bigbrennan 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Hi guys, been reading this forum for a while now...lets say there are certainly some characters about Anyway onto my hand, 2nd level of a deep stack tourney on stars. I had the fortune of doubling up very early on, flopping a set of 10's against a guy who could not lay down QQ on a K high board.The hand played out as follows:PokerStars Game #10420665366: Tournament #52339698, $20+$2 Hold'em No Limit - Level II (15/30) - 2007/06/13 - 18:47:43 (ET)Table '52339698 33' 9-max Seat #9 is the buttonSeat 1: cicatrix (5975 in chips) Seat 2: pooch1 (9445 in chips) Seat 3: leplusbeau (4095 in chips) Seat 4: DRACULAENUSA (7080 in chips) Seat 5: rrose13777 (5580 in chips) Seat 6: xxJimmyMacxx (9450 in chips) Seat 7: bigbren313 (12285 in chips) Seat 8: Mucky McMuck (2480 in chips) Seat 9: Baron Olsen (4045 in chips) cicatrix: posts small blind 15pooch1: posts big blind 30*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to bigbren313 [Ah 4h]leplusbeau: folds DRACULAENUSA: calls 30rrose13777: folds xxJimmyMacxx: folds bigbren313: calls 30Mucky McMuck: calls 30Baron Olsen: calls 30cicatrix: calls 15pooch1: raises 210 to 240DRACULAENUSA: folds bigbren313: calls 210Mucky McMuck: folds Baron Olsen: folds cicatrix: folds *** FLOP *** [Qc 9c Ks]pooch1: bets 150bigbren313: calls 150*** TURN *** [Qc 9c Ks] [8h]pooch1: bets 570bigbren313: raises 1680 to 2250pooch1: calls 1680*** RIVER *** [Qc 9c Ks 8h] [Ts]pooch1: checks bigbren313: bets 3870pooch1: folds bigbren313 collected 5400 from potbigbren313: doesn't show hand *** SUMMARY ***Total pot 5400 | Rake 0 Board [Qc 9c Ks 8h Ts]Seat 1: cicatrix (small blind) folded before FlopSeat 2: pooch1 (big blind) folded on the RiverSeat 3: leplusbeau folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 4: DRACULAENUSA folded before FlopSeat 5: rrose13777 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 6: xxJimmyMacxx folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 7: bigbren313 collected (5400)Seat 8: Mucky McMuck folded before FlopSeat 9: Baron Olsen (button) folded before FlopThe explanation behind the play is this, the way the pre flop raise took place, and the follow through bet and calls indicated to me the guy has a big pair / set. My call on the flop is because I feel I can read this guy, initially having a small PP. The flop can hold many draws, I could have AJ clubs etc... the river gives the real chance to bluff. Was I stupid? Or a well timed and calculated bluff?To top it off, he claimed to have AA. At this point I had to tell him I had A high, he didn't believe me so sent him a screen grab of the hand, since then he has tilted up and is on 1500 chips. Link to post Share on other sites
Canary3 1 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 HI, welcome to the forum. post hands in strategy and you will get serious responses from very very good players. I dont like the way you played the hand. fold preflop.... fold on the flop....fold on the turn. Link to post Share on other sites
Jdr999 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Nice brag post.Also, your explanation makes no sense:"The explanation behind the play is this, the way the pre flop raise took place, and the follow through bet and calls indicated to me the guy has a big pair/set.""My call on the flop is because I feel I can read this guy, initially having a small PP."They way you played it on the turn by raising makes you bluff the river, unless you just want to give up.Also could of make your raise on the turn smaller (2000), then make a 3,000 bet on the river. This way you save some chips if you are called. Link to post Share on other sites
Suited_Up 2 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 You're good enough to put him on a hand from one preflop raise?I doubt it.I don't like this play at all either. You'll go broke playing like this. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Level 2, don't get fancy play syndrome.You think you are figureing out their thought process, and they are watching their hotpockets in the microwave, wait for the noise to indicate it's their turn, see a pair and shove.Dont call with ace rag in middle positionDon't call with ace rag in late positionDont call with ace ragDon't EVER bluff at a co-ordinated board without at least a decent piece of it. The nuts plays exactly the same way as a draw against you.welcome to FCP/PokerstarsNow please don't post again until your post count is above 200.Thanks Link to post Share on other sites
bigbrennan 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Author Share Posted June 13, 2007 I stated initially a small PP as him calling the turn quickly changed my opinion on this I think the hand should of happened in the first place, but then the discussion is not as to why I even limped with Arag, but as to post flop play.Your certainly right about bet sizes, I risked more than is required on both streets. Thanks Link to post Share on other sites
kennyg1966 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 now now you should know the answer to this.If Gus makes the move it is an "amazing play"any other donk does it "what an idiot, what was he thinking" Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 If you are going to make this kind of play, show the bluff. Then tighten up. you'll get paid off on your big hands.But again at level 2, you are wasting all your good mojo, save it for level 4 and above. Link to post Share on other sites
Canary3 1 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 If you are going to make this kind of play, show the bluff. Then tighten up. you'll get paid off on your big hands.But again at level 2, you are wasting all your good mojo, save it for level 4 and above.so basically if he shows, people will start RESPECTING HIS RAISES? Link to post Share on other sites
mtdesmoines 3 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Now please don't post again until your post count is above 200.Can we get Bob to write this policy into the FCP forum software code? Let them all play in a "baby pool" or something until they get to 200? Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 so basically if he shows, people will start RESPECTING HIS RAISES?Poker in a nutshell Link to post Share on other sites
bigbrennan 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Author Share Posted June 13, 2007 Can we get Bob to write this policy into the FCP forum software code? Let them all play in a "baby pool" or something until they get to 200?Why is that? I have I done something naughty? Open to spankings..... Link to post Share on other sites
simo_8ball 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 I vote stupid move.Now to read the thread. Link to post Share on other sites
Jdr999 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 For those of you saying fold pre-flop, please consider this:1. You are in position2. The other player has a ton of chips relative to the blinds, and so do you.3. You are only calling a raise pre-flop for 2% of your stack. Implied odds are very good.4. It should be easy to play if you miss. (Fold flop if you miss)All other reasons for not playing this are vaild. But I'm not folding Axs with other players having very deep stacks.Other reason for not playing this hand is this bluff is going to fail much more than it will succeed.Last reason for not playing this is chips don't matter this early in a tournament. Might play too loose/aggressive/calling station if you get a hold of a ton of chips. Link to post Share on other sites
Snamuh 0 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Now please don't post again until your post count is above 200.QFT lol Link to post Share on other sites
Canary3 1 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 at a second glance at the chip stacks... a call preflop is not too bad. especially because his raise to 240 should mean a very big hand Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 These guys are trying to keep you stupid.Do not play Ace rag, from any position except the BB and then open farrel it. Search open farrel.Best advice you can get is to ignore the people here that tell you to do the wrong things, and listen to meAnd I was kidding about the post count, it should be 400 Link to post Share on other sites
donk4life 34 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 These guys are trying to keep you stupid.Do not play Ace rag, from any position except the BB and then open farrel it. Search open farrel.Best advice you can get is to ignore the people here that tell you to do the wrong things, and listen to meAnd I was kidding about the post count, it should be 400QFT, this guy has changed my life. Link to post Share on other sites
gsxraddict 0 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 It doesnt matter if you have 500 posts if most of your posts contain "QFT", which is the case with many posters. Quality posts count + date joined..... Link to post Share on other sites
gsxraddict 0 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 oh and seriously a donk move btw, good way to go busto.....pretty bad for your ev Link to post Share on other sites
Sonicpb 0 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Jesus Christ, you people and your f_cking post counts. How does replying to every thread with a short one liner make you smarter than other players?Let me be the first non-b@stard-@ss-b@stard to say: Welcome to the FCP forums.you're best bet is to move over to 2+2 if you want anything but assholes telling you that you are a donk.that said, you're a donk. Not really, but it seems dumb to be making moves like this so early. Link to post Share on other sites
bigbadbeat 0 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Ace rag should not be played for a raise in any tourney that doesnt have the word freeroll in it....at the 20+2 buyin level there are some seriously good players out there.....that bluff will get you broke in a hurry 95% of the time.If you want a serious disection of the hand, post in strat....u will get some good feedback, even if it is negative. u have to learn from your mistakes, and while this one didn't hurt there are are 95 other similar plays that are going leave u battered and bleeding after u smash your head through the monitor. Link to post Share on other sites
Suited_Up 2 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 you're best bet is to move over to 2+2 if you want anything but assholes telling you that you are a donk.You sure about that? Link to post Share on other sites
T-Dot-poker 0 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 I would have to agree with an earlier reply. That would have been a great bluff if you showed your cards and then tightened up and waited to trap someone that thought you were doing more of the same. As it turns out...it was merely a lucky play that you were not able to capitalize on that in the long run will lead you to going broke!! Link to post Share on other sites
ABS_Alex 0 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 ^^^QFT^^^HAHAHAHAHA Link to post Share on other sites
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