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River Bluff-raise - Standard Or Reckless?


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This hand happened a while back and I was recently discussing it with some friends. They all seemed to think it was very reckless. I thought it was a pretty standard read-based scare-card bluff, so I thought I'd post it here.Live 1-2NL. Sitting $300. Villian is UTG, straightforward player, seems to be folding on the flop if he hits nothing, busted a donk with aces and is sitting ~$350. I feel my read on him is pretty strong. Does a bad job of hiding when he likes/dislikes cards. He's been at the table for 3 hours with me. My image had to have been fairly standard T-agg.Dealt Ad Qd. UTG limps, fold fold, Hero raises to $10 from MP (standard at the table). Folded back to UTG, who calls.Flop: 2h 7h Qc. UTG checks, Hero bets $20, UTG calls.Turn: Jh. UTG checks quickly. Hero bets $30, UTG reaches for chips immediately, seems to think about it, and calls. He seems very comfortable at this point.River Ah. Villian's shoulders drop, quite visibly. Hand goes over mouth. Takes forever to act. Eventually leads out for $20.Hero raises to $80. Thoughts?Obviously the validity of the play depends heavily on my read of the villian, so I've done my best to include minimal descriptions of what I observed.Not the most complicated hand, I know, but I'm still kind of building a baseline as far as when to take shots at pots at 1-2NL Live, and this doesn't seem to be an oft-discussed topic.

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If I were to raise in that spot, I would've raised much more. I don't mind the play. Seemed like he was making a blocking bet on the river.
I agree. I don't see what you are going to get him to fold for that price? I mean there is roughly $220 out there and it's only $60 for him to call. That's almost 4-1 on his money. If he has the Qh he has to call for that price. You might get a set with no heart to fold here, or MAYBE even a small heart. I think if you have a good read and don't put him on Qh or Kh then you have to raise more, otherwise I just call and pray he has JQ no heart. It's also hard for you to represent the Kh here - maybe KQ with Kh. I dunno....
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...straightforward player, seems to be folding on the flop if he hits nothing...Well obviously he's probably got something now that he's not folding. He's check/calling your play, trying to keep the pot small. And though his river bet does look like a "block bet," to me it actually looks like a "please call my sh*tty raise...it won't cost much..." Villian actually looks to be playing "small ball" style poker and though he may play like a donk, I personally believe he has you beat. A simple heart gives him a flush, which I'll lead to say he probably caught it on the turn or on the river (runner runner). Since you've fired 2 bullets, you might as well call his raise on that river to see what he has and use it for information later. It'd be sick if he play'd that only to have bottom pair. Yet I personally do this all the time (lose money at first but eventually winning it back), only to manipulate my opponents as time flies by. Make sure you can catch this play later on if he has the nuts.

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This hand happened a while back and I was recently discussing it with some friends. They all seemed to think it was very reckless. I thought it was a pretty standard read-based scare-card bluff, so I thought I'd post it here.Live 1-2NL. Sitting $300. Villian is UTG, straightforward player, seems to be folding on the flop if he hits nothing, busted a donk with aces and is sitting ~$350. I feel my read on him is pretty strong. Does a bad job of hiding when he likes/dislikes cards. He's been at the table for 3 hours with me. My image had to have been fairly standard T-agg.Dealt Ad Qd. UTG limps, fold fold, Hero raises to $10 from MP (standard at the table). Folded back to UTG, who calls.Flop: 2h 7h Qc. UTG checks, Hero bets $20, UTG calls.Turn: Jh. UTG checks quickly. Hero bets $30, UTG reaches for chips immediately, seems to think about it, and calls. He seems very comfortable at this point.River Ah. Villian's shoulders drop, quite visibly. Hand goes over mouth. Takes forever to act. Eventually leads out for $20.Hero raises to $80. Thoughts?Obviously the validity of the play depends heavily on my read of the villian, so I've done my best to include minimal descriptions of what I observed.Not the most complicated hand, I know, but I'm still kind of building a baseline as far as when to take shots at pots at 1-2NL Live, and this doesn't seem to be an oft-discussed topic.
With how you describe it I put the villian on QJ. I dont mind the river raise but I would have gone much more, he should call with just about anything there getting a good price. You could have just called his bet on the river though, I dont see anything wrong with just calling unless your worried about max value and even then its a scary board for two pair trying to get a lot of value.
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.. but I'm still kind of building a baseline as far as when to take shots at pots at 1-2NL Live, and this doesn't seem to be an oft-discussed topic.
$1/$2 live is showdown poker. There's a whole lotta callin goin on. I've been routinely called down with third pair, no kicker on a straighted AND flushed board by people who have never seen me before. Taking shots at pots in $1/$2 live is possible ... sometimes the table just parts like the Red Sea, and you'll know when you can be table captain. But usually, be prepared to show down the best hand in these situations.
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With how you describe it I put the villian on QJ. I dont mind the river raise but I would have gone much more, he should call with just about anything there getting a good price. You could have just called his bet on the river though, I dont see anything wrong with just calling unless your worried about max value and even then its a scary board for two pair trying to get a lot of value.
If this villian has any Q I'm 95%+ sure he doesn't c/c the flop. He either leads or CR's (probably leads). He had called raised pots from the blinds more than once, and leading out had meant top pair each time.I was pretty certain I was beat on the river, and felt strongly like he had made the flush on the turn. Any card but the Ah on the river and I fold to all but a very tiny bet.
$1/$2 live is showdown poker. There's a whole lotta callin goin on. I've been routinely called down with third pair, no kicker on a straighted AND flushed board by people who have never seen me before. Taking shots at pots in $1/$2 live is possible ... sometimes the table just parts like the Red Sea, and you'll know when you can be table captain. But usually, be prepared to show down the best hand in these situations.
While I do agree with this most of the time, and that's how I view a generic 1/2 player, would you agree that there is a substantial percentage of players at 1/2 that don't follow this pattern? This guy seemed to be an exception to the rule.I do agree with the expressed sentiment that I should have raised more, were I going to raise here. In my head I miscalculated the size of the pot. What would people say would be an appropriate raise to get, say, 5h 6h, off this pot?
It's also hard for you to represent the Kh here - maybe KQ with Kh. I dunno....
In my mind I was representing Qx Kh or Kx Kh.
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It can be a real bitch representing someone else's hand.
Hehe. True that. But my read was that he hated the river, which puts his river bet in the "block bet" camp as opposed to the "rinky-dink I-have-the-nuts-and-don't-think-you-have-anything-but-can't-fold-to-such-a-small-bet value bet" camp.
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I think I make it $100 or $120, looking confident but not "betya can't call THAT bet, azzhole." I agree that Villian, while likely having a flush given the flop c/c, doesn't HAVE to have that..he could've flopped a set or have QJ. Still, if he folds and shows QJ no heart, I don't get mad at myself for raising that amount.

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If he checked river would you have checked behind?
Good freaking question. I honestly have no idea. I think I probably would have bet at it, just because I was very comfortable in my read that the river Ah was a card he absolutely hated. The tiny blocking bet made it easier, though, and there's no way to say for sure.I suppose I can give results - not too much more to talk about in this hand. I raised to 80, and after some contemplation, he eventually folded 5h 6h face up. I patted myself on the back for a successful bluff. I showed it, as well, which set the guy on tilt a bit. I try not to be malicious at the poker table but I figure, I bluff so rarely at 1/2, better to have a hand where I was bluffing fresh in people's minds.
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