Lavitz
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Posts posted by Lavitz
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VERY read based. Does he like to float? Does he often fold to c-bets or not. Your hand does seem like a good PP but the problem is, will he stack off with 1010-QQ here? I'd rather have AK in this situation because if we get called with AK we likely have 6 outs but we're almost certainly down to 2 outs with 66. Being deep helps our bluff but it also means we're risking almost 200BB on this hand.
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And what if the flop comes 222? Or 652? Etc etc.... When you're taking a flop with 5 people or so with 99 you turn a healthy starting hand into a set mining hand because if you play 99 like the nuts on a rags board against 5 people you'll be going to bustoland quickly.If he just told the guy next to him and wasn't making it obvious to the whole table or being loud then I really think he wasn't trying to illuminate weakness. If he has been raising liberally like OP stated then I'd say 80% of the time he has a marginal hand. Now if he made it obvious that he was raising "because it was his button" then yea I'd say it might be a tell.it's been my personal experience that about roughly 95% of the time, if the guy on the button states that he's going to "raise simply because he's on the button" or "because 'the book' says to" then he's got a hand... at least 9s or better... or AK / AQsit seems they hollywood the whole "feign weakness when you're strong & vice versa" thing.. "oh my hand's garbage but i'm gonna raise cause i'm on the button"yeah... suuuuuuuuuuure buddy... two kings then, eh sir?personally i hate the push right here... i call & take a flop... if it comes Q A K you konw what to do ;] -
If villian has 1010-QQ then that river was bad for him as well. Pushing with that range on that river is so horrible. If they think raiser has AK-AQ then they should value bet or check to induce a bluff. Overbet pushing just turns a hand like 1010 into a bluff because when you get called you're smoked.Dump it and bet more on the flop with multiple villains involved next time.Meh. I'm going to rethink this a little. You never showed much desire for this pot. I'd hate to call and see an 89, but this is why we bet harder on the flop ... to define our hand to the opponent and ourselves. At the river, I can see JJ TT QQ, even A9, saying to himself, "the raiser's AK or AQ didn't hit. I must be good." A missed flush draw pushes on the scare card as well. ... This is more complicated than it seemed. -
Yea bets are a little too small. This is a very easy fold. You beat nothing and theres no real draws on the flop besides OESD which got there on turn.
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No. Standard. If board was rainbow you could bet something absurd like 1/4th pot or if it was heads up you might be able to check and hope villian will stab but with 3 people going to this flop the odds someone has a flush draw increases and the more people postflop, the less likely someone is gonna stab at it if you feign weakness for fear of the other player/s. Also, checking is pretty suspicious since you 3 bet. AK, AA, KK are all very possible holdings for you and I think the other players should know that. You're going to take this down a lot with a c-bet but checking and having something like the 5
peel off would be horrible for you, especially since both your K's are black. -
Yea, I'm not sure if i get away from QQx hand but if I decide I'm going with it I'm defintley calling this flop. There are no "scare" cards we have to worry about coming on the turn. We're WA/WB and if he's WB or bluffing, let him hang himself.Both of those big hands aren't that egregious. AA hand is very situational though I prefer a call most of the time then to reevaluate on the turn. I'd actually probably call then lead turn and see what happens and probably get stacked because I committed so much of myself. I think your raise PF was too small.I do the exact same thing when I am stuck and mad at myself. Open up my calling ranges and then get in sticky spots. It's not a horrible tilt like some people do, but it can be very costly if you are missing, and/or if you flop tpgk. -
If we go heads up with 99 to a flop with plenty of people then we're playing mainly for set value, no?First, TAG players won't open half of the pots at the table, unless he was getting hit with the deck harder than you were.I don't mind the push, but it's really overkill. His stack would be helpful, but i think that this is a mistake. He's not likely to call you with a worse hand, so you're really turning your 99 into a bluff here. I think that I call and make some good decisions after the flop since there are already a lot of people in. -
Haven't read replies but the fact he's seeing 41% of hands makes him pretty loose/bad. Add on to this the fact he only raises 5% of his hands means that if we 3 bet him preflop we can safely say hes probably got a legitimate hand and he will call.As played, push flop when he reraises. There are so many draws and such that he probably has a big enough piece of the board to get it all in right then and there.
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I like it. His range, like you said, is massive. If he has been raising frequently then this is great. Even if he only folds half the time it's profitable because when he does call you're usually a coinflip. Although sometimes you'll be dominated (to 1010+), sometimes you'll be dominating (if he raises small PPs and decides to call). With all the limp/callers money in the pot on top of this and the fact he'll lay down 1010-JJ on occasion makes this +EV.
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I never said he didn't have nuts. I think we're beat in most cases and I stated it earlier I believe. However, we don't know this until he check/raises. Up until this point his line doesnt mean monster it can mean something like 2nd pair with straight draw, underpair or another 8. I just think bet/fold is a better line then check because check/calling twice on flop and turn doesn't mean nuts. We should be betting river always. All 3 of your points concern me believing we should BET/CALL river when I said a BET/FOLD would probably be better. I just think a CHECK is so pathetically tight/weak and we are most certainly missing value. Every time a nit checks trips with top kicker on this river baby Jesus cries.If this hand was in a vacuum, yes. 3 points here:1. ) You have to remember the original poster showed strength on the flop, turn, and river. He got check-raised like he was an empty chair, despite OP's continual show of strength. 2.) check-call, check-call, check-raise.. Children, look on page 38 of your textbook under the heading of "How to unimaginatively play the nuts"....3.) The pocket-pairs everyone seems to be ready to "pick off" on the river are going to test a PP on the flop, or the turn. They aren't going to suddenly test the strength of their hand for all their chips on the river.That said, if you take 50 case scenarios, you make that river call about 45 times. If a LAG plays a hand that strangely, and you keep wondering "does he have the nuts?", and you get that nagging sensation in your head that he's followed a slow-play manifesto as you go over how the hand has been played, then please, check the river. If everyone plays the math, every player on planet earth breaks even. It's these special cases where you get a little ahead of the curve. If I sound like I'm making a tournament decision in a cash game here, then yeah, I guess I am. If I want to be a river-calling station, I'd switch to limit. *I* don't put my buy-in on the line to get a little more value here with the vibes he gives me. -
Using this philosophy of not betting trips with TK on the river is going to cost you money. You'll get looked up a lot here, even MORE so with a lower pair now that a second eight appeared on the river. Do you see why?Also, bet/fold is an acceptable line to take in some situations. It is arguable if it is better then bet/call here but I think betting>>>>checking. You're missing serious value checking this river.My bad, had it right the first two times and got my wires crossed on that last post...I still say you check behind him on that river, we are spared this discussion. Value betting into a situation where you have been check-called twice by a laggy player leads us to the next obvious question: If we have him beat, are we getting more money out of him? How many times out of 10 can we pick off bluff river shoves to come out ahead in the long run? Maybe my wiring is wrong. Maybe I am overly-cautious at the tables. But he does have to call a bet on the river for it to be worth it: You are not betting with the possibility of making him fold a better hand. If your read tells you that your hand is better, then bet and know you are going to call off all your money in case he's bluffing or overplaying a weaker hand. If you aren't sure, then just check and showdown. That simple. Heck, you might as well just shove the river, because you seem convinced you have to call his AI anyways.You opponent is only paying you off with the case eight, if he a. ) *has* the case eight and he b. ) has *not* paired his kicker. I don't even factor a pocket pair higher than eights into this discussion, because he's most likely going to "test" 99 and up on that flop to make you pay for drawing to anything that beats him. So in summary: I'm sorry he had the nuts and I don't like your river bet. I'm certainly not the poker guru many of our FCP peers are, but I don't shove my chips front and center to find out why the villian has played the hand so strangely when I can check and get the same informaton. -
With him at the table it almost became that. People began doing crazy things just to isloate him. He began min raising every hand so people began limp/raising or limp/pushing with hands like A10 and AJ. It was really amazing how this guy changed the table dynamics single handedly.The 30BB cap at 5-10NL sounds gross as is.and him being up that much is proof that he's nothing but luck. i'm surprised there isnt 6 players to every flop -
This is just a cooler. It happens. We want to play a hand like 55 here with plenty of action preflop because that just means we go to a flop with more money in the pot against people who are goin to have trouble folding their TPTK or overpairs if we hit our set.Also, I would argue online doesn't play looser then live and that the more dry a board is, the more obvious it is that villian has set. If board was drawy then we can put him on a wider range of hands, including some we are ahead of. With a dry board, when people get involved it almost always means a powerful made hand. Therefore we should be able to get away from hands easier on a dry board. Not that we are ever getting away here.I guess I'm Mr. UberTight here but I've got a tough time finding a way to call 55 with a 1-hole limper, a raise from mid, and a caller to boot. I know online plays looser than live but as far as I'm concerned that's only more reason to tighten up and wait to get some traps set. On that extremely dry board I agree it's impossible to get away from bottom set, but should you have been there in the first place? Like ElToasto said, what were you hoping for with that call?I also find it curious that you provided your reads on every other player in the pot EXCEPT the one player you were heads-up against. -
I know online poker is rigged and everything but if it WASN'T then our edge against flush draws would be higher then 50 percent.Also, he never has AA here. Almost...like......never ever. Villian is straightforward TAG it seems. This is almost always a set or a flush draw.Any clue what types of hands he check raises the flop with? Or types of hands he re raises the flop with? Any clue what type of hands he calls raises with out of the bb? Would he smooth call a pre flop raise with a high pocket pair?You're probably just going to have to go by feel here and you're going to be wrong a good portion of the time. Against most flush draws you're a coin flip and about a 9-1 dog against a set. Hrmm, You are UTG raiser and the flop reraise of the check raise screams you have aces. Yet he still pushes... The more I think about it the more I say fold. Reason being, you are UTG raiser. In his mind, your re raise of his check raise puts you at worst on Ad Kd. We know he doesn't have the nut flush draw so any other flush draw has to be worried you may have the nut flush draw. They'd probably call the 45 raise instead of pushing. The check raise to protect a set makes a lot of sense. Any better pocket pair than 10's would of re raised pre flop. So I say it's either a set or an AA split. I think you will lose more times than it would be worth to call here. You know what. I wouldn't fault either action. Personally, I'd run out of time trying to think about it and have to do a rash decision anyways. We've all made worse calls than this... -
Ouch. He could be pulling this with a hand like TP/flush draw or 89dd. A set is also very likely. I really think this is rarely ever JJ unless he is known not to 3 bet preflop hands like that. We also have Ad which helps if we decide to push. This is very close and I think he turns over a set a LOT. We're usually barely ahead or way behind but there is a lot in the pot.
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Yea, but I mentioned only about half of my logged hands with him were from current session so I'm assuming the other 700 hands or so were normal 6 handed.You are playing very short-handed though. Those numbers aren't outrageous for a LAG player at a 3-5 person table. -
Nice first post. I agree that we should be c betting this flop almost always. It has numerous draws.C-bets depend on villians also. Plenty of aggro villians love reraising 1/3 or 1/2 pot c-bets, interpreting them for weakness, so keep that in mind and adjust accordingly.I just wanted to give my thoughts on the c bet size. I think your thinking about it the wrong way. Instead of always making your c bets either 75% or 50% of the pot, make your c bet size based on the flop. Not your hand but the flop. If the flop comes something like 10h9h3s you should c bet 2/3 to the whole pot. This flop is very drawy so you need to bet more to discourage a call. If your default c bet is 50% of the pot then when you have a AA on this flop you would have to bet 50% of the pot allowing draws to call. But if you c bet larger on flops like this you can also protect your big hands. On the other hand if the flop is Ac2s8d you dont need to cbet as much because there is not much that will call you. So make you flop bets based on the flop, not by some default amount. Anyone else agree? Thoughts, coments, critizisim? -
Sorry but if you're playing 70 percent of hands and your opponents adjust accordingly, you will not be a winner in the long run no matter how good your postflop play is.Also, his postflop play isn't great, just a bit unpredictable. He's back at my table now. On a brighter note, I actually won a few hands against him and I will probably have acquired somewhere in the neighborhood of 7,000 FTP points today alone by the time I am done playing....It shows how important it is to be patient. Against super maniacs though, I like to see as many cheap flops as possible. Maniacs suck post flop. If the dude plays well after the flop, then he's not a donk; he's just a sick cash game player. Don't judge a man's ability on his preflop play...ps. since the new server has come up, I've noticed a HUGE increase in the number of interesting and relevant-to-poker strategy posts. Anyone else notice this? -
I've seen "that guy" plenty of times. I've just never seen someone avoid going broke playing in such a manner for such a long time. Anyone playing at those numbers usually goes broke within 100 hands or so. Instead, this guy not just profitted but he THRIVED. 60BB/100 over 1500 hands at those numbers is astounding. Such a huge heater.We've all seen "that guy." I don't know what you can do about it, other than get your money in good against them. I don't know about you, but sometimes I don't find that spot. Besides, the only player we should worry about it ourselves. Outplay whoever is in front of us in each hand and go from there. -
I am at the end of a 9 hour session. I would've ended hours ago if not for one table (5/10NL CAP) in which there is a huge fish. I've been playing shorthanded (anywhere from 5-3 people) with him for hours. I have about 1,400 hands with him now (half from this session alone) and he is running at an incredibly donkish 70/32/3. The best part? Over 1,400 hands he is 50.79BB/100 winner and is up $4,825 dollars. This isn't simply about 5 buy ins . It is more like 15 because CAP means the max you can invest on a hand is 30BB (300 dollars). I cant crack him though and am about breakeven against him. He has gotten incredibly lucky and plays any two cards. He is very aggressive but always seems to look people up at the right times. I am having a hard time believing he is up so much over 1,400 hands. I know this isnt a big sample but still, aren't these the type of players who crash and burn within minutes? I just want to know how long can he keep racking up the money before he'll finally crumble. Anyone run into a player like this?
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That is truly stupid. I would love to play in 6 max games where 4 people saw a flop on a consistent basis.The restriction I don't get is that four players have to see the flop. I've never heard of that for any jackpot qualifier. Not many tables have 40% of players seeing flops, and at 6max, I can't imagine that ever happening. -
Is this a value shove? I'm confused. I dont think 10J is ever calling us and well I do think a flush draw might call, I think villian's passiveness means he would probably check a flush draw behind. So this is usually a better jack or pocket 7s i think. If villian calls down light and floats then I like it because we get value from all the times he has air/J10,J9/flush draw.With no reads this is questionable.
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Haven't read any replies but this is a full house or straight a LOT. This is almost never pure air and the flop was not that drawy and he wouldn't pull this with a hand like 56 which flopped a draw with a pair because he would be trying to get to river cheaply. Since there is a decent amount of money I guess we call and hope he overplayed an 8. If stacks were the same and the game was 2/4NL or 3/6NL I think this is a fold, but people do whacky things at low limits so I can see a worse 8 doing this enough....
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We don't expect to get called and be ahead here. When we usually are called in this situation we are either dominated in most cases or a coinflip. Pushing 100BB over 6BB raise is usually pretty bad.so if you think he'll call with the worst hand, its bad? Honest question.
Kk Nl50
in No Limit Texas Hold'em Cash Games
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