5/5 Nl Oop Bluff

[fckthis 0]

First time sitting at 5/5. Seemed like a soft table, except for villain, who is a thinking, aggressive player. Hero 400Villain 500~UTG+1 raises to 20, 3 callers to Hero in SB, calls with 88.5way flopJ25, 2 hearts.Hero checks, UTG+1 bets 20, Villain raises 60, Hero....My read-UTG+1 makes a very weak bet, Villain, raises 60 fairly quickly, and I see this as a steal.Ok, how much would raise here?

[tskillz187 0]

I'd raise 0 and fold.

[rdtedm 0]

I'd raise 0 and fold.

QFT

[mtdesmoines 2]

First time sitting at 5/5. Seemed like a soft table, except for villain, who is a thinking, aggressive player. Hero 400Villain 500~UTG+1 raises to 20, 3 callers to Hero in SB, calls with 88.5way flopJ25, 2 hearts.Hero checks, UTG+1 bets 20, Villain raises 60, Hero....My read-UTG+1 makes a very weak bet, Villain, raises 60 fairly quickly, and I see this as a steal.Ok, how much would raise here?

Bad read. Muck the eights.

[sabes99 0]

if you really think he's weak, then you could make it $180but i would probably just fold

[ghostlove 0]

1

[fckthis 0]

lol u guys play online too much. As solid of a read as him showing me the cards.

[Ganador 0]

First off, I dont play onlineSecondly, raise 0 and fold.What is the point of raising exactly, it is irrelevant that you have 88, which yes may be the best hand, but you might as well have nothing because you cannot call a reraise, and if you are called, there are about a million scare cards on the turn which will force you to shut down, as in any AKQ or heart, lets imagine he has AK of hearts, if you raise, he very well might call, and then what do you do??And yeah, the bet of 20 was weak, but youve never seen anyone bet 20 and then call a raise??? or have a set?? or call all there chips with AJ, you said the game was weak, ive played in weak games in canada (fallsveiw) and this action usually means 88 is no good, and even if it is, there is no reason to find out.

[ScreenDreams 0]

lol u guys play online too much. As solid of a read as him showing me the cards.

Then, make it 180 or push "big man"And if you had the preconceived notion to bluff at it, then bet the flop. Who says one needs to play like a robot and "check to the raiser every time" Some here might play online too much, yet according to this you play like a;1. Robot2. Have serious FPSOR3. AN IDIOT! ya know what, nah ur right your style of play is a Winner! Keep it up

[No_Neck 0]

You guys are being trolls, I raise 200.

[tskillz187 0]

Raising just isn't good, I'd much rather be bluffing with two overs than with 88, any raise is committing your stack to this pot. It's your first time playing the 5-5 you don't need to make moves. I see much more often betting $20 in this spot is strength not weakness, you already have one guy trying to steal the pot, it's tough to be the 2nd guy trying to pull the bluff, especially when you aren't deep stacked and are out of position. If you're deadset on raising make it $220 or shove, you aren't really deep enough to raise here and then fire again on the turn. If I REALLY wanted to bluff I'd call the $60 then fire hard on the turn.

[mtdesmoines 2]

lol u guys play online too much. As solid of a read as him showing me the cards.

OK, so if we're confident we're ahead, why all the talk about pushing him off? Flat call and let him do the betting for us and take all his chips.

[Zelphade 0]

if you feel certain its a steal then raising to 180 or so shoudl get you the pot..

[NoBBiR 0]

I'd raise 0 and fold.

I'd raise 0 and fold.

I'd raise 0 and fold.

I'd raise 0 and fold.

I'd raise 0 and fold.

I'd raise 0 and fold.

Troll this.If he is stealing, and you had some dreams of stealing it first, then he beat you to the punch. Next hand. Putting in a raise here is a spew 100% of the time. Even people who steal make a hand occasionally, so what if he has a hand and you raise? If you raise any amount you commit yourself, so what do you do if he shovels after you raise? Fold with 1/2+ of your stack in the pot? You can always find better spots.

[fckthis 0]

OK, so if we're confident we're ahead, why all the talk about pushing him off? Flat call and let him do the betting for us and take all his chips.

Not so much ahead, but confident a raise will take down this pot.

[David_Nicoson 1]

What position is the villain in? That would affect my perception of this raise a lot. When you say he's on the steal, do you think he's on total air? Or maybe a little something, e.g. gut-shot and 3-flush?Given that the villain is on air, I'd want to raise the minimum amount that gets UTG to fold with say AK or 99 and also discourages the villain to call to try to outplay us on the turn. Raise to 225.

[No_Neck 0]

Troll this.

i laughed

[Acid_Knight 2]

It's good that you're on the lookout for making move like this fkcths. It's important to be able to put in that 3rd bet, OOP, with "nothing."The problem here are the stack sizes. If your bet doesn't take down the pot on the flop, you simply cannot win the pot.Let's look at what will happen.After the UTG bet on the flop and he Villain's raise, there is $160 in the pot. If you make a decent raise, to say, $200, then you'll be offering the villain over 2.5-1 to see the next card. IF he calls, then we're screwed. We will have less than $200 behind and the pot will be $500 or something and we'll never make him fold.Also consider that the UTG player might have a real hand here, maybe even a set of jacks, and is just baiting people.I think the thought is good, but that in this situation, I would not be raising.

[fckthis 0]

It's good that you're on the lookout for making move like this fkcths. It's important to be able to put in that 3rd bet, OOP, with "nothing."The problem here are the stack sizes. If your bet doesn't take down the pot on the flop, you simply cannot win the pot.Let's look at what will happen.After the UTG bet on the flop and he Villain's raise, there is $160 in the pot. If you make a decent raise, to say, $200, then you'll be offering the villain over 2.5-1 to see the next card. IF he calls, then we're screwed. We will have less than $200 behind and the pot will be $500 or something and we'll never make him fold.Also consider that the UTG player might have a real hand here, maybe even a set of jacks, and is just baiting people.I think the thought is good, but that in this situation, I would not be raising.

exactly why I had to think it out before making the raise. I was certain that a 3bet here would be take this down. Looking back on stack sizes, I may have been able to wait for a little better spot, because UTG+1 was playing a little short and I wasn't deep.Appreciate the input.

[Keebs 0]

lol u guys play online too much. As solid of a read as him showing me the cards.

people gave there opinion, and if not going to listen to their opinion, why you ask in the first place? the majority is going with fold.

[No_Neck 0]

people gave there opinion, and if not going to listen to their opinion, why you ask in the first place? the majority is going with fold.

he didn't ask if you would bet, he asked how much would you bet?

[Lavitz 0]

Fold. Lol @ online comment. Folding is the most +EV play here regardless. If you have some awesome "read" the rest of us dont have then raise to 3X I guess but don't expect the general population to agree/understand because raising on this board with 88 is kinda stupid and spewish.

[CobaltBlue 662]

Folding is the most +EV play here regardless.

Don't you mean "least -EV"? =)

[Lavitz 0]

Don't you mean "least -EV"? =)

Haha true, since obviously folding isn't MAKING us money.

[fckthis 0]

Fold. Lol @ online comment. Folding is the most +EV play here regardless. If you have some awesome "read" the rest of us dont have then raise to 3X I guess but don't expect the general population to agree/understand because raising on this board with 88 is kinda stupid and spewish.

Here's what I intended by posting this hand.WE are going to BLUFF the hand. How much should we BLUFF? What is the best amount that gets us the most F.E for the least price?Forget I even have 88. You can put any two there. The read is solid. Anyways resultsI made it 200 and they both mucked. Im so bad.