC fans claim the SEC to always be the best doesn't mean I feel that way. Again..show me where I've said that the SEC is always the best. I'm talking about 2008. How many times do I need to say this?? The SEC is obviously better than the Big 10 this year...it's obvious. The SEC vs. Big 12, that's debatable. I'd still argue that people simply overrate the great offenses and underestimate the great defenses..just like all the talk when Bama played Texas Tech in the Cotton Bowl a few seasons ago...all I heard was how TT's offense was unstoppable and blah blah blah..then the game started and we completely manhandled their offense the entire game until the referee missed a blatant fumble and handed them one TD. As for Bama's out of conference schedule..well, we played then #9 Clemson on a neutral field this year. We played at Florida State last year. At Hawaii a few years ago. At Oklahoma in 2002. At Hawaii again in 2002. At UCLA in 2000. Michigan on a neutral field in 1999. At NC State in 1996. It's not like we never play out of conference games of significance. Yeah, the SEC schedules a lot of cupcakes..just like pretty much everyone else. This still has nothing to do with strength of the conferences. The SEC teams know that their schedules are tough enough..no need for us to go out and schedule a huge game every single year on the road just to try and gain favor with the computers.

[Jadaki 0]

So you are saying you never said anything about not wanting to see a Big-10 team in the title game again wasn't a reference to OSU's performance in the last two BCS title games?I also love how you rant about only talking about this year, then go directly into a TT/Bama game from years ago. Way to flip flop when it's convenient again...Big-12 crushes the SEC this year, it's not close. They have 4 teams capable of competing for a national title this yea, SEC has two.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

I'll sum this up for you, guys.. The Big Ten is the third best conference in the nation and the SEC is the second best, though it is not as good this year is at has been in past years. Also, Ohio State's performance in the last two National Championship games is not an indicator year in and year out as to how good the Big Ten is as an overall conference. /discussion

[rocketpoker828 0]

I'll sum this up for you, guys.. The Big Ten is the third best conference in the nation and the SEC is the second best, though it is not as good this year is at has been in past years. Also, Ohio State's performance in the last two National Championship games is not an indicator year in and year out as to how good the Big Ten is as an overall conference. /discussion

Thank you Erik.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Thank you Erik.

That's why I come here.

[KowboyKoop 0]

So you are saying you never said anything about not wanting to see a Big-10 team in the title game again wasn't a reference to OSU's performance in the last two BCS title games?I also love how you rant about only talking about this year, then go directly into a TT/Bama game from years ago. Way to flip flop when it's convenient again...Big-12 crushes the SEC this year, it's not close. They have 4 teams capable of competing for a national title this yea, SEC has two.

I don't want to see a Big-10 team make the national title game because their conference is weak, similar to the last couple years..and Ohio St. is a point I made for the past couple seasons of the Big 10 being weak..but I am not saying the Big 10 is weak b/c Ohio St. lost last year.I am only trying to talk about the Big 10 this year. You brought up past seasons, so I talked about past seasons. Get over yourself. When measuring the strenght of conferences, I like how you only want to talk about the # of teams that can compete for a national title. There's more to conferences than that. I think an SEC schedule is consistently tougher. If you think the Big 12 is better, fine, it's certainly reasonable to say. What is not reasonable to say is that the Big 10 is as good or even close to as good as the SEC this season. You've clearly been grasping for straws here. You're just all upset because your team sucks so bad at a time when the rest of the conference sucks too, outside of one good team and one decent team.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

I don't want to see a Big-10 team make the national title game because their conference is weak, similar to the last couple years..and Ohio St. is a point I made for the past couple seasons of the Big 10 being weak..but I am not saying the Big 10 is weak b/c Ohio St. lost last year.I am only trying to talk about the Big 10 this year. You brought up past seasons, so I talked about past seasons. Get over yourself. When measuring the strenght of conferences, I like how you only want to talk about the # of teams that can compete for a national title. There's more to conferences than that. I think an SEC schedule is consistently tougher. If you think the Big 12 is better, fine, it's certainly reasonable to say. What is not reasonable to say is that the Big 10 is as good or even close to as good as the SEC this season. You've clearly been grasping for straws here. You're just all upset because your team sucks so bad at a time when the rest of the conference sucks too, outside of one good team and one decent team.

The Big Ten is weak so Penn State shouldn't be in the National Title game? That makes sense.. so, by default..until the Pac 10 is as strong as the SEC and/or Big 12, USC shouldn't play in the National Title game. Gotcha, Koop. Makes sense.

[BigDMcGee 3,352]

The Big Ten is weak so Penn State shouldn't be in the National Title game?

Maybe he's just tired of watching humiliating mismatches in the title game. I don't necessarily agree with the logic behind " the last few big ten schools have gotten smoked in the championship game, so Penn State will get smoked in the championship game", but I can sympathize with the sentiment, because I too don't want to see another boring, slow team get blown out in the NT game. I don't, however, think that Penn State should be punished for the sins of Ohio State. They appear, by all accounts, to be a great team. One of the main arguments for why the big ten sucks is this... they have inferior teams run the table, and play in NT games, and get murdered. Therefore, since the team that got smoked in the title game was undefeated in that conference, that conference must not be any good, because that team (allegedly) would have had 2-3 losses in the SEC/Big 12/whatever. And I think there's some truth to that, I think it's easier for a Big Ten team to remain undefeated than it is for an SEC team, in part because (I believe at least) the conference is weaker top to bottom, but also ( and more importantly) because there's no championship game. The championship game is important, because it (almost always) guarantee's playing one more ranked opponent, and also because you can't duck the other tough team in conference just because it's not on your schedule that year. I personally think that's a flaw in the Big Ten's structure, and I think it's completely BS that college football allows some conferences to have championships, but not others. Either all conferences should have championship games, or none should. But, because making changes in the NCAA is like herding cats, this won't happen.Also, people don't like the Big Ten stylistically, as their Powerhouse, national title contending schools don't exactly play the most exciting brand of football. That doesn't mean the big ten is worse, it just means people don't aethetically like them, and it biases people against it. I am personally hoping that RR's Michigan team becomes a national champion in the next 5 years, and can start ushering in change in the big ten, philosophically.

[Jadaki 0]

I don't want to see a Big-10 team make the national title game because their conference is weak, similar to the last couple years..and Ohio St. is a point I made for the past couple seasons of the Big 10 being weak..but I am not saying the Big 10 is weak b/c Ohio St. lost last year.I am only trying to talk about the Big 10 this year. You brought up past seasons, so I talked about past seasons. Get over yourself. When measuring the strenght of conferences, I like how you only want to talk about the # of teams that can compete for a national title. There's more to conferences than that. I think an SEC schedule is consistently tougher. If you think the Big 12 is better, fine, it's certainly reasonable to say. What is not reasonable to say is that the Big 10 is as good or even close to as good as the SEC this season. You've clearly been grasping for straws here. You're just all upset because your team sucks so bad at a time when the rest of the conference sucks too, outside of one good team and one decent team.

I'm not grasping for anything. I've presented facts that SEC fans do not want to face. You keep trying to customize the argument to suit you where it is convenient and in that post you just admitted using OSU's last two titles games as a bias against PSU which you denied 2 posts ago. Just because the SEC wants to have a one game playoff to determine a champion doesn't mean other conferences have to. They know the double jeopardy that's involved, and that's the risk they take by having that game. Would it be better if all conferences were either forced to have on or not, sure but that's not the way it is so stop being a baby about it. I understand you think you guys are going to beat LSU (no WB) and Auburn (no offense at all), but Florida scares you to death and you don't want to play them. Because lets face it there are only two teams that matter right now in the SEC, and that could change very quickly.I'm not mad about my team sucking, we lost 1/2 the starters to the NFL and have a new couch with a new system and players who don't necessarily fit in right now. RR will need a couple seasons to get the program back on track. I'm okay with that. I'll be here when NW fans want to brag about being ranked higher than us or when Mike Wilbon wants to trash the Wolverines on PTI.

[dms26 3]

Can't we just dig up the exact same conversations from last year, switch a few of the teams and repost?